Well, look what we have here!

Discussion in 'Small Block Mopar Engine' started by B3RE, Jul 10, 2018.

  1. rumblefish360

    rumblefish360 so close yet so far away

    Messages:
    32,506
    Likes Received:
    4702
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2005
    Location:
    New York, on a Island
    View My Photos
    Local Time:
    2:54 PM
    You and I both. Flow sheets would be awesome. Dyno runs also.

    That would be cool.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • rumblefish360

      rumblefish360 so close yet so far away

      Messages:
      32,506
      Likes Received:
      4702
      Joined:
      Jun 21, 2005
      Location:
      New York, on a Island
      View My Photos
      Local Time:
      2:54 PM
      Exactly. High flow through small ports is nice to a degree.
      The W2 will flow in the high 2’s low 3’s with a larger port and that is just simple more air and fuel which equals power. A no brainer.
       
    • dadodgekid

      dadodgekid When in doubt... floor it FABO Gold Member

      Messages:
      502
      Likes Received:
      127
      Joined:
      Nov 25, 2013
      Location:
      Palm City , FL
      Local Time:
      2:54 PM
      RAMM ROD and YELLA BELLY ROSE... chill dudes. You both are a wealth of knowledge. Lets just see how good the TF heads are when they get out to the public and stop calling each other hypocrits please and thanks. Or cage have a cage match and settle it like mens LOL :rofl:
       
    • pittsburghracer

      pittsburghracer Well-Known Member

      Messages:
      522
      Likes Received:
      852
      Joined:
      Apr 20, 2016
      Location:
      Freeport, PA.
      Local Time:
      2:54 PM
      Its really not that hard to hand port a head to flow better than a cnc'd head if you know what you are doing. cnc'd heads are ported to a safe level by whoever they hire to port one for a cnc program. Good or bad it is what it is. A good hand porter can port a head personalized for each custumer.
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
      • Steven190

        Steven190 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

        Messages:
        692
        Likes Received:
        255
        Joined:
        Jan 13, 2012
        Location:
        Omaha
        Local Time:
        1:54 PM
        I started to follow this because I am interested in these heads. They are a step up form what I have and are better quality. I like to experiment with things and make my own decisions.
        I use to race back in the 70' and 80's, we had a Pro Stock car. I have built several cars and do restorations now on a private bases. I do not claim to know everything and expound on it. I am not a self proclaimed expert and have to reply to all threads and tell them that they do not know what they are talking about. I know that technology has change over the years and has moved on pass what I have done. I just have a street car that is fun and that is all I want and to play with it.
         
        Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
        • Agree Agree x 1
        • RAMM

          RAMM Well-Known Member

          Messages:
          1,460
          Likes Received:
          1007
          Joined:
          Nov 22, 2010
          Location:
          Ontario, Canada
          Local Time:
          2:54 PM
          First of all, I never said what I thought of the new TF offerings because I've never seen or touched a set. YR can tell from a picture that it won't equal or exceed his W2/W5's which flow 355 BTW. But precedes that with "flow isn't everything" Now i'm not confused by this but some would be. If I were releasing a new product I would be pissed that I didn't hire a guy like YR to design it because apparently it's all wrong.

          Wealth of knowledge? Dunno about that, but I do know I actually contribute with REAL information in REAL build threads. I've yet to see ANYTHING substantial/factual or relevant from YR. Heck I'd settle for mildly interesting at this point. J.Rob
           
          • Like Like x 3
          • yellow rose

            yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

            Messages:
            15,415
            Likes Received:
            12001
            Joined:
            Jun 19, 2015
            Location:
            Living on the razors edge
            Local Time:
            11:54 AM

            Seems I've posted about my W-5 junk many times, because many said you can't get a 2.100 valve in one without moving the guides. But you can. It would be better with a 2.08 though, unless you use a 1.500 exhaust valve.
             
          • yellow rose

            yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

            Messages:
            15,415
            Likes Received:
            12001
            Joined:
            Jun 19, 2015
            Location:
            Living on the razors edge
            Local Time:
            11:54 AM
            You can't look at the pictures posted here and see what TF did? What they always do? It's a marketing trick. Always has been. Pay attention. I Didn't say what the TF head will flow and I don't care. It could flow 900 CFM and it won't make the power of a 1970's designed W-2 head.
             
