That modern look....

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What member does this Dart belong to?
I'd like to get some specs. This is the direction I'm headed in terms of wheel size.

I hate it when a post is the last one on a page. I always seem to miss them. I PM'd the owner and this is what he told me.



6-5/8" backspacing on 18 x 8 on the front with a RMS suspension. I have a 5-1/2 backspacing on 20 x 9.5 on the rear with a street lynx RMS rear suspension on a cut 8/3/4 inch rear. No tubs

He also said the front RMS suspension is 2" wider then stock. The rear was shortened 2". I don't know if that is per side or total width.
 
There is a lot of fact and difference in opinion here. The overall looks between the two are extremely subjective so as far as that goes, we can agree to disagree. I really have a lot of respect for both styles of wheel choices. The only thing I don't like are super chrome flashy wheels. As much as black or gunmetal with a chrome lip was cool a few years ago, I am no longer a fan of this style. That's just me.

As far as the performance aspect of running a larger wheel and lower profile tires, this is where technology has taken us and I absolutely love it! You combine that with new suspension technology and now you have a car that you can actually take a around a corner at a reasonable speed. I am used to having cars that handle like their on rails....why wouldn't I want that for my Dart?

So all of that said, I will be running my stock 15" Rally wheels and Hankook tires for the time being. It takes a very long time for me to find appropriate wheels for any of my cars because It is a very personal choice that takes a lot of thought and research! I will also take that time to look at suspension options as well.
 
14's - 15's are OK if your going for that nostalgic look....other than that they are tired...that look is over 40 yrs old, there is hardly any styles to pick from, no way the 15's can handle the turns like a 17 or 18. If they could you would still see them on production cars.

I like progression and new and better technology....

True but you're also talking handling. In the drag race world 15's are still pretty prevalent. However even there drag radial cars are often going up in rim size and it would be tough dispute that they work.

I'd venture to say that guys who are sticking with mostly stock suspension components are also sticking to 14 and 15 inch wheels, because it has to take a ton of money to make those 17's and bigger work.

Why?

There's also something to be said for the size of the factory wheel opening in relation to the size of the wheel and tire. Our older rides were never designed with 17's in mind. The proportions just look out of whack.

Have you ever compared the size of a modern passenger car wheel opening to that of our cars? I have. Bet the results would surprise you...

You can actualy keep the profile of the sidewalls the same as long as you don't get crazy with rim height. 15x26 = 17x27..etc.

Sometimes too much is too much.

Looks are like flavors. They aren't all for everyone. And looks can be done tastefully and quite distastfully.
 
I though we were discussing the modern look so I didn't include drag racing specific cars just pro touring style.

The style changed and there are many more manufacturers of larger diameter wheels now. The possibilities are endless and so we all can have what we want.

No biggie...If it's your own choice. I don't dislike smaller wheels and old style rims I just like what I have on my ride and I know they handle way better than my old 15's.
 
The big wheels are starting to grow on me. I also like some of the more modern wheels as shown on the nicely done autox Demon, I think that car is bad ***. The 68 rag top Dart is a very cool cruiser too and I like those wheels as well but tend to agree the tire sidewall on the rear is a little out of per portion with the fronts, but man what a sweet looking car. Both cars mentioned above look to have expensive rims, probably in the neighborhood of $800 or more for each wheel.

This one below is just for looks and makes a nice little cruiser on more classic looking 18" wheel.
 

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Im into not just a modern look but a modern performer too. I have a pet peeve though, PROPORTION! Some people run to tiny of a front tire just out of poor math in most cases. Another mis-proportion I cant stand is like the Dart ragtop in the first post when using the 18 front 20 rear wheel deal is look how much sidewall is on the front tires compared to the rear. TO me that looks just wrong. It ruins the car from a proportional stand point visually IMO. The car is killer but the guy didnt cross his I's and dot his T's with size selection. Case in point is look at a 2009 Viper from the side. Those have,IIRC 18x11 front wheels and 19x13 rear wheels, the tires are 295/30/18 fr. and 345/30/19 rr. The thing has just right rake and just right proportions. This can also be applied to old Mopes too if people are being careful and paying attention, not just putting on big wheels for the sake of big wheels and then saying "my car is a pro touring car".


X2!!

I couldn't agree more. I haven't seen what your setup is. I really like your car.
 
I've only seen the front end of mustang GT's and that's through my rear view mirror.....fading into the distance.

14's - 15's are OK if your going for that nostalgic look....other than that they are tired...that look is over 40 yrs old, there is hardly any styles to pick from, no way the 15's can handle the turns like a 17 or 18. If they could you would still see them on production cars.

I like progression and new and better technology....

BLING BLING BLING BLING you win the website misinformation award of the week.
please hit the Alt-F4 button to get your award.

i know i know "modern technology" stuff makes me moist too. but please dont try to combine bling with performance.

"no way the 15's can handle the turns like a 17 or 18."
what you been smokin?

