6 pt bar on street car

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cpearce

cpearce

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Hello all,

I am considering putting a 6 pt bar in my 69 Dart to stiffen car up as it is a 4 speed car and now has 550 hp and 562 torque. I am fully aware that going under 11.49 requires bar, I can however slow the car down to get around that issue. My concerns about having the bar are:

1. Safety of myself and family in car during regular street use. Ie bars far enough from head in event of street accident. Is using the stock belts and bench dangerous with bar?

2. Will the power levels I'm at hurt the car on launch with slicks. ie twisting and flexing. Car has factory torque boxes and welded subframe connectors.

2. Can a proper chassis shop build a bar that is tucked completely out of way and be very inconspicuous? (Anyone have photos of their bar that is hard to see from a short distance from car). Fortunately I have black interior and mildly tinted windows.

I am on the fence, human safety is number 1, but I also don't want to twist up the car. Any real world comments and experience is most appreciated. I've been chewing on this a while.

Car is used 80% of the time on street. Running cal trac split leaf rear springs and pst 1.03 torsion bars.

Thanks everybody, man I find this site informative.
 
Once you install a bar in the car forget about using the back seat. Side bars are not bad to get in and out of depending on the seats you have? I had a Car with a bar then made that into a cage, then sold the car as it became a race car on the street. So now my duster will run 11.50 ish, and will never get a bar in it. Its a street car. I have weld in frame connectors in the car to keep it from bending. Good luck. Plus the bar will add close to 80 lbs of weight to the car.
 
Hi cpearce , my 2 cents . I was a crew member on a street/bracket car , Dodge, running 11.70's . Six weeks installed 6pt. roll bar with Sub-frame connecters . At the 1000 ft. mark at N.E.D. trans split open putting atf. on the slicks . Car rolled 3 times , landed upright , climbed the barriers , landed upright , caught fire . Driver walked away , car destroyed . If you are going to go to the expense of a roll bar please do it to SFI specs. Chrome moly or mild steel is ok . Moly is lighter but requires tig welding . The 6 point in my Scamp is moly with swing out door bars that I remove for the street . Factory belts are good for 11.49 seconds . You can feel the difference . Hope this helps , Tom
 
383Scampman said:
My grandkids get in and out ok , not great . My moly bar added 40 pounds of weight .
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Yes, I was intending on using moly. My children are 4 and 8 at this time. Do you have photos of your setup?
 
weld-in frame connectors. If your 80% street and it's a family toy (A+ to that), then skip the cage. Your not going crazy with kids in the car anyways, and kids grow in a hurry. On test and tune nights, sometimes they will look past a low 11 second street car without a cage at certain strips. Shoot, you can always run 9's once :D
 
Safety should ALWAYS be #1 priority,when i first built my car I had a 6-point installed along with the frame connectors..my car is mostly track now but I do take it for a blast around town every now and then,my 13 year old fits in the back seat no problem,I had mine custom built the way I wanted it..If you think your going to run quicker then 11.50 PUT it in tracks that I run at will kick you out if you go quicker without one and I applaud them for that..safety first!!
 
stroked340 said:
Safety should ALWAYS be #1 priority,when i first built my car I had a 6-point installed along with the frame connectors..my car is mostly track now but I do take it for a blast around town every now and then,my 13 year old fits in the back seat no problem,I had mine custom built the way I wanted it..If you think your going to run quicker then 11.50 PUT it in tracks that I run at will kick you out if you go quicker without one and I applaud them for that..safety first!!
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I completely agree with the safety priority, this is a large basis for my concern. A street accident without helmets on worries me with a bar. I realize in this world it's all about trade offs, I'm trying to determine which danger might be more concerning. Hitting bars with head at 30 mph, or a track accident at even 12 second range wih out bar.
 
Putting in a 6 point bar is only one part of a safety system that is designed to work together.

Personally, I don't believe it's a good idea if you are going to rely on factory seatbelts to restrain the occupants.

But really, it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other. From a collision standpoint these cars were never very safe anyway. If you install a 6 point and use the factory belts, it will just move around "what kind of crash is safer".

What I'm saying is.... A crash that would have killed you without the bar may allow you to live now that you have the bar. But, a crash that you would have walked away from, without the bar, now may leave you brain dead with the bar.
 
If you really want to be safe, and practice putting safety FIRST, quit racing :D
:lol:
Peddle to the metal = safety second. No matter what you spend.
I'm ok with that.....
 
