WHEEL STUD ISSUE

[poorhouse]

Hey guys, could use some guidance. l'm cobbling things together and put an 8 3/4 in my demon. Housing from 65-67 B body, and center section is one l had lying around. The axles that came with the housing have new bearings and are the right length, BUT the studs were too long and have no shoulder. Even if l cut the studs down, they have no shoulder, and although hub centric, the brake hubs scrape the backing plates because they are off center. Soooo, in the pic's, you can see the difference in diameter of the knurls in the factory studs, and the ones l took out. WHAT SIZE IS THE HOLE FOR THE FACTORY STUDS as l need to drill them out to fit

pic 1 right side, stud removed. left stud pulled from factory axle

pic 2 top, factory axle (truck-too long) bottom- new axle.

pic 3 can someone ID this axle? thanks

 

[RustyRatRod]

If the shouldered studs hold the drum off of the axle flange, that is wrong anyway. The drums should be FLAT against the axle flange. If the drums hit the backing plates while they are flat against the axle flange (like they are supposed to be) then you have other issues. Mismatched brakes, axles or something else. The B body and A body brake assemblies have backing plates with different offsets, so therein could be your problem.

 

[poorhouse]

If the shouldered studs hold the drum off of the axle flange, that is wrong anyway. The drums should be FLAT against the axle flange. If the drums hit the backing plates while they are flat against the axle flange (like they are supposed to be) then you have other issues. Mismatched brakes, axles or something else. The B body and A body brake assemblies have backing plates with different offsets, so therein could be your problem.

the backing plates are off what l assume was a truck rear end given the length. l transferred all the hardware to the new axle. lt is oddball- 11" x 2" but should work. yes the hubs fit flush to the axle hubs w/ the shouldered studs. thanks for reply. happen to know what size l need to drill out to?

 

[RustyRatRod]

the backing plates are off what l assume was a truck rear end given the length. l transferred all the hardware to the new axle. lt is oddball- 11" x 2" but should work. yes the hubs fit flush to the axle hubs w/ the shouldered studs. thanks for reply. happen to know what size l need to drill out to?

No. You need proper backing plates to match the rear end housing.

 

[MoparLeo]

The stud difference is that A-body came with 7/16" studs. B-body with 1/2" If you are looking to source them locally, check Dorman book. You can find most info in the FSM. as far as what was oem.

 

[poorhouse]

No. You need proper backing plates to match the rear end housing.

see picture #2. the bottom axle is shorter, therefore it looks smaller than the other in the pic. the flanges are actually identical

 

[RustyRatRod]

see picture #2. the bottom axle is shorter, therefore it looks smaller than the other in the pic. the flanges are actually identical

Ok. You're not gettin what we're preachin. So carry on. You'll understand. Eventually.

 

[poorhouse]

The stud difference is that A-body came with 7/16" studs. B-body with 1/2" If you are looking to source them locally, check Dorman book. You can find most info in the FSM. as far as what was oem.

yes. both studs in the photo are 1/2" thread. the difference is the factory knurls are larger than the studs l pulled. So l need to bore them out and don't know what size. lf l overbore, the headache becomes a migraine

 

[poorhouse]

Ok. You're not gettin what we're preachin. So carry on. You'll understand. Eventually.

flanges are identical. pic 1 top, donor vehicle. bottom new axle. only difference is knurl size

 

[RustyRatRod]

flanges are identical. pic 1 top, donor vehicle. bottom new axle. only difference is knurl size

View attachment 1716504878

View attachment 1716504879

Ok. Charge forward.

 

[CFD244]

Steel/Cast Iron Hubs: The hole should be 0.006"–0.016" smaller than the stud’s knurl/spline diameter.

I suggest that you buy the appropriate reamer instead of a drill bit.

Good luck

 

[poorhouse]

Steel/Cast Iron Hubs: The hole should be 0.006"–0.016" smaller than the stud’s knurl/spline diameter.

I suggest that you buy the appropriate reamer instead of a drill bit.

Good luck

Steel/Cast Iron Hubs: The hole should be 0.006"–0.016" smaller than the stud’s knurl/spline diameter.

I suggest that you buy the appropriate reamer instead of a drill bit.

Good luck

good to know! sounds like a machinist may be needed.

 

[Dana67Dart]

Here is the OD of the knerl dimension of a stock 67 charger rear stud.

