Which Trick Flow Heads with 318 (future 408)(part 1 of my plan)

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cawcislo

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Hello, I'm planning to build a 408 in the future and think the trick flow heads would work nicely on it. I don't want to fork over all the cash at once and was thinking I could get the trick flow heads first and use them with my current 318 for now then once I save up for my bottom end 408 I could swap the trick flows onto it.

This would be a street car with a couple drag races yearly and possibly an occasional autocross and looking ro run pump gas. Could this plan work and if so which trick flow head should I go with as there's a few different models (I'm assuming the cheaper models would do just fine).

I'm thinking the 61417801 or 61417802 version? The only differnce between the two is the 802 version has 0.030" more max valve lift (650 vs 680) and the 802 version has 10 degree locks vs 7 degree for the 801 version and $10 price tag between the two.

Which one should I go with? What else would I need to bolt these heads up to my current 318? Could I swap over the current rocker setup? I'm assuming push rods would have to be double checked for length... anything else?
 
Buy once, cry once. Why not go for the best that TF offers? The biggest difference is only a few hundred - it'll cost more for head gaskets and head bolts than the difference between best and cheapest.

JMO.
 
The difference between the heads (& price) is the valve springs. Read carefully at there site. Purchase the head that best fits the current needs. When it comes time for a different cam that exceeds the spring, replace them, there cheap. You don’t want to put a high pressure roller cam spring on a lowly low lift Hyd. cam and have it wiped out.

Although you could just purchase a roller cam for the 318..... LOL... OK, not truly recommending that.
 
rumblefish360 said:
The difference between the heads (& price) is the valve springs. Read carefully at there site. Purchase the head that best fits the current needs. When it comes time for a different cam that exceeds the spring, replace them, there cheap. You don’t want to put a high pressure roller cam spring on a lowly low lift Hyd. cam and have it wiped out.

Although you could just purchase a roller cam for the 318..... LOL... OK, not truly recommending that.
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To be honest, I hadn't read the differences on the springs - only noted the TI retainers.
240/600 on the top-end heads, WOW!
The TFS-6141T783-C00 lists 138/430 which seems reasonable for a FT cam, no?
 
Yea it does and that’s why I wrote what I wrote.
IF he has a hot roller cam 318 now, I would compare spring rates/stats of what I have now (or will need) between the TF head and what I have now.
The TF heads use PAC springs.
Phreakish said:
To be honest, I hadn't read the differences on the springs - only noted the TI retainers.
240/600 on the top-end heads, WOW!
The TFS-6141T783-C00 lists 138/430 which seems reasonable for a FT cam, no?
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One thing to keep in mind is if EBay does what they did last year they run some Christmas specials. 10-15% off is common and summit sells through eBay. I bought my third ATI powerglide case when I saw a 20% off offer. I could pass that deal up.
 
Just wondering if anyone has taken any as shipped TFS heads apart and checked the guides and seats. Food for thought.
 
Unless the 318 in question is a fairly serious build....... I don’t anticipate great results to come from this “stage 1” part of the exercise.
 
We’ve went past the point of asking, what do you have and what’s been done to it so far? Just curious how close to stock the present eighteen is now.
 
Garrett Ellison said:
We’ve went past the point of asking, what do you have and what’s been done to it so far? Just curious how close to stock the present eighteen is now.
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I’m not expecting too much from the 318, just figured if i’M going to go with new heads for my future engine anyways why not bolt me up to what I got now. I’m sure it won’t hurt. I know little about the current 318. Has headers, weiand aluminum intake, looks like some port work to the iron heads, bigger cam, but have no idea on what kind or any specs. 750 Holley, and a 4 speed behind it.
 
Regardless of which head you choose, they WILL wake the 318 up. So, I would choose whichever head you want to get the most out of the 408 in the end. Even if it's "too much head" for the 318, it'll still be better than stock.
 
That’s enough eighteen to merit trying it out on. I’d like to see the before and after time slips or chassis dyno Readings on that.
 
I’m sure it won’t hurt.
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I don’t share your confidence.

It’s your build, so you’ll go about it whichever way you see fit, but what I see with the TF heads on the 318 is doing nothing but making sure your new heads aren’t new anymore when you finally put them on the 408.

I’ll be happy to hear if you prove me wrong though, and that those heads work fantastic on your ‘teen.
 
I do expect to see the effective torque to shift farther up the rpm. How much gear do you have? It may be a good idea to check the cranking compression and leak down beforehand. If the numbers indicate any weaknesses, save your heads for your other build. Adding cylinder pressure with fresh heads on a worn bottom end usually doesn’t end too well. And if you use them prior to your fresh build, plan on having them gone through for cleaning and inspection before installing them on your 408. If you do get into it, though, it wouldn’t hurt to hit it with a degree wheel and dial indicator to see what cam you have and to measure the chamber volume of the heads you pull. Odds are that you’ll see a compression gain with the 60cc chambers, which is a win in itself. Whichever way you go, good luck, and keep us posted.
 
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Garrett Ellison said:
Just wondering if anyone has taken any as shipped TFS heads apart and checked the guides and seats. Food for thought.
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Took mine apart. Looked good. Held solvent in the runner
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Before I do anything I need to go through what I have now and get a solid baseline. The car is new to me and I'm learning a lot about small block mopars. This is a hobby for me. I'm not a mechanic, but I am mechanically inclined. I spent years playing/fixing and doing some drag racing with 2.2/2.5 turbo mopars.

I need to go over the 318 I have now check leakdown, compression, timing, carb settings and dial it in, but I'm also planning for the future. Winter is coming so the car will be sleeping until the spring so there won't be any major updates any time soon.
 
I forgot how good those heads look. I could see drivability suffering, but I bet the power from 3500-7500 would make for an impressive 318 if the camshaft were sized accordingly.
 
I wonder what the cross section of the intake port is?
 
I'd not just check the seal but concentric after checking stem clearances
I always OD hone all valves
I quite often do not like the finish on new valves
some are so bad they act like files on the guides
and every so often you find one hourglassed or tapered , or bowed or...
 
Wyrmrider said:
I'd not just check the seal but concentric after checking stem clearances
I always OD hone all valves
I quite often do not like the finish on new valves
some are so bad they act like files on the guides
and every so often you find one hourglassed or tapered , or bowed or...
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Excuse my ignorance, but is this common practice for $2000 new quality heads? Is the consumer expected to take them apart inspect and do finishing work?
 
cawcislo said:
Excuse my ignorance, but is this common practice for $2000 new quality heads? Is the consumer expected to take them apart inspect and do finishing work?
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No. You gotta remember there are all levels of experience here. Some want to take em out of the box and bag and bolt em on and roll. Others will fully disassemble them, using specialized tools and procedures to verify. Me, Id visually inspect them, maybe check a random valve or two with my small hole gauge set and a micrometer Do a quick valve lap or two to check seats, basic stuff. Then I'd run em. If money is no object, tools and experience are aplenty, of course you'd go all out on the rectal exam. Or if there were machine shops at every corner that'll do all this for next to nothing then by all means that's what you'd do. Don't forget, you could also buy them from some of the guys that are known here with excellent reputations that likely offer these heads at reasonable cost where much of these checks are done.
 
have one valve stick and bend a pushrod and a valve and tag a piston
your choice
I do not use valve grinder compound to check- the valve heats up then the seat is in the wrong place- use dykem blue
at least stroke the valves up and down by hand and relube
 
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