Uneven main clearances after line hone – could the machine shop have messed up?

[Oldmanmopar]

Si. Hence a .010 smaller chain set.

Sometimes .010 is not enough. An what about a Diesel with a gear drive, How do you fix a tight gear clearance from moving the crank closer to the cam? You all can dream of why a hone is OK but there are several reasons on many different engines where its not. There are times you surface the caps to close the bore and rebore the cap to resize the bore just skimming the block. You cannot do that with a hone without raising the crank in the block

 

[MOPAROFFICIAL]

Sometimes .010 is not enough. An what about a Diesel with a gear drive, How do you fix a tight gear clearance from moving the crank closer to the cam? You all can dream of why a hone is OK but there are several reasons on many different engines where its not. There are times you surface the caps to close the bore and rebore the cap to resize the bore just skimming the block. You cannot do that with a hone without raising the crank in the block

Sure.
Still everything has it's place.
I'm not debating which is ideal.
I'm saying the world still turns whether honed or bored. Many ways to get it done.

 

[mygasser]

there's always the factory timing chain tensioner setup to help with timing chain slack
neil.

 

[Max1196]

If the machinist had an oil pump section bolted to the main cap while sizing and the OP didn't have an oil pump pre-bolted to the cap when using the plastigauge, then there will be discrepancy in size on that #5. see my post #37. FYI a small chev will change in size/shape by .0009 inch

​

 

[Oldmanmopar]

there's always the factory timing chain tensioner setup to help with timing chain slack
neil.

That is where that chain tensioner came from. The V6 in 97 with the bad cam to crank spread from the factory, Their cheap fix that was never meant for use with a roller chain that many members think that is the answer to chain slack.

Not realizing that the tensioned chain only helps stretch the chain and change the cam timing. I would never use a chain tensioner. Just spend the money on a good true roller chain sized to your engine.

 

[MOPAROFFICIAL]

In a 59° lifter bank engine.. I think there are worser things than a less than ideal cheap fix like a tensioner.


For those are confused reading this thread...the amount of material removed from the saddle is .002, MAYBE..probably less. ..while the majority is taken out of the cap. The cap is ground .003-.005 oval and the hone is raised. Thats how.
Line honing is also a one time thing in most cases unless the block is subjected to extreme high heat and stress/high load...but id probably get another block if we're talking factory castings. Aftermarket **** is designed for those applications.. and there are aftermarket castings you have to clean up/correct to spec or per build.

As for the comparison of stone vs cutter, there are advantages to cutters..but then again it comes down the machinist/operator whether or not the cutter chatters the seat and it leaks.
Freshly dressed stones and someone like me.. and your cutter is no better, just faster.. which brings me to another point in that most of the advancements in tooling are aimed at not only increased accuracy but more so a faster process... which is great if you're the machinist doing the work.

Line hone or line bore, either way will get you where you're going when it comes to what 98% members on this board are using-stock blocks.

The "this or nothing" needs to stop.

 

[NC Engine Builder]

All that nonsense about line bore is the "only way" goes right out the window when you have misalignment in the block side of the tunnel. Which isn't uncommon after 50 years and a million heat cycles. You cant "just skim" the block side when they are distorted, you will move the crank up, just like a hone trying to fix that. Both methods have there place, but to make a blanket statement that line honing is a thing of the past is just categorically FALSE.

 

[NC Engine Builder]

In a 59° lifter bank engine.. I think there are worser things than a less than ideal cheap fix like a tensioner.

Dont even mention that, we will get a lecture about how every block needs the lifter bores corrected, which isn't true, and he will start in with his boasting about how perfect his kid gets them with a BHJ fixture.

 

[mygasser]

That is where that chain tensioner came from. The V6 in 97 with the bad cam to crank spread from the factory, Their cheap fix that was never meant for use with a roller chain that many members think that is the answer to chain slack.

Not realizing that the tensioned chain only helps stretch the chain and change the cam timing. I would never use a chain tensioner. Just spend the money on a good true roller chain sized to your engine.

re the tensioned chain changing cam timing, of course it would. the crank sprocket alternative keyway slots would sort that though. the decent true roller chain set you mention will resist stretch much more than a factory set. so now why won't it work?

 

[RustyRatRod]

All that nonsense about line bore is the "only way" goes right out the window when you have misalignment in the block side of the tunnel. Which isn't uncommon after 50 years and a million heat cycles. You cant "just skim" the block side when they are distorted, you will move the crank up, just like a hone trying to fix that. Both methods have there place, but to make a blanket statement that line honing is a thing of the past is just categorically FALSE.