          • yellow rose

            yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

            Messages:
            15,415
            Likes Received:
            12001
            Joined:
            Jun 19, 2015
            Location:
            Living on the razors edge
            Local Time:
            11:54 AM

            The flow sheets went with the heads when I sold them. There were probably 25, maybe more as I don't recall. And that was only the tests I took results from. The heads were on the bench so many times I could never count.

            The dyno sheets were in the file that went with the car when I sold it in 2007. Didn't know that until I moved in 2008 and I was looking for some pictures I had of the car. They all went to the buyer. That buyer sold the car. It been in several hands. Last I heard, it's about an hour from here. I can't verify that.

            All the rest of the flow test I did went with the flow bench when I sold it. There were some really nice heads in that folder. I should have at least kept copies. The guy who has my flow bench is in Seattle. Haven't talked to him in years, but if I thought about it long enough, I may remember his name.
             
          • yellow rose

            yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

            Messages:
            15,415
            Likes Received:
            12001
            Joined:
            Jun 19, 2015
            Location:
            Living on the razors edge
            Local Time:
            11:54 AM
            I know I can hone a cylinder and port a head. It ain't that hard.
             
          • rumblefish360

            rumblefish360 so close yet so far away

            Messages:
            32,506
            Likes Received:
            4702
            Joined:
            Jun 21, 2005
            Location:
            New York, on a Island
            View My Photos
            Local Time:
            2:54 PM
            Once again, relax, sit back and relax.
            Not for nothin but your jumping in this guys shit like he has a hard on for you and I don’t see anything like that, not one bit.

            But your jumping on him.

            RELAX!!!!!!

            The more you fire back the worse it gets.
            Stop making mud in an otherwise good thread.

            Good GOD MAN!

            RELAX!!!!!
             
            • Agree Agree x 5
            • Like Like x 1
            • Disagree Disagree x 1
            • B3RE

              B3RE B³ Racing Engines

              Messages:
              454
              Likes Received:
              336
              Joined:
              Aug 22, 2013
              Location:
              USA
              Local Time:
              2:54 PM
              I see this thread has gone awry in a hurry, so all I have to offer is some additional info.

              First, fully CNC ported refers to the intake and exhaust ports, as well as the combustion chambers being entirely machined with a CNC mill. It does not mean max ported. Even an RPM head could be called CNC ported because of the port entry being CNC gasket matched. They are definitely not fully CNC ported. The Trick Flow big block 240 heads are fully CNC ported, but the 270s are fully CNC ported bigger.

              The flow chart sent by TF, says 293 at 600 and 301 at 700. For 190 ccs and a 2.02 valve, that's respectable for a stock replacement head. Exhaust is about 240.

              From past experience, Trick Flow won't even sell a bare head until about a year after they are released. They want to build a reputation for the head before they offer them to guys who will modify their work. They don't care if someone makes them better. It's the hacks that they are afraid will ruin the heads reputation before it has been given a real chance.
               
              • Like Like x 2
              • Agree Agree x 2
              • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
              • B3RE

                B3RE B³ Racing Engines

                Messages:
                454
                Likes Received:
                336
                Joined:
                Aug 22, 2013
                Location:
                USA
                Local Time:
                2:54 PM
                They did with the big block heads, so the final production version will likely have lots of room for pushrods.
                 
                • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                • ou812

                  ou812 Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  1,375
                  Likes Received:
                  176
                  Joined:
                  Jan 15, 2005
                  Location:
                  SoCal
                  Local Time:
                  11:54 AM
                  Is that vane actually curved over, or just an illusion?
                   
                • fishmens67

                  fishmens67 Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  5,726
                  Likes Received:
                  1629
                  Joined:
                  Nov 10, 2012
                  Location:
                  idaho
                  Local Time:
                  1:54 PM
                  YR has nothing to prove, Ramm has nothing to prove. or do they? maybe a build off with the new unproven Trick Flow small block head. say 420 cubes!
                   
                • B3RE

                  B3RE B³ Racing Engines

                  Messages:
                  454
                  Likes Received:
                  336
                  Joined:
                  Aug 22, 2013
                  Location:
                  USA
                  Local Time:
                  2:54 PM
                  It is actually curved that hard.
                   
