Transmission!!???!!! HELP!!!

Manual Transmission & Clutch Discussions

  1. Rover/Scout

    Rover/Scout Member

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    Guys I am asking for help to get a proper working trans in my 67" Valiant so I can start having some Relief from all this craziness. I have a line on a trans but can not identify! I being told it is a 3 speed with over drive that will bolt up to my bell housing. My Valiant has got the three on the tree with the factory 6 cylinder. I am going to try to upload the couple of photos I have and the casting number on the passenger side is C 95039 U. Also I'm being told it is out of an A100 van if this helps. I HATE 2020!!!! 3spd trans 1.jpg 3spd trans 2.jpg And if the last photo helps, it is the one with the flange that bolts to the end.

    3spd trans 3.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
  2. Murray

    Murray FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    Yes, 4-sp. 1964 and earlier.
     
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    • xLURKxDOGx

      xLURKxDOGx "An angel fat, at satan's feast" FABO Gold Member

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      64/65 transmission.

      Jake
       
    • 67Dart273

      67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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      Whatever that is is not A100 nor is it an overdrive. Chrysler did not make an OD 4 speed with a drive flange as shown. That is an A833 4 speed, and the photo is hard to deal with but it does look like an A body. You will need a 4 speed "floor hump" to get that to fit as well as a proper shifter. It will NOT hook to your column shifter.

      What is wrong with the current 3 speed?

      On a side note, what "we" used to call "an overdrive" was a 3 speed box with overdrive WHICH HAS an electrical solenoid sticking out the side. In the mid 70s Chrysler began modifying A833 4 speeds to make the 4th gear shifter position an overdrive gear. This is actually 3rd gear, but the shift lever was turned upside down, so as you shifted the knob 1-2-3-4, the transmission was actually shifting 1-2-4-3. Third gear was replaced with the OD gear. They do not exist in the older "flange drive" box like you show here
       
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      • Rover/Scout

        Rover/Scout Member

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        The current trans in my Valiant grinds weather up shifting or down. I want to put a three spd or four spd so I can start driving it.
         
      • harrisonm

        harrisonm Well-Known Member

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        Have you considered having the 3 speed rebuilt? 3 speeds are much cheaper to rebuild than 4 speeds. If you swap to a 4 speed, there will be a lot of additional expenses. Plus, if you buy a correct, "good" used transmission that fits perfect, how mad are you going to be if it starts grinding? I think the easiest AND FASTEST way to start enjoying your car is to have your current transmission rebuilt. Have you considered tearing into it yourself? When I converted my car from an automatic to a 4 speed, the used transmission made noise going into 3rd. I rebuilt it myself. It took a while, but it was pretty straight forward. 3 speeds have way fewer parts, synchronizers and gears. I bet you can do it.
         
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        • RustyRatRod

          RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla

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          The three and four speed transmissions do not share a common bolt pattern to the bellhousing. The two patterns are totally different. If it grinds trying to up or down shift, the first thing I would do is inspect to see that the clutch is disengaging all the way. If the clutch is worn out, it will not disengage properly and will cause grinding while trying to engage the transmission in a gear. Try adjusting the free travel. That's the amount the clutch pedal moves down before you can feel it engage the pressure plate. Simply depress the pedal with your hand slowly and you can feel when it begins to engage. There should be one inch of free travel. No more. If it has a good bit more, try adjusting the free travel correctly and see what happens then. Unless they've been abused, these transmissions....even the light duty ones are pretty rugged. I would try adjustment first. Just because it grinds, doesn't mean it's bad.
           
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          • Alaskan_TA

            Alaskan_TA Well-Known Member

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            The older A-903 3 speeds did not have syncros.

            The newer (1970 up) A-230 3 speed does and they are wonderful transmissions.
             
          • 694spd

            694spd Well-Known Member

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            1960–1972 Chrysler A903 — 3-speed manual for 6-cyl and low power V8s.
            1st gear had no synchro ring, but the 2nd and 3rd gears had synchro rings.
             
          • 67Dart273

            67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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            Some of us had an infamous argument about this before. The 903 did not have FIRST GEAR syncro. And I'll say it......anyone who cannot drive a non synchro 1st gear 3 speed needs to turn in their cards.........their man card, and their Mopar card. And maybe their Chevy card LOLOL
             
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            • mbaird

              mbaird mbaird

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              Never driven one . What is the propper way to drive a non syncro trany?
               
