360 vs 383

383 or 360 ?

  • overall, 383 all things considered

    Votes: 31 58.5%

  • overall, 360 all things considered

    Votes: 22 41.5%
  • Total voters
    53
-
Killer6 said:
For sure, I know somebody that has run a bone stock '73 360 Duster many many times, best times in good air 14.80-14.90's.
Click to expand...
Well... 360's didn't come until the 1974 model Dusters. Unless someone stuck a stock 360 in a 1973 base duster.
Yes, technically a lot 74's were built in late 73 (like mine was built in Oct. 73) but were marked as 74' model years.
73's were the last year of the 340's in the A-bodies.

318willrun said:
Besides the ability to run a 904 ......
I'll offer that the LA 360 was offered in a roller cam, which can be a pretty big deal. So back to the A-body scenario, a roller 360 with a 904 in a Duster per say?? That's a nice set up!
Click to expand...
Yup!
I have a Roller LA360 from a 1991 RC. I stuck Speed-pro Flat-top slugs, Alum. heads, RPM Air gap manifold, Lunati Voodoo Roller Cam, freebie Hooker headers and topped with a Street Demon 750 Carb.
- About 10.2 Compression with thinner Cometic head gaskets.
- I'm loving it but wanted an upgrade, now I'm currently assembling a Magnum based 408 Stroker. I'll be likely selling that LA360 to my friend here who just acquired a 1976 Dart Sport (w/ a S6) if he can't then I'll be selling it on here eventually.
And yes 904's are great but I like A999's better lol. The Dodge Diplomats / Plym Gran Fury's that were in the salvage yards here were excellent donors. Sadly even those guys are getting hard to find, I'm trying to find another A999 or A998's for my friend for his 76'.
 
Last edited:
318willrun said:
I've had my own reasons of when and why I like each of these in certain environments. I wanted to see what others thought or how they felt about the comparison. I did mention a couple of my reasonings...
  • As for a 383 swap, I haven't found the right project to build my 383 for, but we never know what tomorrow holds....
Click to expand...
Lowered D150....
 
Cuprum-74 said:
Well... 360's didn't come until the 1974 model Dusters. Unless someone stuck a stock 360 in a 1973 base duster.
Yes, technically a lot 74's were built in late 73 (like mine was built in Oct. 73) but were marked as 74' model years.
73's were the last year of the 340's in the A-bodies.


Yup!
I have a Roller LA360 from a 1991 RC. I stuck Speed-pro Flat-top slugs, Alum. heads, RPM Air gap manifold, Lunati Voodoo Roller Cam, freebie Hooker headers and topped with a Street Demon 750 Carb.
- About 10.2 Compression with thinner Cometic head gaskets.
- I'm loving it but, but wanted an upgrade, now I'm currently assembling a Magnum based 408 Stroker. I'll be likely selling that LA360 to my friend here who just acquired a 1976 Dart Sport if he can't then I'll be selling it on here eventually.
And yes 904's are great but I like A999's better lol. The Dodge Diplomats / Plym Gran Fury's that were in the salvage yards here were excellent donors. Sadly even those guys are getting hard to find, I'm trying to find another A999 or A998's for my friend for his 76'.
Click to expand...
It may be a '74 model, the only change to the car was They swapped out the 8.25" for a 8.75" rear, & ran 3.23's. I have the rear out of that car, & haven't even looked at what ratio was in it, lol!! Stk was 2.9X's iirc. I checked w/them & it ran 14.40's w/3.55's sooo....
 
rmchrgr said:
OK so anecdotal stories from 50 years ago are more accurate than clear drag strip results from 2023? Just because you lived in a time when high octane fuel was readily available or that you lived near a race track does not change the fact that 383s are not that great and never were. IMO, the race results speak for themselves no matter what lens you view them through.

I also never claimed 360s are inherently faster. Some cars with one of the two subject engines might be faster than others for various reasons. The engine architecture between the two platforms is too disparate to make this a truly valid comparison anyway but that said, at least on paper in stock form, they appear to be relatively similar which makes for an interesting debate.

Believe what you want, I don’t care. I’m also not sure what your point is though other than trying to prove what I posted is somehow invalid compared to some memory of yours that may or may not have happened exactly the way you think it did 50 some-odd years ago.