I don't have a dong in the hunt with the argument, but my point was to just skim the block side UNTIL they all cleaned up. I assUMED you knew what I meant. Whether that's .005" or .020" is irrelevant, because they all need to be equal. It will just end up being "whatever" it is.

That said, It seems to me that the line bore would be the "newer" and "improved" way in comparison to line honing, since the Serdi and Rottler valve CUTTERS are an improvement over the stones. ...but that's just a guess on my part and may be totally wrong. It seems like a cutter would be more accurate.

...and that's coming from someone who likes using stoned to cut valves and seats. They do a fine job, as long as the stones are maintained.

 

[Inertia]

I think a lot has to do with the "operator and tools"

My mentor told me.
"You can give a great mechanic shitty tools, he'll still be a great mechanic."
"You can give a shitty mechanic the very best tools, he'll still be a shitty mechanic".

I can do perfect wheel alignments with string/level or laser.

Mostly Depends on the operator and skill .
Cheers

 

[RustyRatRod]

I think a lot has to do with the "operator and tools"

My mentor told me.
"You can give a great mechanic shitty tools, he'll still be a great mechanic."
"You can give a shitty mechanic the very best tools, he'll still be a shitty mechanic".

I can do perfect wheel alignments with string/level or laser.

Mostly Depends on the operator and skill .
Cheers

I cannot disagree with that logic.

 

[NC Engine Builder]

I don't have a dong in the hunt with the argument, but my point was to just skim the block side UNTIL they all cleaned up. I assUMED you knew what I meant. Whether that's .005" or .020" is irrelevant, because they all need to be equal. It will just end up being "whatever" it is.

That said, It seems to me that the line bore would be the "newer" and "improved" way in comparison to line honing, since the Serdi and Rottler valve CUTTERS are an improvement over the stones. ...but that's just a guess on my part and may be totally wrong. It seems like a cutter would be more accurate.

...and that's coming from someone who likes using stoned to cut valves and seats. They do a fine job, as long as the stones are maintained.

You do know that you can hold a tighter tolerance with a hone than a fixed cutter right? I can remove .0001 with a hone. Not gonna happen with a cutter.

 

[mygasser]

You do know that you can hold a tighter tolerance with a hone than a fixed cutter right? I can remove .0001 with a hone. Not gonna happen with a cutter.

i'll take that as fact coming from you, but it surprises me. takes me to a previous post about a great mechanic who will always be a great mechanic, regardless of the tools he has.
neil.

 

[RustyRatRod]

You do know that you can hold a tighter tolerance with a hone than a fixed cutter right? I can remove .0001 with a hone. Not gonna happen with a cutter.

I was speaking about stones in general terms, but yeah.

 

[Max1196]

No cutter used here..

 

[NC Engine Builder]

I was speaking about stones in general terms, but yeah.

My point was if the main tunnel is out of alignment, on the block side, a cutter or a stone mandrel both accomplish the same thing. The blanket statement that align hones are outdated, and a line bore cutter is superior, is a lie.

 

[junkyardhero]

"You can give a great mechanic shitty tools, he'll still be a great mechanic."
"You can give a shitty mechanic the very best tools, he'll still be a shitty mechanic".

i've worked with guys that had the 50K snap on cab and didn't know which end of the wrench to hold.

at the other end of that, i worked with a guy that brought his tools with him to work in a suit case. he'd grab grab him a fist full of stuff, throw a piece of cardboard down and shimmy back out with a transmission in record time.

 

[Master of Mopars]

Out with the bearings. Check the cap mating surfaces and edges, refit the caps without bearings and check the bore sizing against factory specs.
That's where I'd start.

 

[Killer6]

I don't have a dong in the hunt with the argument, but my point was to just skim

Only 1 letter away from a really inappropriate post

 

[4spdragtop]

Lol....hunt=runt??

Only 1 letter away from a really inappropriate post

 

[George Jets]

Install Main Bearings




☆☆☆☆☆

 

[RustyRatRod]

Only 1 letter away from a really inappropriate post

That's funny. lol

 

[RustyRatRod]

Lol....hunt=runt??

Leave it to the Canuck to make it even funnier. lol

 

[Oldmanmopar]

If you're going to tell people numbers, use the correct terminology "thousandths" not thousands.

I am use to $$$$$$$'s Its a habit