68 Barracuda complete brake

[Joker13]

Since I am doing front and rear suspension on my 68 Barracuda, I am going to do a complete brake job. Car came w 318 drums all around. I am planning to keep it as drums and small bolt pattern.

Any suggestions for upgrading to have any more power or reliability keeping the drums?
Any suggestions on master cylinder types, brake booster, splitter, cylinders?
Types of brake line to run?

New drums- Year One, Summit, Dr. Diff? Brands to look for/avoid
Shoes

Any information will help- it's my first time doing a complete redo

 

[Ottmundr]

Since I am doing front and rear suspension on my 68 Barracuda, I am going to do a complete brake job. Car came w 318 drums all around. I am planning to keep it as drums and small bolt pattern.

Any suggestions for upgrading to have any more power or reliability keeping the drums?
Any suggestions on master cylinder types, brake booster, splitter, cylinders?
Types of brake line to run?

New drums- Year One, Summit, Dr. Diff? Brands to look for/avoid
Shoes

Any information will help- it's my first time doing a complete redo

Talk to Cass at Dr. Diff, Helpful guy.

 

[Mattax]

My advice, only change what needs to be changed.
Brake fluid - replace it. Over time it absorbs moisture, kindof good and also bad, and looses its anticorrosion buffering - which is just bad. Valvoline DOT 3/4 is has been my favorite.

OE drums in good condition, keep 'em. A little damage, and not at the maximum diamter, have them turned just enough to get a good new surface.

Being that this 2017, and your car is a 1968 take a look at which shoe and hardware are on the car. Then decide what to buy assuming the shoes need replacing.

Its a good idea to use all new springs.

If someone has changed the hardware and shoes to the '69 style, and you're not trying to be 100% correct, then stick with that. The tabbed shoes provide a greater surface area so will reduce wear on the contact points with the backing plate.

If it actually has the correct shoes and hardware for '68, then get those relined or at least hang on to them.

If you're getting real picky, shoes should be arced to the drum. Not many places do this. Rochester Brake and Clutch is one. Another is Porterfield. Rochester may be worth talking with if you want something relined. Porterfield is generally more for racing although I'm using their street R4S lining on my rear shoes as well as the front pads.

When I last was driving and autocrossing a car with all four drums my preference was strongly toward semi-metallic linings. But I didn't know about the specialty places then - and not sure I would have/could have ponied up. My disappointment with the parts store's limited choice (way pre-internet) was hit the junkyard and sometimes I lucked out. So if you're not doing Porterfield or Rochester (or similar), my suggestion is to look at for semi-metalics with the best friction rating you can find. Unfortunately, about the only way to find the friction rating is look at the shoes yourself or contact the manufacture.

You shouldn't need any performance enhancing devices with your cars drums. The duo-servo design helps amplify the braking force. Take your time, look at the pictures and all the tech tips from Chrysler to get everything just so and they will work great.

 

[Joker13]

My advice, only change what needs to be changed.
Brake fluid - replace it. Over time it absorbs moisture, kindof good and also bad, and looses its anticorrosion buffering - which is just bad. Valvoline DOT 3/4 is has been my favorite.

OE drums in good condition, keep 'em. A little damage, and not at the maximum diamter, have them turned just enough to get a good new surface.

Being that this 2017, and your car is a 1968 take a look at which shoe and hardware are on the car. Then decide what to buy assuming the shoes need replacing.

Its a good idea to use all new springs.

If someone has changed the hardware and shoes to the '69 style, and you're not trying to be 100% correct, then stick with that. The tabbed shoes provide a greater surface area so will reduce wear on the contact points with the backing plate.

If it actually has the correct shoes and hardware for '68, then get those relined or at least hang on to them.

If you're getting real picky, shoes should be arced to the drum. Not many places do this. Rochester Brake and Clutch is one. Another is Porterfield. Rochester may be worth talking with if you want something relined. Porterfield is generally more for racing although I'm using their street R4S lining on my rear shoes as well as the front pads.

When I last was driving and autocrossing a car with all four drums my preference was strongly toward semi-metallic linings. But I didn't know about the specialty places then - and not sure I would have/could have ponied up. My disappointment with the parts store's limited choice (way pre-internet) was hit the junkyard and sometimes I lucked out. So if you're not doing Porterfield or Rochester (or similar), my suggestion is to look at for semi-metalics with the best friction rating you can find. Unfortunately, about the only way to find the friction rating is look at the shoes yourself or contact the manufacture.

You shouldn't need any performance enhancing devices with your cars drums. The duo-servo design helps amplify the braking force. Take your time, look at the pictures and all the tech tips from Chrysler to get everything just so and they will work great.

Thanks. Good points to consider and good info to follow up on.

 

[Mattax]

Do have the tools? You can get away without 'em, but there are two or three that make it much easier to change the springs. Bonus is less chance of damaging the springs with them.

 

[RedFish]

Some aftermarket vendors will ship crap. I wish I had saved pics of the replacement drums one of our members posted. Those drums were so far out of balance that weights alone wouldn't correct so they had machined a lot of material off the outside of the drum. We know there's a limit to what can be removed from the inside/braking surface but evidently there is no limit to what a china man can remove from the outside.
Others have received wrong wheel cylinders and all this leads me to just refurbish the OEM parts when their condition allows. Sure I'll roll the dice in purchasing a brand new master cylinder but wheel cylinders are easy enough to renew. The kits will cost about the same as a brand new Chinese wheel cylinder. I purchased the wheel cylinder hones umpteen years ago so.... I use that and know the wheel cylinder is correct for my application.
I have had to buy new hardware kits or adjusters in few cases.
Many members have sent their dual stage vacuum booster to a vendor called "Booster Dewey" for reman'. I have yet to read any negative feedback.
Good luck any way you go.