Look, any engine can be made to run if you put enough time, effort and money into it. There’s a well known ‘71 ‘Cuda 383 combo in NHRA Super stock that runs almost a second under the index which puts it well into the 9 second zone. It’s a bad *** ride even with the lower compression motor.

That’s a $100K + race car though wheeled by a pro who’s been doing it for over 40 years. The engine probably cost $20K to build to that level. It’s also an exception to the norm because you’d be hard pressed to find too many more competitive 383 combos in the upper ranks of NHRA super stock. Why? Because they don’t make sense to use when there are better performing options.

Again, I’m just not a fan of 383s. I wouldn’t choose to build one unless I was trying to fit into a certain class of racing or I was going for a factory correct restoration. The 400 is arguably the best platform to build so there is no logical reason to make things harder by starting with a lesser platform. I don’t need to prove a point that it cam be done, life is too short for that.

I’d also choose a 340 every time over a 360 but since 340 blocks have become unobtanium the 360 makes the most sense for small block builds. They are obviously more plentiful and respond to the same modifications as the 340 does. I believe a similarly modified 360 would be closer in performance to a 340 based combo than the 383 would be to the 400. Prove me wrong.
Click to expand...
LOL! OK, so no knowledge about something not on the internet. We'll just use NHRA factored hp numbers for Stock and Super Stock competition. "68" 383 330 hp and "74" 360 245 hp. Look it up. Your unsubstantiated claim that 383's have no potential has no basis in fact. Just looking at head flow will show you are wrong. Ever race against a 68 383 road Runner with an 11 inch clutch and a 4 speed? The perfect launch they had was impressive. They'd definitely clean your clock with a stock 74 360 duster. HP 400's (NHRA 250 hp in 1974) were the same category as a smog "supposed" HP 360, not even High Performance unless you throw a lot of money at them. By the way, Super Stock and Stock class cars are definitely in the scenario 4 catagory. My friends 383 Road Runner was all stock the way it came from the factory except for the mods I described, the cam, cast iron intake, small Carter AVS, and all. Same head castings as all big blocks. 13.0's in a B-Body. Your right, no potential there. Really, there is no problem making power with any MOPAR engine if you know what you are doing from a 170 to 440. Look at what the heads flow, that will tell you the potential.
 
66fs said:
LOL! OK, so no knowledge about something not on the internet. We'll just use NHRA factored hp numbers for Stock and Super Stock competition. "68" 383 330 hp and "74" 360 245 hp. Look it up. Your unsubstantiated claim that 383's have no potential has no basis in fact. Just looking at head flow will show you are wrong. Ever race against a 68 383 road Runner with an 11 inch clutch and a 4 speed? The perfect launch they had was impressive. They'd definitely clean your clock with a stock 74 360 duster. HP 400's (NHRA 250 hp in 1974) were the same category as a smog "supposed" HP 360, not even High Performance unless you throw a lot of money at them. By the way, Super Stock and Stock class cars are definitely in the scenario 4 catagory. My friends 383 Road Runner was all stock the way it came from the factory except for the mods I described, the cam, cast iron intake, small Carter AVS, and all. Same head castings as all big blocks. 13.0's in a B-Body. Your right, no potential there. Really, there is no problem making power with any MOPAR engine if you know what you are doing from a 170 to 440. Look at what the heads flow, that will tell you the potential.
Click to expand...
You can make power with any engine. 383 is no exception, I agree. And the 360 needs very, very little to go 12's. I've proven it. I'm there now, with 3.23 gears and the factory stock converter and a smaller cam than a stock 383 commando.
 
