Changing starter

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HMX Dave

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OK...first dumb question thread for me...
I've been fiddle fartin' trying to get this 451 to start and idle nice. Based on some research, it turns out that big cams like lots of initial timing. Cam is a Comp 23-633-5 (23-633-5(Three Bolt) - Drag Race Mechanical Flat Tappet Camshafts ) So I've gone from the small bushing in the MSD distributor (28 degrees adv) to the biggest bushing (18 degrees)...this helped a bunch, but still not great. So now I have the distributor pinned and running a MSD start and step. Total timing set at 35 degrees. (dyno sheets claim best power at 6100 rpm and 35 degrees)Starts fine (cold) and idles much better. We have the power valves blocked off and it is now idling not bad at 1100-1200. On hot re-start it seems to drag still. Battery is a new Optima Red. Alternator is a new Powermaster. The electrical end is fine. Doesn't seem to matter if I have the start and step set at 10, 5, or 20 degrees. My conclusion is that the starter is probably heated up too many times and on the way out. I have TTI headers and for the life of me, it looks like the engine has to come out to change the starter. Things are TIGHT down there. If I take out the flange bolts and undo the collectors, is there any chance I can remove the starter?

Edit: car has manual steering with Flaming River box, stock type front susp and crossmember, 727 trans.
 
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My experience with a freshly built motor and headers. I built a 440 with 9to1 comp.and not too radical of a cam. I went for a drive and being a stick car stalled it. I couldn't start it for an hour till it cooled down. The headers heated the starter so bad with a jump still wouldn't crank. The starter was from a police car that was rebuilt by a reputable shop. It lasted me 10 years on a 440 and 5 years on a crate 472 hemi. So I cut the headers off and went with stock manifolds on the 440 and the hemi and never had another problem with the starter. I just recently put the mini starter on the hemi.
 
When you increase your initial advance for your set up the starter may sound like you described. So I would not worry about it , yet. I seem to have a happy engine when I use a big cam with the timing set at 20 degrees initial on a electronic stock style distributor. I use the plates made by FBO to dial the distributor in to not give more than 35 mechanical advance. FBO has other bushings for the MSD distributors that would help you increase the initial timing further without going over 35 total mechanical. I have found with MSD distributors they don't give you the bushings with the distributors to allow for more dialing in of the timing

FBO Performance Ignition for all Makes, Muscle Cars, Street Rods, Race Engines. Specializing in Mopar Ignition Products, Distributors to Computer control ECU's.  Home of the HRR688
 
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I went for a good long-ish drive today. I have the MSD Start and Step set at -15 degrees. Cold start is no issues...2-3 pumps, fires right up. So then I cruise 15 miles or so, putt, putt into store parking lot. Come out 5 min later and it's real hard starting. It's like the MSD gizmo really doesn't do anything. I'm leaning towards a FBO bushing and going back to a weighted distributor.

Just for FYI: I did my cruise with no hood....temps stayed around 175.
 
HMX Dave said:
I went for a good long-ish drive today. I have the MSD Start and Step set at -15 degrees. Cold start is no issues...2-3 pumps, fires right up. So then I cruise 15 miles or so, putt, putt into store parking lot. Come out 5 min later and it's real hard starting. It's like the MSD gizmo really doesn't do anything. I'm leaning towards a FBO bushing and going back to a weighted distributor.

Just for FYI: I did my cruise with no hood....temps stayed around 175.
Click to expand...

My 440/505 does the same thing when I go to restart quickly after I shut it off. I have to hit the key a second time and it comes to life so far. I have the headers wrapped, (hate that stuff), and the starter wrapped also. Thinking about unwrapping the starter, and making a heat shield type guard to keep header heat off it. A guy on this forum suggested the starter wrap may be holding heat in .
I can pull my drivers side plugs and header loose and get the starter out, really a pain in the a-- tho .he
 
I am having the same hot soak problem, have to wait 10 min after a run for the car/starter cool down. Wrapped the starter which didn't help but haven't tried wrapping the TTI 2" header tubes around the starter.

Any suggestions on the smallest starter that can get the job done on a 10.5:1 motor? Currently using s Mopar mini starter from a V8 Dakota but was hoping to have a smaller started that would provide better clearance.
 
On a side note, someone on here, might be Crackedback, made some shorter advance bushings for those dist's
 
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