18" Wheel help

-
OllieDemon45

OllieDemon45

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2021
Messages
64
Reaction score
14
Location
Mid Michigan
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/attachments/20160409_141623_resized-jpg.1714937786/

So i have decided to go with an 18" Black wheel like the one pictured, 8" front and 9" rear if possible.
I have upgraded the front brakes to disc and the rear will stay drum on my stock 8.75. Both will have BBP.
I understand i need approx. 5.6-6 bs in front and 5.25-5.5 in the rear.
Does anyone know of a brand wheel like the ones pictured that come with these offsets/BS?
My head hurts i've been searching so much.

I just really like this style, Fyi they will be going on a 71 Demon. Hemi orange, black stripes.

Thanks for any and all help!

IMG_0596.jpeg
 
It can be really difficult to find killer wheels for muscle car Mopars because of the bolt pattern, offset and bore size requirements. Ford did their fans a big favor by designing a bunch of custom rims that were perfect factory fits but Mopar never did that.

I had custom Fikse rims built for my car but they were super expensive. The wheels you're looking at are more of a BBS style road race rim. BBS rims are super expensive but there are a lot of cheaper knockoffs available. They are usually made for Fords though so the bore size might not fit and the correct offset might not be available.

Back when we were road racing A body cars we converted them to Mustang rims.

DSC_2394 (Large).jpeg


DSC_6729 (Large).JPG


trailer.jpg
 
The wheels on the early A-Body look like American Muscle AMR's.

Here is an 18x8 w/ 5.7" BS

Mustang AMR Charcoal Wheel; 18x8 (05-09 Mustang) - Free Shipping

They also have 18x9 and 18x10, but you aren't going to get them to work with a stock width A-Body 8.75. I think you could step up to a '67 or so B-Body and make them work though.

Beside the issue Andy raised of the bore size, also be aware of the depth of the nose of the rotor. Most wheels are fairly short in that area and the wheel has to be bored out all the way which means the original center cap won't fit. Plus the bearing cap on the rotor usually sticks out of the wheel anyways.
 
Just dropping this info here I have American Racing Thorque Thrust 18 x10's on the rear of my 71' Dart with a stock A-body 8.75 rear end, but the car has to be mini tubbed with a spring relocation kit and the wheels need to be back spaced 6 1/2" and if you plan to run the exhaust out the rear you will have to run the exhaust over the leaf spring from inside to the outside but you can get 2 1/2" tubes work just fine.
 
FYI, they do make wheel centric rings if you use a wheel with a larger center.

IMG_5441.jpeg
 
OllieDemon45 said:
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/attachments/20160409_141623_resized-jpg.1714937786/

So i have decided to go with an 18" Black wheel like the one pictured, 8" front and 9" rear if possible.
I have upgraded the front brakes to disc and the rear will stay drum on my stock 8.75. Both will have BBP.
I understand i need approx. 5.6-6 bs in front and 5.25-5.5 in the rear.
Does anyone know of a brand wheel like the ones pictured that come with these offsets/BS?
My head hurts i've been searching so much.

I just really like this style, Fyi they will be going on a 71 Demon. Hemi orange, black stripes.

Thanks for any and all help!

View attachment 1716243427
Click to expand...

Those wheels are a replica of a Mustang wheel, I think the closest to your picture is probably this one although it's a dark matte charcoal...

Mustang AMR Charcoal Wheel; 18x8 (10-14 Mustang, Excluding 13-14 GT500) - Free Shipping

There are a bunch of wheels from different manufacturers though that are similar.

The problem you're going to have is getting the front and rear sorted out together. You won't have any issues finding offsets that fit the front, the +30mm offset available on the AMR wheels would work great in the front and in general the modern wheels are pretty easy to find in +30 and +35mm offsets.

The problem is it won't work in the back with a stock A-body rear end. The 18x9 is also a +30, so that makes the backspace ~6.1". And in 9 and 9.5" wide wheels the most common offsets in wheels like that are still like +30 to +40. But with a BBP A body 8 3/4 and the stock spring locations the offset you'd need is more like a +12.