                • B3422w5

                  B3422w5 Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  586
                  Likes Received:
                  389
                  Joined:
                  Feb 9, 2017
                  Location:
                  Portage michigan
                  Local Time:
                  2:54 PM
                  Yep. Agree. The cnc they are going to offer doesnt appear to be a max effort type deal. Just the name “ street port” kinda says it all.
                  That said, for what i want to do, if those are good numbers and the head “ works good” it should suit me as is.
                  I posted those numbers on your thread on Moparts a while ago.... lol
                   
                  • Like Like x 1
                  • yellow rose

                    yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

                    Messages:
                    15,415
                    Likes Received:
                    12001
                    Joined:
                    Jun 19, 2015
                    Location:
                    Living on the razors edge
                    Local Time:
                    11:54 AM

                    Yep it's curved. They do that to because it looks good on a flow bench. I don't force air to cross the back of the valve from the long side to the short side.

                    That was trick in the early 1990's. It's a waste. That's why I asked about an unported casting. It will take me just as long to fix that as it would to just do my own port work.
                     
                  • yellow rose

                    yellow rose Doctor of Thinkology.

                    Messages:
                    15,415
                    Likes Received:
                    12001
                    Joined:
                    Jun 19, 2015
                    Location:
                    Living on the razors edge
                    Local Time:
                    11:54 AM

                    No way would I use that head on 420 inches. Not. Nope. Nada.
                     
                  • skrews

                    skrews Well-Known Member

                    Messages:
                    1,098
                    Likes Received:
                    381
                    Joined:
                    Jul 20, 2012
                    Location:
                    Washington state
                    Local Time:
                    11:54 AM
                    I hope TF made the castings able to accept a W2 type port layout in oval and rectangle. Would be nice to see someone other than Indy offer an aluminum head in that configuration. Consider the number of big inch small blocks out there these days, a reasonably priced quality head easily capable of making 600+ HP OOTB is sorely needed.
                     
                    • Agree Agree x 2
                    • RAMM

                      RAMM Well-Known Member

                      Messages:
                      1,460
                      Likes Received:
                      1007
                      Joined:
                      Nov 22, 2010
                      Location:
                      Ontario, Canada
                      Local Time:
                      2:54 PM
                      Why couldn't you get a 2.1" valve in without moving guides? A quick measurement and simple math tells us valve guide spacing is 1.875" =/- .002" a nice nominal number. So half of the valve diameters added together better be less than 1.875". I get 1.85" with a 2.1/1.6" which should leave .025" between valves--your valve guides better be good and valve train stable. W2/W5 OEM heads all have the same spacing. Also most off the shelf pistons barely have room radially for a 2.08" . J.Rob

                      p.s. See YR, it's not so hard to add actual information. I even added a picture for you.

                      guidespacing.jpg
                       
                    • RAMM

                      RAMM Well-Known Member

                      Messages:
                      1,460
                      Likes Received:
                      1007
                      Joined:
                      Nov 22, 2010
                      Location:
                      Ontario, Canada
                      Local Time:
                      2:54 PM
                      Like is said before TF should have put you on the design team-no telling how far you could have taken them. J.Rob
                       
                    • RAMM

                      RAMM Well-Known Member

                      Messages:
                      1,460
                      Likes Received:
                      1007
                      Joined:
                      Nov 22, 2010
                      Location:
                      Ontario, Canada
                      Local Time:
                      2:54 PM
                      Looks kinda like GM's LS7 and some of AFR's offerings like their SBC 235. J.Rob
                       
                    • jimjimjimmy

                      jimjimjimmy lobsterman FABO Gold Member

                      Messages:
                      3,952
                      Likes Received:
                      726
                      Joined:
                      Nov 2, 2010
                      Location:
                      p. e. i.
                      View My Photos
                      Local Time:
                      3:54 PM
                      Ramm bored and HONED my engine and the rings sealed instantly so I know first hand he can hone a cylinder .
                       
                      • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                      • nm9stheham

                        nm9stheham Well-Known Member

                        Messages:
                        9,242
                        Likes Received:
                        1848
                        Joined:
                        Dec 20, 2013
                        Location:
                        Waynesboro, VA
                        Local Time:
                        2:54 PM
                        Tempted to make a run up there this weekend....