 

[Joker13]

Do have the tools? You can get away without 'em, but there are two or three that make it much easier to change the springs. Bonus is less chance of damaging the springs with them.

I do have the tools. i have done drums before, just not on this car. I never did an entire job like doing the master cylinder, lines, etc all at once.

 

[Mattax]

That's good. If you're really intent on going over everything, then sure take the MC off as well as the wheel cylinders. If they've been working fine, I don't see the need. If its been sitting or unknown, that's different. The bores will tell the story. If there are very minor imperfections, some crocus may take care of it. Any serious rust or pitting, its time to hone or replace as Redfish wrote.

Two other item that are worth a good look over. The hoses and the shoe contact points on the backing plates. The contact points, if worn, can be built back up with steel or brazing.

 

[harrisonm]

Any suggestions for upgrading to have any more power or reliability keeping the drums?

I know you said you wanted to keep the drums, but you also said you wanted more braking power and better reliability. The best way to achieve that is with a disc brake conversion. Just remember that no matter how good your drum brakes are, they are still drum brakes.

 

[Joker13]

Some aftermarket vendors will ship crap. I wish I had saved pics of the replacement drums one of our members posted. Those drums were so far out of balance that weights alone wouldn't correct so they had machined a lot of material off the outside of the drum. We know there's a limit to what can be removed from the inside/braking surface but evidently there is no limit to what a china man can remove from the outside.
Others have received wrong wheel cylinders and all this leads me to just refurbish the OEM parts when their condition allows. Sure I'll roll the dice in purchasing a brand new master cylinder but wheel cylinders are easy enough to renew. The kits will cost about the same as a brand new Chinese wheel cylinder. I purchased the wheel cylinder hones umpteen years ago so.... I use that and know the wheel cylinder is correct for my application.
I have had to buy new hardware kits or adjusters in few cases.
Many members have sent their dual stage vacuum booster to a vendor called "Booster Dewey" for reman'. I have yet to read any negative feedback.
Good luck any way you go.

Thanks for the tip on Booster Dewey

That's good. If you're really intent on going over everything, then sure take the MC off as well as the wheel cylinders. If they've been working fine, I don't see the need. If its been sitting or unknown, that's different. The bores will tell the story. If there are very minor imperfections, some crocus may take care of it. Any serious rust or pitting, its time to hone or replace as Redfish wrote.

Two other item that are worth a good look over. The hoses and the shoe contact points on the backing plates. The contact points, if worn, can be built back up with steel or brazing.

Sorry I wasn't clear. I do need to change the MC or something. Something is leaking brake fluid inside the car. I was just thinking it would be a good idea to do every thing, but I check the rear and the drums and shoes look good. I thought maybe I should st least look into parts for when the time comes.

 

[Joker13]

I know you said you wanted to keep the drums, but you also said you wanted more braking power and better reliability. The best way to achieve that is with a disc brake conversion. Just remember that no matter how good your drum brakes are, they are still drum brakes.[/QUOTE

I read several threads here and on other pages and it seems that with what I have and my use that I should be ok keeping the drums. I am on a limited budget so I can save a bit by not doing the conversion yet. What I was looking for was how to get the best power out of the drums. This comes up as there is fluid on the carpet and since I am doing suspension I thought it could be good to do full brake makeover. Leaning the other way now.

 

[Mattax]

Sorry I wasn't clear. I do need to change the MC or something. Something is leaking brake fluid inside the car. I was just thinking it would be a good idea to do every thing, but I check the rear and the drums and shoes look good. I thought maybe I should st least look into parts for when the time comes.

Sounds like a good plan.
Might as well remove the master when you can and see if it just needs new seals or if there is bore issues.
If you get stuck I've got a bolt down top master here - supposedly good when it was given to me, and a bail top that I know leaks but haven't examined to see why.

Drum braking systems have their quirks but they can work quite well...even if you run it at Atco or autocross it at Bader. The 10" drums that came with a 318 are decently sized.

 

[Joker13]

Sounds like a good plan.
Might as well remove the master when you can and see if it just needs new seals or if there is bore issues.
If you get stuck I've got a bolt down top master here - supposedly good when it was given to me, and a bail top that I know leaks but haven't examined to see why.

Drum braking systems have their quirks but they can work quite well...even if you run it at Atco or autocross it at Bader. The 10" drums that came with a 318 are decently sized.

Planning on making some passes at Atco before end of season to get a time and then go from there. Saw you're in Philly. Do you go to Atco?

 

[Joker13]

Sounds like a good plan.
Might as well remove the master when you can and see if it just needs new seals or if there is bore issues.
If you get stuck I've got a bolt down top master here - supposedly good when it was given to me, and a bail top that I know leaks but haven't examined to see why.

Drum braking systems have their quirks but they can work quite well...even if you run it at Atco or autocross it at Bader. The 10" drums that came with a 318 are decently sized.

It's good to know that there is someone local who may be able give info if I run into issues.

 

[Mattax]

Planning on making some passes at Atco before end of season to get a time and then go from there. Saw you're in Philly. Do you go to Atco?

Never run there, just figured it was closest to you. I've run up at Maple Grove and years ago at Englishtown and Island Raceway. I should look at Atco's schedule. My play time with the car has mostly been autocross. This fall I got a track day in at NJMP on Lightning.