As mentioned above the hole it goes in will be smaller in ID.

In your first photo you show what looks like a stock stud with shoulder and rusty and a long racing type stud no shoulder and not rusty. The text indicates that the left stud ( long racing type) was pulled from a stock axle

But I suspect you are asking what size hole in the drum to fit on the shoulder of the stud. But I'm not sure

Now there are a lot of unknowns.


You say that the drum is off center and that's why they are rubbing the backing plate.

I'm assuming the rubbing is not continuous as you turn the axle.

I'm assuming that you're using stock tapered bearings

I'm assuming your not testing the axle with the adjuster as it could be too far out making the flange too far in and there is no clearance between the backing plate and the drum

I'm assuming the new axles are NOT designed for A-Body brake backing plates.

I'm assuming the center register on the truck axle and the new axle are the same OD

I'm assuming the drum center registers ID is within a couple thousandth of the OD of the axle register

im assuming that the drum sits flat on either axle flange with the studs removed

If my assumptions are correct then I see only a few reasons the drum would scrape the backing plate.

No particular order

1. The backing plate is bent
2. The axle flange is bent
3. The axle is bent at the flange
4. The drum is bent and not round
5. The drums are not for chrysler 11x2
6. The backing plates are not for 11x2
7. The center register in the drum is not centered
8. The register on the new axle is not centered, does the truck axle do the same?

The drums, as long as the center register is correct do not need to have close fit lug stud holes they shouldn't be too big as that can cause the drum to move over time and cause issues.

But the clamping force if the wheel to the flange will hold the drum properly.

All drums fit that way on the rear.( Or you could not remove it to service the brakes. The fronts are swedged because you remove the drum/ hub assy to service the brakes)


I just noticed you said...

and although hub centric, the brake hubs scrape the backing plates because they are off center.

The brake hubs scrape the backing plate, you did mean the brake drum, correct?


As for who made the axle

I'm thinking Mooser based on this photo from a post.

 

[CFD244]

good to know! sounds like a machinist may be needed.

Yes.....I have my own equipment so I would do it myself.

Take the studs and axles to a machinist and tell him/her what you want. Those holes need to be perfect....If you start getting "tolerance creep" the rim/drum may end up not fitting.......among other things?

Good luck

 

[Oldmanmopar]

the correct diameter hole should be in the axle you removed the studs from.These should be opened up on a mill. A drilled bit could walk and move the hole. Moving five holes could create an alignment issue

 

[poorhouse]

Here is the OD of the knerl dimension of a stock 67 charger rear stud.

As mentioned above the hole it goes in will be smaller in ID.

In your first photo you show what looks like a stock stud with shoulder and rusty and a long racing type stud no shoulder and not rusty. The text indicates that the left stud ( long racing type) was pulled from a stock axle

But I suspect you are asking what size hole in the drum to fit on the shoulder of the stud. But I'm not sure


View attachment 1716504970

View attachment 1716504973

Now there are a lot of unknowns.


You say that the drum is off center and that's why they are rubbing the backing plate.

I'm assuming the rubbing is not continuous as you turn the axle.

I'm assuming that you're using stock tapered bearings

I'm assuming your not testing the axle with the adjuster as it could be too far out making the flange too far in and there is no clearance between the backing plate and the drum

I'm assuming the new axles are NOT designed for A-Body brake backing plates.

I'm assuming the center register on the truck axle and the new axle are the same OD

I'm assuming the drum center registers ID is within a couple thousandth of the OD of the axle register

im assuming that the drum sits flat on either axle flange with the studs removed

If my assumptions are correct then I see only a few reasons the drum would scrape the backing plate.

No particular order

1. The backing plate is bent
2. The axle flange is bent
3. The axle is bent at the flange
4. The drum is bent and not round
5. The drums are not for chrysler 11x2
6. The backing plates are not for 11x2
7. The center register in the drum is not centered
8. The register on the new axle is not centered, does the truck axle do the same?

The drums, as long as the center register is correct do not need to have close fit lug stud holes they shouldn't be too big as that can cause the drum to move over time and cause issues.

But the clamping force if the wheel to the flange will hold the drum properly.

All drums fit that way on the rear.( Or you could not remove it to service the brakes. The fronts are swedged because you remove the drum/ hub assy to service the brakes)


I just noticed you said...



The brake hubs scrape the backing plate, you did mean the brake drum, correct?