66fs said:
LOL! OK, so no knowledge about something not on the internet. We'll just use NHRA factored hp numbers for Stock and Super Stock competition. "68" 383 330 hp and "74" 360 245 hp. Look it up. Your unsubstantiated claim that 383's have no potential has no basis in fact. Just looking at head flow will show you are wrong. Ever race against a 68 383 road Runner with an 11 inch clutch and a 4 speed? The perfect launch they had was impressive. They'd definitely clean your clock with a stock 74 360 duster. HP 400's (NHRA 250 hp in 1974) were the same category as a smog "supposed" HP 360, not even High Performance unless you throw a lot of money at them. By the way, Super Stock and Stock class cars are definitely in the scenario 4 catagory. My friends 383 Road Runner was all stock the way it came from the factory except for the mods I described, the cam, cast iron intake, small Carter AVS, and all. Same head castings as all big blocks. 13.0's in a B-Body. Your right, no potential there. Really, there is no problem making power with any MOPAR engine if you know what you are doing from a 170 to 440. Look at what the heads flow, that will tell you the potential.
Click to expand...
nhra disagrees with you
383 dart 296 hp factor
383 road runner 300 hp factor
360 from the 70s 300 301 305 nhra hp factor
 
It's really just starting to look like guys are wishing for more size..... i'm happy with my 318.. nothing to make up for here :)
 
318willrun said:
You can make power with any engine. 383 is no exception, I agree. And the 360 needs very, very little to go 12's. I've proven it. I'm there now, with 3.23 gears and the factory stock converter and a smaller cam than a stock 383 commando.
Click to expand...
My personal preference against 360's doesn't mean I can't appreciate them. I built quite a few for other people. I just happened to be building engines in the 70's and have a stash of my favorite engines, and evidently may never need them. No 360's, they were sold years ago.
 
a-bodyguy said:
nhra disagrees with you
383 dart 296 hp factor
383 road runner 300 hp factor
360 from the 70s 300 301 305 nhra hp factor
Click to expand...

a-bodyguy said:
nhra disagrees with you
383 dart 296 hp factor
383 road runner 300 hp factor
360 from the 70s 300 301 305 nhra hp factor
Click to expand...
Do those numbers reflect Edelbrock heads, allowed in stock class racing now? It really does not matter. It would not change the reasons why I would pick a 383 over a 360. Nor does it prove that a 383 is a dog. Not sure how 230 cfm translates to equal 190 cfm?
 
66fs said:
LOL! OK, so no knowledge about something not on the internet. We'll just use NHRA factored hp numbers for Stock and Super Stock competition. "68" 383 330 hp and "74" 360 245 hp. Look it up.
Click to expand...
I did and you're 100% wrong. Those are the "advertised" HP#s, not NHRA factored hp/weight. While I was at it, I looked up my old '68 Coronet 440/383 4bbl car specifically and the HP was 290 with OE heads and 295 with aftermarket ones. The minimum weight for that car is 3,416 lbs which is being generous.

If you want to prove these ideas to yourself, go to Wallace Calculators which are digital versions of the Moroso slide rule calculators that all the cool racers used way back when. So find the 1/4 mile stats calculator and input the 3,416 lb. minimum weight and then 290 hp and it spits out an ET of 13.49 @ 100.2 mph. Sounds pretty good for a decent running 383 with headers and slicks. Probably puts you down in U/stock with the 6 cylinder cars though.

From there however, you can input different numbers to see what class you might be able to run in competitively. Say you want to run in SS/IA with the '71 'Cuda I mentioned in one of my prior posts. To cover the SS/IA index of 10.70 in a '68 Coronet at that 3,416 lb. weight, it would take 750hp to go 9.66. Sounds fun! Who's paying?

I think we'd all like to know how to get at least 750hp out of a stock stroke 383 with OE or equivalent stock port/runner/valve sized aluminum heads (a difference of 5 hp) and a 625cfm Carter AFB. I'm all ears. No biggie for you though right 66fs, you got all the good parts laying around already because 383s rule and 360s drool. A few nights after work in the garage and a couple Sunday's worth of T'N'Ts and you're there, right?

I will couch that by saying that scenario obviously holds true for all engines in class racing including the more competitive ones. It's also why the shops that build class engines are some of the best out there. They understand the task and can make it happen within the restrictive parameters a particular combo might be saddled with. Yes, it's tough to do and takes a lot of time and money to sort those things out. Some guys are at it for years and are still off the mark because it's so difficult. To be sure though, none of that know how is based on fuzzy memories from 50 years ago either. But I digress.

Sorry to get too far off topic but whether "I was there back in the day" or not is irrelevant - facts are facts regardless of whether we understood them 50 years ago or now.

a-bodyguy said:
nhra disagrees with you
383 dart 296 hp factor
383 road runner 300 hp factor
360 from the 70s 300 301 305 nhra hp factor
Click to expand...
Ha, beat me to it.
 
