Finally broke into 11's

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Cazbah362

Cazbah362

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Well - 11:98 at the Fallon TopGun Raceway last night. Nice thing is DA last night was a bit higher than 6000.

My goal is to have a car which is street legal (cruiser) and can hit 11:49 for my area. Two seasons ago I started the car as a learning/therapy fun project, just a big block Dart, no real direction. Since then it has changed a lot and I have learned a lot - some good, some frustrating-some just DUHHH.

Also another goal is to have it roadworthy as much as possible, no hanger/trailer queen. So work and driver, regardless of how ugly.

Here is the car today:

71 Dart, 440, 727, 8 3/4. 440 is about 400-425, with a 175 single state nitrous. factory steel head to toe, factory interior, /6 T-bars, cal-tracks.

Here are the issues I have, any comments or suggestions would be great. I am a beginner, I am not chasing points, and at this time I really like the heads up racing. One of the best feelings is smoking the tuner kids, guys with super-charged Mustangs, new Camaros, or the ones who ask "what kind of car is that?" - etc. Worst feeling - being smoked by the tuner kids, guys with super-charged Camaros -

So here here are the issues I need to address, any insight is always appreciative.

Nitrous - 175 is too much off the line, need to put on a delay timer (1.79 60') - Just purchased a Leash nitrous timer. Looked nice, easy to use and safe insurance for off the line

3 passes are all you get - bring extra bottle, maybe a timer will make it 4 passes?

B&M or flexible cables suck - but whats an alternative. I have a front load shifter, would like a rear load, not sure want to spend the cash. 2 cables, 2 different routing points, both failures. Current route is working better, plastic heats up and changes shifter gate.

Drag - Brakes drag, need to take time to adjust them (PITA's) - I have 73 discs on front, no issues, a proportioning valve from the 73 when I did the swap. Rear brakes are SSBC stainless on a narrowed 8 3/4. Pads seem to drag a bit, especially in reverse. This car is a pain to push because of this.

Thanks for the thread space and vent time - and appreciate any comments or insight.

CP
 
Ok, but was that with the nitrous? If you have a true 400-425 horsepower 440, with the torque to go along with it, you will easily run high 11's without the nitrous. If you used a 175 horsepower shot to get 11.9's, then your 440 is kicking out about 250 horsepower. Please clarify... Oh, if you were running at 6000 ft, this would factor in a bit, but not sure what elevation you were running...
 
318 - Elevation is roughly 4800, density altitude was 6200/6300. I agree if it was sea level times would be a lower.
 
Ok. More details on the engine (carb, cam, etc) and what gears and torque converter. If you say its a roughly 400-425 horsepower at sea level build, then your probably at 340-350 horsepower in the elevation. What does it run on the engine? 340-350 horsepower with the 440 torque should be well enough to put an A-body into the 12's. If it is not running on the motor what it should, do not try to make the difference up with nitrous. I would say I would test and tune like crazy (timing, jets, etc etc) to get it to run mid- 12's on the motor, then when you hit the 175 nitrous, you will bomb into the high 10's.
 
That's close to an 11.10-11.20 at sea level.

Work on the 60', it's roughly about .1 slow for the et. Converter, front suspension and tweaking the caltrac bars/shocks might help.

Cables - insulate the cable with something, zip tied rubber hose, spark plug wire protector/heat shield, techflex, anything to keep heat away from the sheathing.

I agree with 318willrun, get the tune up on engine right, then start hitting the sauce...
 
my demon ran 11.30s at Top Gun...one week later it ran 10.70s at sea level in Sacramento...
 
Cazbah362 said:
Well - 11:98 at the Fallon TopGun Raceway last night. Nice thing is DA last night was a bit higher than 6000.

My goal is to have a car which is street legal (cruiser) and can hit 11:49 for my area. Two seasons ago I started the car as a learning/therapy fun project, just a big block Dart, no real direction. Since then it has changed a lot and I have learned a lot - some good, some frustrating-some just DUHHH.

Also another goal is to have it roadworthy as much as possible, no hanger/trailer queen. So work and driver, regardless of how ugly.

Here is the car today:

71 Dart, 440, 727, 8 3/4. 440 is about 400-425, with a 175 single state nitrous. factory steel head to toe, factory interior, /6 T-bars, cal-tracks.

Here are the issues I have, any comments or suggestions would be great. I am a beginner, I am not chasing points, and at this time I really like the heads up racing. One of the best feelings is smoking the tuner kids, guys with super-charged Mustangs, new Camaros, or the ones who ask "what kind of car is that?" - etc. Worst feeling - being smoked by the tuner kids, guys with super-charged Camaros -

So here here are the issues I need to address, any insight is always appreciative.

