Body Prep Process

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70dart

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I am in the process of doing some prep work on the 70 swinger and am at a loss here with what I need. If anyone can shed some light on this for me it would be greatly appreciated. I am down to bare metal now and the roof had some pitting under the vinyl. Should I first spray with a rust converter to inhibit the rust then skim coat it. If so what should I then use for primer. Is the high build sandable primer used on top of another primer to give you a workable coating. If not what is the correct order of materials to use. Any help with this would be greatly appreciated. I want to do this right the first time and would like my paint to have a mirror like finish if possible.

Has anyone here had a satin finish paint scheme done on their ride, it is a route that I was possibly entertaining. I saw Chip Foose do a two tone blue ford falcon(oops theres that F word) about a year ago and it seemed pretty cool. I wondered what the finish looks like up close and personal. Thanks for any help you can give on this subject guys. It sucks being a NEWB!!
 
If you are at bare metal you should put down a coat or two of self etching primer or an epoxy primer. Epoxy primer is the better choice, it is not hydroscopic like other primers so it protects the metal from moisture but of course it's quite a bit more expensive. After that you want to use a high build primer/surfacer for all your block sanding.
 
i agree with dgc333 - epoxy primer and surfacer.... and sand away till its streight!
 
The first thing you need to do is address the pitting in the metal. Use about 80 grit sandpaper to remove as much of the rust as possible. If there's still rust in the pitts, then you'll need to get a phosphoric acid type product to remove the remaining rust. There's Ospho, Pixlex, Dupost Metal Prep (5017s I believe), etc., all the paint companies have their own version of this product. Just ensure that you follow the directions on the container when you use these products. Rust inhibitors don't remove rust, they just encapsulate it, so I don't think that's a very good option. Once you've completely removed ALL of the rust, spray on 2 good coats of Epoxy primer, followed by 2 or 3 coats of high build primer surfacer and sand away. Are you putting a vinyl roof back in place of the old one?
 
epoxy primer is primer designed not to sand? why would you use that(plus its expensive $50 for a qt.)? cause its thicker i presume maybe?
 
I think it was said a couple of posts ago. It doesn't let moisture back at the metal as the regular primers do. Plus I believe it is a stronger primer.
 
Tony gets the prize. :) It's the only primer that is really waterproof, within limits of course. Also, you can protect your freshly sanded panels from rusting with the epoxy, then you can do your polyester filler (Bondo work) right on top of the epoxy. You can't/shouldn't do that with any other type of primer.
 
Thanks for the info guys, I greatly appreciate it. Oldvart I am putting the vinyl roof on again, I like the looks! The rust was just surface rust as there was moisture under the old vinyl. I used a nylon grit bristle brush drill attacment to deal with the rust and strip the roof bare. They work well and strip fairly quick, much faster then the wire brush attachments and they do not harm the surface but leave a nice smooth finish. So no to the rust converter coating, I have rust remover from Eastwood I can use, then 2 good coats of Epoxy primer, I am using metal to metal to fill any imperfections in the metal then, I will spray 3 good coats of high build sandable Evercoat primer. Does this sound like the route to go? Thanks for all of your input guys, your knowledge is awesome. :dontknow: I like to do my research and get opinions first I hate doing things twice and can barely afford to do it once. So the right way works for me it will save me headaches down the road. :salute:
 
Sorry guys I forgot to ask if I need to use a sealer of some type between the Metal to Metal skim coat and the high build primer? Or after the high build primer is sanded prior to finish, thanks again guys you ROCK! :headbang:
 
I've allways used the Self-Etching primer followed by the High Build Primer. Hey I learned something! I didnt know the epoxy primers seal out moisture. I may just consider using it since i'm about to strip/bodywork/paint the Duster.
 
Thanks 75Greenduster, Thats what I thought but just wanted to make sure. Eric_S68 I didn't know about the epoxy primer and moisture either, I always thought you needed self etching for bare metal, but I guess not. This is great to know guys, thanks again for your knowledgable advice on this matter, I really appreciate it!! :notworth:
 
The epoxy primers adhere well to bare metal. If you do not go with the epoxy the primer you do use will need be self etchining where it goes over bare metal.
 
One of the great things about epoxy primer is that you can use it as your base on bare metal, then just before you do your paint you can reduce the epoxy primer 10% and use it as your sealer. Great stuff!
 
Hey thanks guys that is good to know. So will reducing the epoxy primer to use as a sealer allow for a deep shine paint job if I happen to go that route? :-k
 
Before you get started, you might also want to take a look at Bondo Mar-Hyde's "One-Step Rust Converter" for the base application (after you clean up the existing rust). From what I understand, this will convert the existing rust and then you can bondo right over this stuff.

http://www.bondo-online.com/catalog_item.asp?itemNbr=300

They have spary cans too.

3510 - 4 Oz Areosol
3512 - Pint
3513 - Quart
3514 - Gallons
 
70dart said:
Hey thanks guys that is good to know. So will reducing the epoxy primer to use as a sealer allow for a deep shine paint job if I happen to go that route? :-k
Click to expand...

Reducing/Diluting the primer will allow you to put a "flatter coat" aka less orange peel, less sanding. The "deep shine" comes from painting a basecoat, clearing it. waiting 2 weeks or so, block sanding it, re clearing it and buffing to a nice shine..Then it looks nice...
 
As Eric said, reducing the epoxy primer allows it go go on smoother and flow out to an almost shiny finish. It is used just prior to laying down your first coat of paint, and actually serves a couple of purposes. If you've done a lot of bodywork and end up with different colors of primer/plastic filler, etc, the sealer gives you a consistent color under your base coat. It will also fill in a lot of small sandpaper scratches, giving you a better base for your color, especially if you're using a metalic type paint. It also prevents some of the solvents in the final paint from being absorbed into the plastic filler and primer which can cause bullseyes from plastic filler to be visible in your final paint job.
 
You can also use the PPG DP epoxy primers with DL16 thinner as a sealer. Read the can. I usually turn the air pressure down on the cheapo spray guns to get better paint transfer. Try around 15-20 lbs. If it spudders then up the pressure a few pounds til it sprays evenly. You can get cheap HVLP guns from Harbor Freight that work well too. Be sure to use a good inline air filter. If you have ever stripped paint off of a car and seen rust under the primer...water/moisture in the line is what can cause that.
I prefer the Dupont Metal Prep over the other rust inhibitors. Use a spray bottle to apply it. And be sure and wipe it off thoroughly after wetting the metal. If the Metal Prep dries chalky or sticky then the paint usually will not stick.
 
Thanks for the info greatly apreciate it. I am certain I will be back with more questions once I get the process started. Kind of at a stand still right now with things being so busy. Hope to get at it again soon! Thanks again.
 
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