There are also these, they have an 18x8.5 +35 for the front and an 18x9 +15 for the back that would likely work. The hub bore on the rear is going to be tight, but it should work in the rear only. Again, they're a graphite color. Konig offers the wheels in a darker color, but I couldn't find them in the right size/offset

Konig AMPLIFORM Wheel 18x8.5 (35, 5x114.3, 73.1) Graphite Single Rim | eBay

Konig AMPLIFORM Wheel 18x9 (15, 5x114.3, 71.5) Graphite Single Rim | eBay
 
If you have a set of wheels that you really, really want then the thing to do is to buy them. And then you can make the car fit the wheels. The rear end housing can be narrowed to tuck the wheels just where you want them and up front you can build a custom hub to move things around. I used to make custom hubs all the time back in the days when I was playing with different brake kits. Once you figure it out it is easy. Just takes a big lathe and a little bit of time.

Dsc_0449 (Medium).JPG


DSC_5581 (Large).JPG
 
AndyF said:
If you have a set of wheels that you really, really want then the thing to do is to buy them. And then you can make the car fit the wheels. The rear end housing can be narrowed to tuck the wheels just where you want them and up front you can build a custom hub to move things around. I used to make custom hubs all the time back in the days when I was playing with different brake kits. Once you figure it out it is easy. Just takes a big lathe and a little bit of time.

View attachment 1716243611

View attachment 1716243614
Click to expand...

I completely agree that sometimes you have to find ways to make things work. And sometimes we get tunnel vision and forget to look for other solutions. So wise words.

But in this case, I think that is an extreme solution. As I understand it, the OP doesn't want to run custom brakes (required with a custom hub), and there is an easy to source 8" wheel that should work fine for him and has the look he wants. The only issue is the rear, and there are easy solutions there as long as he is willing to let go of his stock housing.
 
DionR said:
I completely agree that sometimes you have to find ways to make things work. And sometimes we get tunnel vision and forget to look for other solutions. So wise words.

But in this case, I think that is an extreme solution. As I understand it, the OP doesn't want to run custom brakes (required with a custom hub), and there is an easy to source 8" wheel that should work fine for him and has the look he wants. The only issue is the rear, and there are easy solutions there as long as he is willing to let go of his stock housing.
Click to expand...

Yeah the front really isn’t the issue. The rears are harder to find, especially in combination with the front because of the much lower offset needed.

One solution is actually a wider rear axle, if 18x9’s or 9.5’s are the goal then a 68-70 B body 8 3/4 will put you in a spot where +30’s should work.

The other option is a 1/2” spring offset and 10” rear wheels. Funny enough, when you go up to 18x10’s or 18x10.5’s there are more wheels in the +15 to +25 range. And if you keep the A-body 8 3/4 that actually works. I’ve actually considered going back to an A-body 8 3/4 housing for that reason, I have 18x10’s now with a 1/2” spring offset and after some quarter lip and outer wheel housing modification's can go wider, but most of the wheels I’m looking at in the 10.5” to 11.5” range would work better with an A-body rear than they will with my current 68-70 B rear.

May not find the exact wheels you want, but it will give you more options.
 
72bluNblu said:
The other option is a 1/2” spring offset and 10” rear wheels. Funny enough, when you go up to 18x10’s or 18x10.5’s there are more wheels in the +15 to +25 range. And if you keep the A-body 8 3/4 that actually works. I’ve actually considered going back to an A-body 8 3/4 housing for that reason, I have 18x10’s now with a 1/2” spring offset and after some quarter lip and outer wheel housing modification's can go wider, but most of the wheels I’m looking at in the 10.5” to 11.5” range would work better with an A-body rear than they will with my current 68-70 B rear.
Click to expand...

Interesting.

I've always planned to go with a square setup but things keep pushing me in the direction of a staggered setup and this adds a twist I hadn't thought about before. Thanks.
 
Thank you all for the replys, I was hoping to keep the rear end stock and just put a nice set of wheels/tires on, lol
I see that is harder than anticipated. I am not much of a fabricator so i was hoping i didn't have to relocate any brackets/mounts etc.
I guess i may have to do more research and see if maybe moving the springs is the answer.

I'll keep searching and i'm sure i'll figure something out.

Thanks again for the help! Great group of guys on this forum!
 
DionR said:
Interesting.

I've always planned to go with a square setup but things keep pushing me in the direction of a staggered setup and this adds a twist I hadn't thought about before. Thanks.
Click to expand...

I know you're aware I'm a bit of a "wheel hound" so I have spent entirely too much time looking at wheels and considering my wheel and tire options. Like, WAY too much time.

If you want to run square with big wheels, you can go up to 18x10 and a 285/35/18 with work on the front fenders (rolling, flaring, brace extensions) and a 1/2" spring offset in the rear. With that set up you'd be best off with a 65-67 or 68-70 B rear and your 18x10's with offsets in the +30 to +40 range with the wiggle room being what disk brakes you're running and maybe a small spacer.