Nitrous - 175 is too much off the line, need to put on a delay timer (1.79 60') - Just purchased a Leash nitrous timer. Looked nice, easy to use and safe insurance for off the line

3 passes are all you get - bring extra bottle, maybe a timer will make it 4 passes?

B&M or flexible cables suck - but whats an alternative. I have a front load shifter, would like a rear load, not sure want to spend the cash. 2 cables, 2 different routing points, both failures. Current route is working better, plastic heats up and changes shifter gate.

Drag - Brakes drag, need to take time to adjust them (PITA's) - I have 73 discs on front, no issues, a proportioning valve from the 73 when I did the swap. Rear brakes are SSBC stainless on a narrowed 8 3/4. Pads seem to drag a bit, especially in reverse. This car is a pain to push because of this.

Thanks for the thread space and vent time - and appreciate any comments or insight.

CP
Click to expand...

The shifter cable I had a similar issue with my 440 a-body, was a B&M Pro Stick with front cable route. The quick fix was slipping the cable through a heater hose and taping both ends so it would stay in place. Eventually I swapped the shifter to a rear cable version, no problems after that.

I had 73+ discs on front and c-body drums in the rear. Fronts would constantly seize up and drag, had to rebuild the calipers a couple times. Best fix is either modern aftermarket brakes or modify the stock calipers with stainless sleeves and pistons.
 
451 - Thanks, I like the heater hose idea. I have one of the spark-plug wire insulators on it now, seems to be just an oven wrapper for the cable.

318/Crack - Agree - tune, tune, tune. One issue is in sprigs, DA is 5200, by now it is 6200, mid summer it will be 6800/7200. Tunes change quickly and not user friendly for us novices.

318 - Motor is a factory replacement .30 cast/cast, external balance, low compression and about 30K. Heads are 516's with bigger valves, no other work. Cam is a small hydraulic roller 534 lift I believe, M1, Holley 750 HP, MSD ignition. Cam is installed straight up, no degreeing. (400-425). This is low compression - compression check is 110 on all 8. If I was to change something on motor would be degree and advance 4 degrees for compression. My focus is to get the BUGS out and learn and tune systems, - chassis, NOS, gear, etc. At this time motor is consistent and I agree there's a bit more in it if tuned. Engine goes to 6K, no issues

Trans is spragged 727 with RMVB, with 4K convertor flashes 3800 - just rebuilt. Works very nice under the nitrous - just too much on the 60'. First gear hazes the tires bad. Quick Time Pro's 29x11.5.x15's (13psi) with Cal-tracs are tuning points. 60's dropped from about 2.1 to 1.78 with QTP's and Cal-tracs, still more to gain here.

Keep in mind all the numbers I am giving are with air cleaner, full exhaust, factory steel etc.

BTW - Car was tuned and ran best of 12:80 before went to NOS, then installed Cal-Tracs and QTP's listed above, DA at that time was 4800/5200 60' was 1.98

All - thanks for the input - please keep it coming
 
A-Body - Thank you, that is nice stuff. Wish they would make these cable from that.
 
II had shifter cable problems on a big block Duster. I was running the beautiful ProParts headers. They burned up some shifter cables.Manual valvebody and a 4000 stall stuck out in the sticks in third. Enough said. I took copper tubing and notch it and split it. It became flexible. I wrapped it around all the vitals. Worked good.
 
I've had the cable melting issues in the past as well. I have mine wrapped in some heat reflecting hose cover. Looks like this only not adhesive:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/the-13995/overview/

After that I have not had an issue again.

The nitrous: I used to run nitrous all the time years ago on an 11 second car at high altitude, so here is what I can tell you. Running a 175 shot on a 10lbs bottle will only get you 3 solid passes from one end to the other. Any more and it will start to peter out down track. A 15lbs bottle will get you 5 solid passes, or at least it did with my car years ago with a 180 shot. You should be able to spray it out of the hole and have it hook if the suspension is working well. Make sure you have the front end loose (90/10 shocks) and at least 5" of suspension travel (if possible). The old picture in my sig is from Bandimere back when I was spraying my old 360 right off the line, it would run 11.1 with a DA of 9500+ feet. Bringing your own atmosphere in a bottle helps a TON when you run at high altitude.

I hope this helps.
 
FlyFish - Yes, it does help and thank you, I will keep working on the chassis, I do believe that is where a lot goes. BTW, I enjoy your threads, congratulations on your race -
 
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