3 point seat belt, '63 wagon

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Peter Ardell

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Hi!

I am about to install 3 point seat belts in my 1963 Dart wagon. For my two kids, five and seven years old.

Safety is top priority, of course. Or at least as safe as possible...

What kind of solutions is there around? Will the c pillar hold or rip if I go for this solution -> 3 Point Seat Belts Installation of Shoulder Anchor Point Where Door Post Goes to Roof

What have you girls and guys solved this?

Kind regards /Peter
 
I don't know about a wagon but I built a headrest (whiplash) with seat belts for my kids in my Barracuda. I also built the speaker system while I had the seat out of the car:
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Same principle should apply to the wagon seat??
Treblig
 
That's more or less the way I did mine on the Valiant.Stronger than you would think it to be.Sorry but not the best photos.Mine has the Signet Stainless trim so I drilled 1 1/2 from the outside, the trim piece covers the hole. From the inside had a 1/2'' hole so more steel was around the reinforcement plate.

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Seems like you could easily mount the reel to the rear floor (or wheel well) then attach a steel loop:
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to the top of the seat metal frame. The belt could slide through the loop and over the shoulder. The receptacle can easily be attached the floor below the rear seat. If you don't mind black belts I have an extremely good suggestion (and inexpensive) that's better than the aftermarket belts. If you don't mind black belts just let me know.

treblig
 
Seems like you could easily mount the reel to the rear floor (or wheel well) then attach a steel loop:
View attachment 1715092826

to the top of the seat metal frame. The belt could slide through the loop and over the shoulder. The receptacle can easily be attached the floor below the rear seat. If you don't mind black belts I have an extremely good suggestion (and inexpensive) that's better than the aftermarket belts. If you don't mind black belts just let me know.

treblig

Thanks.

Gotta look for grey, tan och similiar... ;-)

Kind regards /Peter
 
See this post and this post (and links from them) for good options in 3-point belts. Do not install a 4-point belt/harness setup if you value your life and intact body; see here (and links from there).

When I read your posts, Dan, I get the impression that your study first, the apply some research, and after THAT do stuff. I like that apporach.

Still I am not sure that a three point belt will do good (or greater) in this particular situation. If anchor it to the body behind the C pillar, the angle will be low and the seat will be in the way. The hole car is not design for belts at all - or a collision...

And the more I read, the less I want to have the kids nowhere near the Dart... :-/
 
Anyway: Where do you Slant Six-Dan think it's a good idea to anchor a three point seat belt? According to attached picture.

Kind regards /Peter

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Hej, Peter.

When I read your posts, Dan, I get the impression that your study first, the apply some research, and after THAT do stuff.

Yes. Some people don't like it, but stuff breaks and costs money when I try to do it any other way. :)

The hole car is not design for belts at all - or a collision...And the more I read, the less I want to have the kids nowhere near the Dart...

Well, yeah. You could swap in Chrysler Sebring front seats with integral 3-point belts, but that won't stop the solid steering column spearing you right through the heart, won't keep the doors closed, won't add side-impact protection, won't fireproof the fuel system, won't address the lack of a good way to mount rear 3-point belts (which US cars didn't even have to have until about 1989) etc. There is no getting around the simple, basic fact that a '63 Dart is an unsafe car. That's an unpopular thing to say on here, but it's absolutely true. See the 5th big paragraph in this post, then see here for the followup (which contains the data to refute faulty thinking like "When I was a kid, everyone drove '60s and '70s cars running on leaded gasoline and nobody wore seatbelts and everybody smoked cigarettes and lookit, I'm still alive!").

One consequence of my main professional line of work (involved with traffic safety research) is that I can no longer pretend it's safe to drive an old car. It just plain is not. You're fine until your luck runs out, and then—very quickly—you are very maimed or very dead. If I were single, maybe I wouldn't care so much. But I'm married, which means if I get injured so I can't work, or I get killed, at least one other person in the world is severely screwed, not to mention desperately sad. I don't want to bring suffering on myself, but I absolutely will not bring suffering on anyone else in the world if I can reasonably avoid it.

Back in the "good old days" (which didn't really exist, we only remember them that way), there was no alternative—everybody drove unsafe cars because that was the only kind available. We just did our best not to think about it, because the only other option was to stay off the roads. Now we have much better options. Now even the worst, least-safe car you can buy in a civilised country is enormously safer in a crash than even most of the safest cars of just ten years ago (real cars from legitimate makers, not the Chinese garbage now available in Australia and some other countries). Most of us have seen this, which makes the point, but also take a look at this. That's two cars both much newer than the newest A-body…look and listen to the results in reality.

:-\
 
Being a Swedish citizen, living in Volvo land, I am aware of car safety. In fact, our whole country is fixated with safety of all sorts...

That said, I am looking at the solution Volvo has. In their models wagon models - 945, V90 and so on - all belts comes over the seat top (see picture below).

I will use three point belts and the really sturdy back seat frame together with welded thick plates on top of it/behind. Where the upper anchor will be placed. Then I can adjust angles and so forth. As long as the kids are short, that will do. Nobody in the car will ever survive a head on collision with a modern car anyway, but since we travel in the big cities most of the time, the speed is in general low to moderate. And the Dart is not our daily driver.

Last year, 270 people out of 10 million died the traffic in our country. That includes drunk people, bicycle accidents, suicide, pedestrians... There is still a risk, but also being seriously injured, but it's low. My guess is that a lot of motorsports, horse riding, hockey and so on has a bigger potential to get rid of the kids...


2017-Volvo-V90-rear-seat-02.jpg
 
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