Nascar 15"
Formula 1 13"

a lot of autocross guys will put smaller wheels on to get better track times. some will downgrade to 15" or smaller if they can from larger wheels to cut the unsprung weight and lower the car. the limiting factor on how small they can go is usually their brakes.

it's cool if you like the look. but dont be telling people wrong stuff about performance.

some of the fastest F1 cars are now running 240mph some working toward 260mph
on THIRTEEN inch wheels

The fastest circuit is Spa and here they can reach this top speed, and maintain it on the striaghts, the fastest corner is also at Spa, this is Le Ardennes and driver's take the corner at 203mph.
 
I have a pet peeve though, PROPORTION! Some people run to tiny of a front tire just out of poor math in most cases. Another mis-proportion I cant stand is like the Dart ragtop in the first post when using the 18 front 20 rear wheel deal is look how much sidewall is on the front tires compared to the rear. TO me that looks just wrong. It ruins the car from a proportional stand point visually IMO. The car is killer but the guy didnt cross his I's and dot his T's with size selection.

This has been quoted a few times so I thought I would address it. The difference in sidewall height in that picture is an illusion. The fronts are a 225-40-18 and the rears are a 285-30-20. The fronts have an overall height of right around 25"...the rears have a height of 27". They both should have roughly the same sidewall height.
 
BLING BLING BLING BLING you win the website misinformation award of the week.
please hit the Alt-F4 button to get your award.

i know i know "modern technology" stuff makes me moist too. but please dont try to combine bling with performance.

"no way the 15's can handle the turns like a 17 or 18."
what you been smokin?

Nascar 15"
Formula 1 13"

a lot of autocross guys will put smaller wheels on to get better track times. some will downgrade to 15" or smaller if they can from larger wheels to cut the unsprung weight and lower the car. the limiting factor on how small they can go is usually their brakes.

it's cool if you like the look. but dont be telling people wrong stuff about performance.

some of the fastest F1 cars are now running 240mph some working toward 260mph
on THIRTEEN inch wheels

The fastest circuit is Spa and here they can reach this top speed, and maintain it on the striaghts, the fastest corner is also at Spa, this is Le Ardennes and driver's take the corner at 203mph.

So its OK for you to mislead them but not me?

NASCAR - 12" wide tires and wheels that would have a hard time fitting on an A body cuda without serious modification....kinda like a NASCAR type mods

Formula one....see above except 12" front and 17" wide rear tires.

Autocross....the most popular size as mentioned in many forums is a 17" wheel. As you mentioned it's due to several factors but a major one is need for big brakes. I know that some run 15" but a lot do it for the stock classes. I don't know everything there is to know about anything but I know how to do my homework.

Lastly we cant purchase the tires those guys use ($1500 a set for NASCAR tires that wear out in a couple hundred miles) unless you want to sell the car they go on so that's the last of the poor comparisons.

Rant off....back to the discussion
 
pretty much everything looks good in green with black rims. DD:

IMG_1403732881497_zps47892e89.jpg


I want to do black bullitts on my barracuda.
 
pretty much everything looks good in green with black rims. DD:



I want to do black bullitts on my barracuda.
So it would seem.

Seen this debate before. Jack it up, slam it, or rake it.

Back to the OP, I like the color and body work on the Demon. I'm a fan of filling up the wheel well. However, I am not a fan of different size wheels on a car, be it Plymouth or Porsche.

Reasons:

  1. Larger rear diameter tires transfer weight forward making the car plow like a tractor.
  2. Different size tires make carrying a spare problematic. Different diameter tires on the rear can damage a locking differential.
  3. Larger diameter rear tires act like a rear gear change. Depending on how much change there is it can be like going from a 3.55:1 to a 3.23:1.
  4. While a taller wider tire widens the contact patch (good) it also shortens it (bad). This trades decreased acceleration and braking capability for increased cornering capability.
I own a 2014 Dart SXT Rallye that has 225/45-17 tires. Within the first week of ownership, I had to replace the right front tire because the sidewall was cut. This happened while making a left turn at an intersection. The light turned yellow as I entered the intersection, I accelerated moderately to clear the intersection and hit a pot hole which caused the damage to the tire. The tire could not be repaired.
 
BLING BLING BLING BLING you win the website misinformation award of the week.
please hit the Alt-F4 button to get your award.
i know i know "modern technology" stuff makes me moist too. but please dont try to combine bling with performance.
"no way the 15's can handle the turns like a 17 or 18."
what you been smokin?
Nascar 15"
Formula 1 13"
a lot of autocross guys will put smaller wheels on to get better track times. some will downgrade to 15" or smaller if they can from larger wheels to cut the unsprung weight and lower the car. the limiting factor on how small they can go is usually their brakes.
it's cool if you like the look. but dont be telling people wrong stuff about performance.
some of the fastest F1 cars are now running 240mph some working toward 260mph
on THIRTEEN inch wheels
The fastest circuit is Spa and here they can reach this top speed, and maintain it on the striaghts, the fastest corner is also at Spa, this is Le Ardennes and driver's take the corner at 203mph.

