2" drop spindles

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Well that's something! I wasn't sure if you had the ones you had re-worked. I need to move my wheels in some so i can get the front down. Thanks for answering my question. I'm a fabricator and have some machining capability so I'll see if i can figure something out.
 
Why not just lower it two inches with the torsion bars? I know some people do it. I don't know the pros and cons, but there has been lengthy discussions in the past... Seems to work well, and doesn't move the wheel position out any farther than what it is now

I've done that for years on several cars and don't like the ride and way it handles.
 
It's a Wilturd hub by the way and it's the same dimensions. That's why going to all stock 73 and up components like someone here suggested would not work.

It's 3/4" difference on the hub.

The critical dimensions I changed are A and N as shown on brand W's spec sheet.

270-8775 is the hub number for reference.

Good luck!
 
Well that's something! I wasn't sure if you had the ones you had re-worked. I need to move my wheels in some so i can get the front down. Thanks for answering my question. I'm a fabricator and have some machining capability so I'll see if i can figure something out.


Make sure you use the proper materials for your project. The wilturd hubs are forged then machined so you have to use materials that will give you the strength you will need.

6061-T6 is super strong and a good choice but if you want to get crazy you can use 2024-T4 ($$$$$)
 
No problems and with that I am unsubscribing and getting back to work!

If you have any questions you can PM me and I will be happy to respond.

PEACE OUT! :blob:
 

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It's a Wilturd hub by the way and it's the same dimensions. That's why going to all stock 73 and up components like someone here suggested would not work.

It should be made clear, it only doesn't work if you intend to keep the rims you're currently using. Since the vast majority of people doing this conversion are changing from SBP to BBP, its not an issue, because you already can't use the original rims on your car after the conversion. And there are dozens and dozens of threads on wheel and tire sizing for 73+ spindles.

I thought ALL of the SBP brake set ups had the same track width, which they don't. The 10" drum spindles only cause a .45" increase, while the 9" spindles have a .8" increase and the KH disks a .7" increase going to 73+ disks. Those are significant differences, and like I already said, I was mistaken because I have 10" drum cars and not 9" drum or KH disk cars. And I assumed they were the same, so I guess that makes me an a** as the saying goes #-o. But again, totally moot for almost everyone, because the bolt pattern change requires a rim change anyway.

As far as Magnumforce and Wilwood, they obviously use the 73+ specs when they say there's no offset change. And if you already have 73+ spindles, they're right. Their customer service after the fact may have been lacking, but there's nothing wrong with their product(s). I know for a fact that Magnumforce's customer service is far from spectacular because I've dealt with them myself, but they do say their spindles are based on the 73+ specs. And there's nothing wrong with the drop spindles they make, which is also something I personally experienced using their drop spindles for tens of thousands of miles.

Although, I wouldn't recommend drop spindles anymore anyway. I ran them, and I don't run them now even though I maintained the same ride height. They're unnecessary if you increase the size of your torsion bars, and the suspension geometry is better without them. It's far better to use the money on a set of 1"+ torsion bars and better shocks. If you don't increase the size of the torsion bars, you can't lower the car 2" without drop spindles without also constantly being on the bumpstops.
 
I've tried 1" bars on B and E's and I like the 2" spindles better myself. Some cars I've done both. This is my first A-body is why I'm asking. Already doing 8.75 rear with aftermarket LBC axles so I'm good there. Still trying to decide on tube UCA's.
We can get 17"-20" rims in most any back spacing. I'm not doing Wilwoods even though I have some on the shelf.
This has been a real good thread guys, thanks
 
I've tried 1" bars on B and E's and I like the 2" spindles better myself. Some cars I've done both. This is my first A-body is why I'm asking. Already doing 8.75 rear with aftermarket LBC axles so I'm good there. Still trying to decide on tube UCA's.
We can get 17"-20" rims in most any back spacing. I'm not doing Wilwoods even though I have some on the shelf.
This has been a real good thread guys, thanks

The tubular UCA's are unnecessary as long as you're not going really big on the front rims. The Moog 7103 offset bushings provide enough adjustment for an improved modern alignment. But, if you go past about 6" of backspace you need the tubulars to clear the rims at full lock and droop, at least with a 9" wide rim.