1968FormulaS340 said:
Putting in a 6 point bar is only one part of a safety system that is designed to work together.

Personally, I don't believe it's a good idea if you are going to rely on factory seatbelts to restrain the occupants.

But really, it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other. From a collision standpoint these cars were never very safe anyway. If you install a 6 point and use the factory belts, it will just move around "what kind of crash is safer".

What I'm saying is.... A crash that would have killed you without the bar may allow you to live now that you have the bar. But, a crash that you would have walked away from, without the bar, now may leave you brain dead with the bar.
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Yes it is a tough choice for sure, a person try to make the right decision but so many factors involved. I have no issues at all with slowing car down slightly at track to comply with rules, but I don't want to bend car. My car is a solid rust free car to start with so the frame connectors should have made it quite sturdy. I can sure notice difference pulling up curbs and driveways.
 
318willrun said:
If you really want to be safe, and practice putting safety FIRST, quit racing :D
:lol:
Peddle to the metal = safety second. No matter what you spend.
I'm ok with that.....
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Lol, true story
 
Chapter 3 : I don't have pictures of my roll bar because my garage is too dark and the door bars are removed to work under dash . However, I recommend contacting chassis builders and most of them will help you decide . Mine was done by DMR but close by is Tube Chassis Designz and Hall's , Dan Page race cars is also nearby . I have a roll bar, not a cage . A cage is 10 or more points . My main loop lines up with the window divider between front and back window and is painted interior color which helps it appear less obvious . My rear down bars go through the speaker holes and the package tray is scribed around the tubes . Looks great . BTW my g-kids are 6,7,7,9,12, 13. The 13 year old loves it (girl) . She wants to drive . Cracks me up . Later, T
 
I'm a rally tech inspector and I always advise people to be very careful in putting bars in cars that see street use. Your head(s) will go all sorts of places that you would never imagine in an accident, and it does not take much of a fender bender for your head to end up in the bar. I know one guy with a plate in his skull from this. (And this does not count possibly broken bones....)

For family use, I would strongly advise against it, even though I know that some may get all riled up at this position. The reality of what can and has happened should guide everyone to see the very real possibilities of cracked skulls. Weight added, experiences on the track, and whether it impedes entering or exiting have absolutely nothing to do with this aspect of what the OP is concerned about. This issue should be a separate decision point that can nix a bar on the street by itself. Make your own choice as to the risk that you find acceptable PLUS considering the very high cost of the consequences if it turns out badly.

The OP is very smart in asking this question. I would advise that you look at this as completely separate decision to make, and not put it into a mix of tradeoffs with the other factors.
 
I would not use a bar in a street car or at least not the same bar that a race car would use. Roll bars and cages are great at saving lives on the track but a relatively minor accident can become fatal when a non helmeted head bounces off a steel bar. If you do go with a bar on a street car make sure you have lots of clearance to body parts and head Wrap any place that could potentially heterogeneous someone's head with plenty of roll bar padding. If it were me I would keep the bar and hoop back nehind the driver and passenger seat and use generous amounts of roll bar padding.

Other option is to tell all who drive or ride in your car they have to where helmets.
 
of course there is always the bolt-in hoop and bars with welded re-enforcement plates in the floor. They make some slick bolt together connections

best of both worlds for the street / strip car.
 
HemiDenny said:
of course there is always the bolt-in hoop and bars with welded re-enforcement plates in the floor. They make some slick bolt together connections

best of both worlds for the street / strip car.
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Anyone make a nice one for a Dart?
 
Mine is pretty custom. Made with custom, swing out doors.

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I would not bother with the bar if you are carrying passengers, to hard for them to get into the car and you run the risk of hurting someone if they hit their head on a tube.

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cpearce said:
Only issue is I don't see one for Mopar A body. Darn aftermarket only cater to gm and ford, then again those guys need a lot of help. Lol
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Thats because they know that no mopar owner would pay $ 4000 for a roll cage
 
cpearce said:
Only issue is I don't see one for Mopar A body. Darn aftermarket only cater to gm and ford, then again those guys need a lot of help. Lol
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been Mopar hot roddin since the early 70s.....same three rules still apply

rule #1 in the Mopar world.....if they make it, it don't fit
rule #2 in the Mopar world.... if they make it, it costs 4 times than the Chebby/ Furd stuff
rule #3 in the Mopar world..... better figure out how to make it yourself....so it fits and doesn't cost a fortune

good or bad / right or wrong......we are a special breed.
 
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