As for who made the axle

I'm thinking Mooser based on this photo from a post.

View attachment 1716505002

thank you so much for taking the time to give such a detailed description. l'm going to tackle it today and and do more precise measurements. backing plates, hardware, brake drums are non A body off the donor truck rear. yes, tapered bearings. yes adjusted to about .012 preload. mark

 

[poorhouse]

the correct diameter gole should be in the axle you removed the studs from.These should be opened up on a mill. A drilled bit could walk and move the hole. Moving five holes could create an alignment issue

thank you

 

[poorhouse]

Here is the OD of the knerl dimension of a stock 67 charger rear stud.

As mentioned above the hole it goes in will be smaller in ID.

In your first photo you show what looks like a stock stud with shoulder and rusty and a long racing type stud no shoulder and not rusty. The text indicates that the left stud ( long racing type) was pulled from a stock axle

But I suspect you are asking what size hole in the drum to fit on the shoulder of the stud. But I'm not sure


View attachment 1716504970

View attachment 1716504973

Now there are a lot of unknowns.


You say that the drum is off center and that's why they are rubbing the backing plate.

I'm assuming the rubbing is not continuous as you turn the axle.

I'm assuming that you're using stock tapered bearings

I'm assuming your not testing the axle with the adjuster as it could be too far out making the flange too far in and there is no clearance between the backing plate and the drum

I'm assuming the new axles are NOT designed for A-Body brake backing plates.

I'm assuming the center register on the truck axle and the new axle are the same OD

I'm assuming the drum center registers ID is within a couple thousandth of the OD of the axle register

im assuming that the drum sits flat on either axle flange with the studs removed

If my assumptions are correct then I see only a few reasons the drum would scrape the backing plate.

No particular order

1. The backing plate is bent
2. The axle flange is bent
3. The axle is bent at the flange
4. The drum is bent and not round
5. The drums are not for chrysler 11x2
6. The backing plates are not for 11x2
7. The center register in the drum is not centered
8. The register on the new axle is not centered, does the truck axle do the same?

The drums, as long as the center register is correct do not need to have close fit lug stud holes they shouldn't be too big as that can cause the drum to move over time and cause issues.

But the clamping force if the wheel to the flange will hold the drum properly.

All drums fit that way on the rear.( Or you could not remove it to service the brakes. The fronts are swedged because you remove the drum/ hub assy to service the brakes)


I just noticed you said...



The brake hubs scrape the backing plate, you did mean the brake drum, correct?


As for who made the axle

I'm thinking Mooser based on this photo from a post.

View attachment 1716505002

could my axles possibly be Ford?

 

[CRUZE 418]

I'm with Rusty on this one. The way I read #1, replacing the studs isn't going to do a thing.

 

[Dana67Dart]

yes, tapered bearings. yes adjusted to about .012 preload. mark

The center section has the proper center button? if so equiped (power loc) not sure about other types, I think open uses the cross bar

With our the button the axles will be closer together IIRC

could my axles possibly be Ford?

Moser makes Chrysler axles too

Your Axles have a serial number stamped in so call them and find out what they are.

But I doubt Ford bearings and spacing are the same chrysler

 

[poorhouse]

The center section has the proper center button? if so equiped (power loc) not sure about other types, I think open uses the cross bar

With our the button the axles will be closer together IIRC


Moser makes Chrysler axles too

Your Axles have a serial number stamped in so call them and find out what they are.

But I doubt Ford bearings and spacing are the same chrysler

thank you

 

[poorhouse]

The center section has the proper center button? if so equiped (power loc) not sure about other types, I think open uses the cross bar

With our the button the axles will be closer together IIRC


Moser makes Chrysler axles too

Your Axles have a serial number stamped in so call them and find out what they are.

But I doubt Ford bearings and spacing are the same chrysler

open rear w/ crossbar

 

[Kendog 170]

 

[poorhouse]

still working on it

 

[CRUZE 418]

Am I wrong in thinking that the shouldered hub centers the brake drum on the axle? I say this because I have screw in studs in my Dana, with drum brakes, I have no scraping sounds. My'72 Dart has Right Stuff rear disc rotors, the rotors are some kind of one size fits all. It too has screw in studs, the stud holes in the rotors are way big, the rotor is centered by the hub axle flange, no issues. What I am saying is, you have other problems, as mentioned above.
Hope you locate your other issue.