Typically, 17" rims can get away with up to about 5.6" of backspacing before you start running into outer tie rod interference. With that amount of backspacing a 255/45/17 is about as wide as you can go in the front. 18" rims eliminate the outer tie rod interference issue, so you can run more backspace, up to around 6.4" depending on your tire choices and suspension set up. I have 18x9's with 275/35/18's up front on my car, and if you use the 73+ brakes as the benchmark I have about 27mm of offset (6.1" backspace). The rims actually have a 35mm offset, but my Dr. Diff 13" rotors add another 3/16" to the track width, and I run 3mm spacers to keep from rubbing the frame at full lock. But that's with 275's and apparently smaller steering stops than most have.

I also run 1.12" torsion bars and Fox shocks. I had 1" Just Suspension bars on there, but they were too soft for me. Good shocks are really the key to larger bars. My Duster has a very similar ride quality to my g/f's 2013 Mustang. I also use the "button style" 11/16" tall poly bumpstops to give me room for suspension travel with the lowered car. Right now I have about 13/16" to the bumpstop and 1.5" to the LCA from the frame, and no issues bottoming the suspension. My UCA's are about parallel to the ground, which is where the best suspension geometry occurs on an A body. Lowest roll center without being "underground", and any upward deflection results in additional negative camber on the camber curve.
 
The drop spindles only move the track as much at the regular 73+ spindles. I honestly don't know what happened with momoparman's car, but the track width change isn't 3/4" per side from early to late spindles.

BUT, they do eliminate any possibility of clearing the outer tie rod end with the rim. Normally, an 18" rim totally clears the outer tie rod end, allowing more backspace to run wider tires. Some 17's also allow enough room to get more than 5.6" of backspace. Not possible with drop spindles, which means you're limited to no more than about 5.6" of backspace, which means nothing wider than a 255 up front for pretty much all A-bodies even with a 17 or 18" rim. Less with a 15" rim.

I've found that the drop spindles are totally unnecessary if you upgrade your torsion bars. The only advantage they give is that they allow you to lower your car 2" without losing suspension travel. But here's the thing, if you run larger torsion bars, you can't even use that travel. Even most 1" torsion bars are almost double the stock torsion bar spring rate. Which means, only about half the amount of travel is needed for the same input force. So, while you can lower the car and keep the same amount of possible suspension travel, you'll never use it. With the 1.12" torsion bar I run (300 lb/in, or nearly 3x the rate of stock), I've yet to hit the bumpstops on my LCA's, even with only about 7/8" of available travel.

I ran Magnumforce drop spindles on my Challenger for a few years. I realized that I didn't need them with the 1.12" bars on it either. I removed them and lowered the car with the torsion bar adjusters to the same exact ride height. No issues whatsoever, despite the loss of available suspension travel.

The drop spindles DO raise your roll center for a given ride height. Meaning, my challenger lowered to the same ride height without drop spindles has a lower roll center than it did at that height with drop spindles. If your car is currently at stock height and you're looking at lowering it, the roll center will change very little, because the angles of the UCA's and LCA's will be roughly the same if the car is only lowered the 2" with the drop spindles and no adjustments are made on the torsion bar adjusters. If you lower the car less than 2", meaning, you install the 2" drop spindles and adjust the torsion bar adjusters so you have less than a 2" change in ride height, you'll have raised your roll center. Probably not so much that most people would notice, but raised it nonetheless.

Personally, I think the drop spindles are a waste of time. Spend that money on a good set of torsion bars and lower the car with the adjusters. One of the biggest advantages of the torsion bar suspension is that it's ride height adjustable.

Brian, you're a damn encyclopedia. I'd bet that you have an engineering background...and if you didn't, you may want to consider a second career. :D

So you were kind enough to reply to my PM asking about these and so far, your advice has been 100% spot-on...

I'm still vacillating between trying to make my 15x8 +10mm wheels (w/235/60/15 tires) work and just taking your advice on the 17"s with the backspace that you recommended.

I needed new ball joints anyway so I picked up a set of QA1 tubular UCAs which also provided better clearance on the arms but are perhaps slightly taller at the ball joint (which I believe you predicted). As it stands, it looks like a drop spindles would address that clearance issue.

My question here is about the tie rod and steering linkage interference that you pointed out. I'm not doubting you...but sitting under the car, it's hard to visualize where the tire would hit with everything moved up 2". The tire's radius is only slightly greater than the rim (10mm each side?) and barring massive deflection, it doesn't look like it would hit.

Is this rim hopeless? I have a set of 6mm spacers that I'd hate to use but they are available.
 
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