            • DrCharles

              DrCharles Well-Known Member

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              Double-clutch when downshifting to 1st.
              I've done it while driving someone else's Duster up a steep parking garage, and they were amazed I didn't have to stop before engaging 1st :D
               
            • 67Dart273

              67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              They are not a "non synchro tranny." A "non synchro tranny" or "crash box" or "spur gear" before the advent of special "slick shift" or "face plated" race boxes was such things as the old Ford gearboxes. They were straight cut gears, "spur gears" and none of the gears was synchronized. Even today, some heavy truck boxes are such. In this case you had to learn to double clutch and match speed/ RPM between gears so they would mesh up or down, with little "crash."

              The older 2 speeds, Mopar or GM / what, what we are referring to here, were not synchro into FIRST. But usually, you only shift into first (mostly) when stopped. I did, and anyone can, learn to "double clutch" into 1st at a roll, such as when approaching a stop sign
               
            • 67Dart273

              67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              !!!THIS!!! This right here^^
               
            • halfafish

              halfafish Damn those rabbits, and their holes! FABO Gold Member

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              The trick is timing a downshift into 1st gear. With a synchro trans, you can shift from one gear to another pretty much as you please. The first gear on an A-903 (which can be ID'ed with a flat bolt-on top plate) must be coordinated between ground speed, gear speed, and engine speed. Double clutching on your downshifts will help, as well as performing this at lower speeds. It's a trial-and-error thing but even though I can do it, it's the reason I'm going to swap out my 903 for a 230 and figure out the linkages to get it to work with my column shift. Non-synchro is a PITA in my opinion.
               
            • mbaird

              mbaird mbaird

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              Ok ... stupid question but can you explain double clutching ? Its one of those vague terms like "3/4 race cam"
               
            • 67Dart273

              67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              Some of us have driven thousands of miles with no 1st gear synchro. Inconvenient? I guess. There are lots of things that are a PITA. Yet we manage There's at least one guy on this board who seems to think not having an all-synchro gearbox is pert 'near the end of the world.
               
            • 67Dart273

              67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              Google it/ youtube. Simply, it's matchin gear RPMs so the gearbox meshes. When you are in "say" first, revved up, getting ready to shift into second, the gears are all going some speed. You push in the clutch, let off the gas, the engine RPM drops. If this was a crashbox going into second, there is no synchro to macth the proper RPM of the changing gears. So they will only mesh when the falling RPM of the now de-clutched input gear/ cluster passes through the RPM window "of what 2nd gear" would be rotating. So if you, while IN NEUTRAL, let the clutch pedal back out, this transfers some of the engine RPM back into the input gear/ cluster of the gearbox, speeding it back up a bit. You have to LEARN what this "is". You have to learn to do this so the RPM comes out "right."

              Then, you push the clutch back in, and "before" the RPM can change much--again--you engange 2nd. All you are doing is matching RPM to the gear changes

              I'm sure we've all done the same thing "sort of" in an all synchro box. You want to "get on it" going uphill, and want to gear down. So you pull it out of 4th, say, and blip the throttle while shifting down into 3rd. This "helps" the synchros so they don't have to work so hard. Only difference with a "crashbox" is that there ARE no synchros--you are matching gearspeed and it has to be more exact
               
            • halfafish

              halfafish Damn those rabbits, and their holes! FABO Gold Member

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              You push the clutch in, move the stick to neutral, let the clutch out and then push it back in, then put the stick into the next gear. If you need to match gear speeds for a downshift you give it a little blip of throttle in neutral to make it easier to get into the lower gear.

              Agreed, and I've been in trucking for 46 years so I've deadsticked and double clutched my fair share for sure. However, I'm switching over so I can get into first gear at a much higher speed. I want to canyon drive my cars at whatever speed is prudent without horsing it into first.
               
            • mbaird

              mbaird mbaird

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              So just like it implies ... you literally clutch twice . Got it!

              I shift my dirt bike without the clutch by matching speeds all the time but not my car.

              The 833 in my dart is finicky while downshifting into 1st at too high of speed . I believe the syncro is getting worn ... I will try this next time I drive it.
               
            • CRUZE 418

              CRUZE 418 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              Retired truck driver, double clutching is simply waiting, that time you take to double clutch is waiting for the rpm to slow down.
              If 1st gear is unsyncronized, when sitting at a light, put it into one of the synchronized gears to stop everything, then shift into low.
              If you are going to try down shifting into low from 2nd or 3rd, you go to neutral, clutch out, engine rpm up, clutch in shift to 1st.
              It takes experience to do this correctly, it's all in your head, sound,speed, rpm.
              But do what RRR said, make sure that your clutch is working properly.
               
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