After I did the "reverse tub" on my Duster and started looking at 18x10.5 up to 18x12" wheels I figured out pretty quick that 18x10 is the break over, from 18x10 up there starts being a lot of lower offset wheels. That would go for mini-tubbed cars too. So for those, the A-body width starts making a lot of sense again. So if you want 295's or bigger it kind of switches back. There are a few Mustang wheels that are like 18x11 or 18x12 with big offsets, like +48, but only a couple of choices in that kind of set up.

OllieDemon45 said:
Thank you all for the replys, I was hoping to keep the rear end stock and just put a nice set of wheels/tires on, lol
I see that is harder than anticipated. I am not much of a fabricator so i was hoping i didn't have to relocate any brackets/mounts etc.
I guess i may have to do more research and see if maybe moving the springs is the answer.

I'll keep searching and i'm sure i'll figure something out.

Thanks again for the help! Great group of guys on this forum!
Click to expand...

Yeah it gets a little tricky because of the track width difference on the A-bodies front to rear with the A-body width 8 3/4. Actually gets weirder if you have a 7.25 or 8.25 BBP, because those are even narrower so you need like a +30 in the front and a +0 in the back.

To truly run square with like an 18x8 up to around an 18x9.5, or a stagger within those sizes, you'd want a B-body rear axle, so you could run a +25 to +35 offset all the way around.
 
OllieDemon45 said:
Thank you all for the replys, I was hoping to keep the rear end stock and just put a nice set of wheels/tires on, lol
I see that is harder than anticipated. I am not much of a fabricator so i was hoping i didn't have to relocate any brackets/mounts etc.
I guess i may have to do more research and see if maybe moving the springs is the answer.

I'll keep searching and i'm sure i'll figure something out.

Thanks again for the help! Great group of guys on this forum!
Click to expand...
Nobody has ever stepped up to the plate with Mopar specific wheels so what you are asking for isn't going to happen. If you want big, late model wheels on a Mopar muscle car you have to work the angles that people in this thread are telling you about. You can do a square setup with 17x8 Mustang rims. Maybe one size bigger than that but even then you'll need to trim some sheetmetal depending on make and model and ride height.

Moving the rear springs in, playing with axle width and playing around with the front brake setup opens up some other options but there are not "bolt on" solutions for Mopars like there are for Mustangs or Vettes or 911s. Those guys have a ton of cool choices for wheels.
 
Check out Forgestar. They have some standard wheels but they can also customize offsets. I'm assuming they just turn the mounting pad down to what you need. Nicely priced as well.
 
72bluNblu said:
If you want to run square with big wheels, you can go up to 18x10 and a 285/35/18 with work on the front fenders (rolling, flaring, brace extensions) and a 1/2" spring offset in the rear. With that set up you'd be best off with a 65-67 or 68-70 B rear and your 18x10's with offsets in the +30 to +40 range with the wiggle room being what disk brakes you're running and maybe a small spacer.
Click to expand...

I found an 18x9 +35mm wheel that I think will work. I can run a 275/35R18 on it, even though a 9.5 would be better. It was an open box deal at American Muscle so I bought it and then a second one so I have a set. The nice thing about the design of the wheel is the face is further out and I might even be able to run the optional taller center cap.

So I am at a point where I could run a different rear wheel width if I still wanted to, and am leaning towards a 255/40R18 and 275/40R18 combo. I can run that combo with the 18x9, but there is an 18x10 +42mm or an 18x9.5 +35mm option in the same wheel, too. Current plan is a Crown Vic 8.8 narrowed to fit whatever wheel I pick with Moser axle ends so I can run '05+ Mustang rear brakes, eliminate the c-clips and keep the ABS tone ring.

But there is also an 18x10 +15mm option which might change the rear axle direction. Time will tell.

And the brakes are in flux now too as I bought my son's '73 Duster so now the G3/T56 is going in that along with the 18" wheels and (maybe) a fabricated spindle with a 2015 Mustang rear bolt on hub and 14.2" Scat Pack rotors and 4 piston Brembo calipers.

racerjoe said:
Check out Forgestar. They have some standard wheels but they can also customize offsets. I'm assuming they just turn the mounting pad down to what you need. Nicely priced as well.
Click to expand...