Sorry, but almost EVERYTHING but the tire size regarding F1 in those comments is completely misleading. :violent1:

There is one, and only one, reason that F1 still uses 13" rims. They're required to by the F1 rulebook. And the rule on tire size has not changed in over 20 years. That's it. Just rules. It has nothing to do with tire technology at all.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/09/27/should-f1-switch-to-18-inch-wheel-rims/

In fact, should the tire manufacturer supplying F1 change from Pirelli in the future, there's a good chance the tire size will change as well. Michelin has been pushing for an 18" F1 tire for years. Which makes me believe that they already have a tire that will perform at least as well, if not better, than the current 13" offerings. They're just being hamstrung by the rules, and possibly the politics of F1. Not tire technology.

It's also completely misleading to involve any kind of race tires in these conversations to begin with. F1 has all of its tires supplied directly by the tire manufacturer. They are purpose built with their sole function to be F1 tires. Same with NASCAR.

You can't get that on the street. You can't use that on the street. Instead, you need to use street legal tires that are supplied to the public. If you compare 15" street tires to 17/18 street tires, you will see a VAST difference in the selection of appropriate tire sizes, and an even greater difference in the available compounds and tread designs. The result is a BIG difference in performance. If you want to run a 275 wide tire on a 15" rim on the street, you're stuck with BFG T/A's, which are hockey pucks designed almost 40 years ago, or maybe an MT or Cooper Cobra :puke:. I'm not talking about drag radials either. If you want to run a 275 on the FRONT of your car, you need like a 275/50/15. Good luck finding much of anything in that size. If you run race tires on the track, its an entirely different conversation, you have some options in sizes that will actually fit our cars. But, since even most streetcar classes require street legal tires, 17/18" tires, and their superior selection and compound makeup, are the better choice.

Throwing in F1 and NASCAR is just comparing apples and oranges. Those tires have almost as much in common with a donut as they do with a mass produced street legal tire.
 
Heres my 71' with 18"s front to back. I actually had been messing with the idea of going to a 20" in the rear for an offset. Even ordered a 20" rim for the new set I was thinking about for test fitting. But once I got it on the car I didnt like it. I was hard to visualize it looking right to go forward with it. So I sent it back. I now have decided to go with big and littles. A 15" with the tallest/widest tire I can get to fit out back and 17x4.5 up front. going for the meaty look.
 

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I still don't like 'em.
I'm not saying they aren't good for handling etc., but i like the old school drag racer wannabe look that i have on my car with the Super Stock springs and 15'' on the back and 14'' on the front.
My car doesn't handle worth a ****, but i love the stance and straight line 1/4 mile performance.
It's what you grew up with i guess.
If i wanted a car that handled great etc, i would just buy a new Challenger or Mustang and be done with it.
 
I prefer old school but like the big cragers or bullit wheels from the mustangs if I were to go that direction
 
I have to wonder if the year of birth has so much to do with what we like!!????
I run 14 and 15 on my old early A's, and like he said, tire selection in those dia is pretty poor. to say the least..... if I has to go to the super low profile 18 in stuff, I will just find a buyer for my herd...... save ya money younger generation!! LOL
 
I have to wonder if the year of birth has so much to do with what we like!!????

That has a lot to do with it. Personally, I can't stand the "day 2" look. I like the big wheels as well as factory stock though. There is room for everyone in this hobby.
 
I have to admit a few of the cars pictured looked good. Duster body style anyway.
Not my thing on the boxier dart or barracuda. The look has the familiarity to me of the low rider cheech and chong era. Those cars ride were destroyed for no other reason than to make them look cool. No performance reasoning behind the modifications.
I know the Joe dirt look also destroyed the ride or balance of our cars but its foundation
came from the drag strip. Performance based mods.
The closest I could ever bring myself personally to doing something along the lines of these type builds to a old Mopar would be a autocross or old trans am racer.
I don't care for any of the new cars made enough to try and turn my old cars into one of them. You asked. But I will say I do appreciate fine workmanship done by a guy who wants
to make his car better no matter the style. Really the whole point is to make yourself happy.
I feel old now.
 
You cant deny that pretty much any car looks better slammed.....from a modern build prospective anyway. No dis to the original set up......just a fresh take that is current-period correct.

I love the ability to have it slammed when I'm parked and have it sit with a nice rake when I'm driving.

You've probably seen it before but here are a couple of my fat fish.

Mop


momoparman: I love your car! I've seen it before in a few threads. Awesome look.

I like the newer look, I have a 73' duster that I want to do a few things to and get as close to that look as possible. But nothing I can't put back to stock. I don't want to go hacking it all up just yet. :axe: The green on black is my favorite too.
 
I love the look if the rest of the car matches up but I wouldn't stick 18-20s on a plain tan granny valiant with a slant.
 
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