LA 360 was a factory turd. Spin it all you want, Ma Mopars performance switch was turned off in 1970 until the modern hemi came out.
 
fishmens67 said:
LA 360 was a factory turd. Spin it all you want, Ma Mopars performance switch was turned off in 1970 until the modern hemi came out.
Click to expand...
Of course because it was essentially a truck/van/station wagon engine. They put them in Dusters and Dart Sports because they needed 'something' to replace the 340 with to sell to the 'youth market'. Imagine if they went the opposite direction and tried to push the 318 instead? Logic says the 360 was the only choice in that situation, (thankfully) regardless of how toothless it was at the time.

Most Big 3 engines in the mid '70s were boat anchors, not just Chrysler products.
 
th_caution.jpg
 
rmchrgr said:
Of course because it was essentially a truck/van/station wagon engine. They put them in Dusters and Dart Sports because they needed 'something' to replace the 340 with to sell to the 'youth market'. Imagine if they went the opposite direction and tried to push the 318 instead? Logic says the 360 was the only choice in that situation, (thankfully) regardless of how toothless it was at the time.

Most Big 3 engines in the mid '70s were boat anchors, not just Chrysler products.
Click to expand...

Yup!
I always tell my adult sons this: Stock means diddly squat, it's what you build not buy.
Awhile back I saw a yellow 1975 Pontiac Trans Am for sale with a 455 "HO". in the late 90's, my brother almost bought it, I like Pontiacs but stuck to Mopars.
Factory rated at a whopping 200 HP and 330 ft lbs of torque stock.
1/4 mile in 16.12 seconds... Talk about a turd.
*Edit* Also those Trans am's were a portly 3700+ lbs.
 
Last edited:
360s are turds, 383s belong in scrap piles with 318s, so and so back in day lived by a drag strip, go punch some numbers in some app and see, then others say near stock 383s could run low 13s, and so and so doesn't know what they are talking about, mopars after 1970 were turds until gen 3 Hemis, 400s are off limits, etc etc etc ...
 
340sFastback said:
360s are turds, 383s belong in scrap piles with 318s, so and so back in day lived by a drag strip, go punch some numbers in some app and see, then others say near stock 383s could run low 13s, and so and so doesn't know what they are talking about, mopars after 1970 were turds until gen 3 Hemis, 400s are off limits, etc etc etc ...
Click to expand...
you forgot the whole: my sisters boyfriends best friends cousin had a [blank] that was the fastest thing in our podunk tri country area. weren't nobody cruzin' the DQ that ever beat him-- not even them light in the loafers city boys, big block or small block!

*spits*
*takes a pull on a half drunk warm schafer*
*pulls another drag on camel with 2" of ash*
 
fishmens67 said:
LA 360 was a factory turd. Spin it all you want, Ma Mopars performance switch was turned off in 1970 until the modern hemi came out.
Click to expand...

rmchrgr said:
Of course because it was essentially a truck/van/station wagon engine. They put them in Dusters and Dart Sports because they needed 'something' to replace the 340 with to sell to the 'youth market'. Imagine if they went the opposite direction and tried to push the 318 instead? Logic says the 360 was the only choice in that situation, (thankfully) regardless of how toothless it was at the time.

Most Big 3 engines in the mid '70s were boat anchors, not just Chrysler products.
Click to expand...
Didn't the '74 360 Duster have more HP and TQ than the '72 & 73 340 Duster?
 
fishmens67 said:
LA 360 was a factory turd. Spin it all you want, Ma Mopars performance switch was turned off in 1970 until the modern hemi came out.
Click to expand...
Didn't the '78 LRE run the same ET as the '69 RR ??? LRE heavier and cut more wind????
:poke::poke:
 
fishmens67 said:
LA 360 was a factory turd. Spin it all you want, Ma Mopars performance switch was turned off in 1970 until the modern hemi came out.
Click to expand...
Mid 90's Vipers (1996 per say)... 12.3 @ 116. No modern-day Hemi, just an extended 360!! :D. Faster than any factory 383 or 440 car made before 1970.
:lol:
your sure fun :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top