That's what I ended up buying, Forgestar F14's in piano black. I really like them, much lighter than the FR500 wheel I first bought. The only caveat is, if you buy them from American Muscle, they appear to have a deal where the center bore matches a Mustang while the wheel direct from Forgestar has a larger hub opening. Didn't matter to me since I turned my hubs to fit the Mustang wheels I run on my '74, but might be important to someone.

Forgestar F14 Wheels
 
Last edited:
Someone I know recently picked up some black Enkei wheels...the back ones are a new version of the RPF1 wheels with a deep lip and what looks to me to be a positive offset...maybe contact them and see what they have...
 
DionR said:
I found an 18x9 +35mm wheel that I think will work. I can run a 275/35R18 on it, even though a 9.5 would be better. It was an open box deal at American Muscle so I bought it and then a second one so I have a set. The nice thing about the high offset is it puts the face of the wheel further out and I might actually be able to run the optional offset center cap with no machining.

So I am at a point where I could run a different rear wheel width if I still wanted to, and am leaning towards a 255/40R18 and 275/40R18 combo. I can run that combo with the 18x9, but there is an 18x10 +42mm or an 18x9.5 +35mm option in the same wheel, too. Current plan is a Crown Vic 8.8 narrowed to fit whatever wheel I pick with Moser axle ends so I can run '05+ Mustang rear brakes, eliminate the c-clips and keep the ABS tone ring.

But there is also an 18x10 +15mm option which might change the rear axle direction. Time will tell.

And the brakes are in flux now too as I bought my son's '73 Duster so now the G3/T56 is going in that along with the 18" wheels and (maybe) a fabricated spindle with a 2015 Mustang rear bolt on hub and 14.2" Scat Pack rotors and 4 piston Brembo calipers.



That's what I ended up buying, Forgestar F14's in piano black. I really like them, much lighter than the FR500 wheel I first bought. The only caveat is, if you buy them from American Muscle, they appear to have a deal where the center bore matches a Mustang while the wheel direct from Forgestar has a larger hub opening. Didn't matter to me since I turned my hubs to fit the Mustang wheels I run on my '74, but might be important to someone.

Forgestar F14 Wheels
Click to expand...

I like those also. I actually like the CF5V more, but they are only available in 19" & 20"
 
Nice '71 Demon! You probably don't want to cut up the body or mess with it to get 18" wheels on it. The only reason why there are a lot of Asian aftermarket wheels with a 5 x 4-1/2"[ 114.3mm ] Bolt Circle is because it's what Mazda, Lexus, Acura, Infinity, Nissan, Toyota, Honda use on various car lines still use. Thank everyone copying 1940's Ford designs. Most will have too much backspace, but if you search for wheels that fit Nissan 350Z you can get an idea of what's out there. And they kind of set what + offsets you will be able to find, because the benchmark wasn't set for old Mopars.

You sometimes will have to make a decision if the Hub Centric's will clear each other, or if you want to use Hub Centric Rings to span the gap or not. Or if you have to machine the wheel's Hub Centric and then make your own dust caps or find some off the shelf that will work.

If you were building the car from scratch, I would change it to coil over suspension on all 4 corners and ditch the leaf springs and torsion bars. The advantages of tuning your ride height and tire clearance in the back wheel wells is too good to not do it.

Your car is too nice to hack. So mini tubs and 355 width tires would cost too much and not be worth chasing a look. And then those fancy 18" rims will show stock tiny Mopar disc brakes or your drums in the back...

You can have wheels widened too to fit the back as you go along, say you mini tubbed and want to keep the same wheel to increase your backspacing.
Places like...

Weldcraft Wheels (Michigan)​

[email protected]​


Or​

Eric Vaughn (California)​

ericvaughnmachin.com​

 
Last edited:
The OP can make his own decisions, but I don't see the need for coil overs in this case (if ever?). He should be able to buy some 18x8 and/or 18x9 wheels that bolt on without having to change much at all beyond maybe swapping the rear axle, if that. Run a 245 or 255 tire in the front and I bet he doesn't even need to mess with the fender braces, if a Demon even has them.

I agree the small brakes can look funny, but an upgrade to bolt on 11.75" rotors is an easy and a worthwhile change. Paint the rear drum black and I suspect it will be fine.

@MopaR&D made it look pretty easy.

1970 Duster, Trans-Am-inspired "Pro Touring" build

Another "Will these fit?": 18" Mustang wheels

To be clear, that car is a Duster and Demons have a different front fender opening. Could be that the lower front corner interferes and needs trimming. Not really sure. But I know @BergmanAutoCraft runs a wide 18" tire on his Dart and I don't remember him saying anything about having to trim anything.
 
72bluNblu said:
I know you're aware I'm a bit of a "wheel hound" so I have spent entirely too much time looking at wheels and considering my wheel and tire options. Like, WAY too much time.

If you want to run square with big wheels, you can go up to 18x10 and a 285/35/18 with work on the front fenders (rolling, flaring, brace extensions) and a 1/2" spring offset in the rear. With that set up you'd be best off with a 65-67 or 68-70 B rear and your 18x10's with offsets in the +30 to +40 range with the wiggle room being what disk brakes you're running and maybe a small spacer.

After I did the "reverse tub" on my Duster and started looking at 18x10.5 up to 18x12" wheels I figured out pretty quick that 18x10 is the break over, from 18x10 up there starts being a lot of lower offset
Click to expand...
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i believe i found a set that may work. I think they would look pretty good on my Demon, it's one of the only ones i can find that i really like so far.

Tsw Clypse Wheel 18x8.5 5x114.3​

TSW Wheel 1885CLP305114B76 TSW Wheels Clypse Series Gloss Black Wheels | Summit Racing

TSW Wheel 1985CLP205114B76 TSW Wheels Clypse Series Gloss Black Wheels | Summit Racing

If so, what size tires would you go with?

As always, thanks for your help 72bluNblu!
 
Honestly @72bluNblu could easily collapse his knowledge on wheel fitments for mopars into a single digital asset like a PDF to sell for $5 each and probably fund another project. Make chatgpt do all the time consuming format stuff.
 
OllieDemon45 said:
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i believe i found a set that may work. I think they would look pretty good on my Demon, it's one of the only ones i can find that i really like so far.

Tsw Clypse Wheel 18x8.5 5x114.3​

TSW Wheel 1885CLP305114B76 TSW Wheels Clypse Series Gloss Black Wheels | Summit Racing

TSW Wheel 1985CLP205114B76 TSW Wheels Clypse Series Gloss Black Wheels | Summit Racing

If so, what size tires would you go with?

As always, thanks for your help 72bluNblu!
Click to expand...

Front's will work fine, a 245/40/18 should work well and shouldn't require any body modifications. A 255/40/18 will fit the rim, but that's a 26" tall tire so it will probably be VERY close to the lower corner of the front fender on a '71. One of those situations that will come down to ride height and body tolerances on your car.

In the back if you run the A-body 8 3/4 with BBP axles and the stock spring locations you'll probably need a ~5mm-7mm spacer with those 18x9.5's. It would also leave you room for a disk brake upgrade in the back later, add the disks and lose the spacers. Or if you run a 1/2" spring offset in the back, no spacers needed. With the stock spring locations and those 18x9.5's you should be able to get a 275/40/18 or 275/35/18 in there if you want, they're a pretty tight fit on Demons/Dusters/Dart Sports but because you can fine tune the placement with a small spacer you should be able to get them in there. A 255/40/18 would be no problem, and there are some 265/40/18's out there depending on the particular tire you go with. For example, a Kumho Ecsta PS91 comes in all of those sizes. I haven't run them but the specs looks pretty good

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...ewall=Blackwall&partnum=64YR8PS91XL&tab=Sizes
72smallairparticler said:
Honestly @72bluNblu could easily collapse his knowledge on wheel fitments for mopars into a single digital asset like a PDF to sell for $5 each and probably fund another project. Make chatgpt do all the time consuming format stuff.
Click to expand...

I dunno about easily. Some of it is really simple, just taking the distance from the wheel mounting surface back to the springs and out to the body. Those numbers are fairly well established, most of the tolerances are on the body side of it.

Where it starts getting complicated is the different body styles, changes to clearances over the years of production (like the fender openings on the '72 Dart fenders being made longer), ride height, section width for a tire on a rim that's narrower or wider than the measuring rim, etc.

So it would be easy to just have a spreadsheet do math based on the spring locations, front track width, width of the rear end and the body style of the car. I mean I use a tire/wheel calculator to check combo's against what I know fits. But it wouldn't be super accurate by itself either.

If you try to plug in all the model year or bodywork changes, ride height differences, sidewall flex on tires for 15" rims vs 18" etc it gets a lot more complicated. Not saying it couldn't be done but I certainly wouldn't say it's easy. And ultimately its all just a recommendation, the body tolerances on these cars weren't perfect at all so at some point it just comes down to how big of a risk you want to take with the wheel/tire combination and whether or not you're willing to make something fit if it doesn't quite.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top