hard to get into 1st gear

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screeminDemon

screeminDemon

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Recently my 833OD has become increasingly difficult to get into 1st gear after I've been sitting at a light. Often have to force it, or shift thru the other gears while holding in the clutch and then go to 1st.

Note: it gets worse when it gets hot, stuck in alot of traffic. Even shifting thru all the gears with the clutch in becomes sticky at every gear when it gets hot outside and stuck in traffic.

Is something wearing out? out of adjustment? or just need to try a different fluid? I'm using 90 wt gear oil.

Thanks for your suggestions!
 
Clutch ajustment chk first.
Input shaft dragging in the pilot.
Worn disk.

If there's no crunch when going into gear it's not the syncro's.
(Especially hot)
 
TrailBeast said:
Clutch ajustment chk first.
Input shaft dragging in the pilot.
Worn disk.

If there's no crunch when going into gear it's not the syncro's.
(Especially hot)
Click to expand...

Thanks Trailbeast. I had a reputable tranny shop put in a new clutch disk last fall just before I parked it for the winter. So its not a worn disk.

When you say to check the clutch adjustment, there is only 1 that I know of: the lever that pushes out the throw-out bearing to disengage the clutch. Is that what you refer to?
 
screeminDemon said:
When you say to check the clutch adjustment, there is only 1 that I know of: the lever that pushes out the throw-out bearing to disengage the clutch. Is that what you refer to?
Click to expand...

Yes, that what he means. If more travel is added to the clutch fork and you still have this problem, then the throw-out bearing is dragging on the input shaft. That means you'll have to pull the trans and take a look at it.
 
ok I started pushing the clutch pedal all the way to the floor to get started in 1st gear (normally I don't push the clutch pedal in that far when shifting) and it made a significant difference, so I think your right - I will adjust the clutch lever
 
68gtxman said:
Yes, that what he means. If more travel is added to the clutch fork and you still have this problem, then the throw-out bearing is dragging on the input shaft. That means you'll have to pull the trans and take a look at it.
Click to expand...

Excuse me,

I think you mean the pilot bearing or bushing.

Throwout bearings don't even touch the input shaft at all (ever)
They ride on a sleeve surrounding the input shaft and press against the clutch release fingers/spring levers whatever.
Only a dragging clutch disc or pilot bearing can cause drag on the input shaft.

It would still have to come out though, for either one if it's not the adjustment on the clutch lever.

BTW new clutches need adjusting really soon after a new one is put in, then they last awhile before needing another adjustment.
 
TrailBeast said:
Excuse me,

I think you mean the pilot bearing or bushing.

Throwout bearings don't even touch the input shaft at all (ever)
They ride on a sleeve surrounding the input shaft and press against the clutch release fingers/spring levers whatever.
Only a dragging clutch disc or pilot bearing can cause drag on the input shaft.

It would still have to come out though, for either one if it's not the adjustment on the clutch lever.

BTW new clutches need adjusting really soon after a new one is put in, then they last awhile before needing another adjustment.
Click to expand...

No, I meant throw-out bearing. But my experience is Chebby related. The input shaft on a Chebby goes thru the center of the throw-out bearing and sometime will rub on the bearing so much that the rubbing can even cause the input shaft to continue spinning enough to cause difficulty in getting into first gear. Maybe Mopar transmissions don't have the same potential problem, but that was what I was thinking.
 
All manufacturers are pretty much the same in this area.
Just different designs.
 
68gtxman said:
No, I meant throw-out bearing. But my experience is Chebby related. The input shaft on a Chebby goes thru the center of the throw-out bearing and sometime will rub on the bearing so much that the rubbing can even cause the input shaft to continue spinning enough to cause difficulty in getting into first gear. Maybe Mopar transmissions don't have the same potential problem, but that was what I was thinking.
Click to expand...

No throw out bearing rides on the input shaft, the front bearing retainer has a sleeve that covers the input shaft and that is what the throw out bearing rides on, this way it does not move untill it slides foward and touches the pressure plate levers. Then only the bearing portion of the throw out bearing assembly touches and spins allowing you to release the pressure on the disc, this is where the adjustment comes in when travel needs to be added if the disc is not getting released 100% by the pressure plate which will cause hard shifting. Mopar, ferd, chebby, imports, the theory is the same.
 
one bad 440 said:
No throw out bearing rides on the input shaft, the front bearing retainer has a sleeve that covers the input shaft and that is what the throw out bearing rides on, this way it does not move untill it slides foward and touches the pressure plate levers. Then only the bearing portion of the throw out bearing assembly touches and spins allowing you to release the pressure on the disc, this is where the adjustment comes in when travel needs to be added if the disc is not getting released 100% by the pressure plate which will cause hard shifting. Mopar, ferd, chebby, imports, the theory is the same.
Click to expand...

I don't think I am saying anything different than you. The sleeve you mention is part of the bearing assembly. If the clutch rod is not adjusted correctly, the bearing can remain in constant contact with the pressure plate fingers and spin long enough to overheat, burn off the grease and then start spinning the sleeve. Then the spinning sleeve also causes the input shaft to rotate, causing problems getting it into gear. I've seen this happen many times on Chebbies.

When all things are adjusted and working properly, your assessment is correct, but when something is wrong, as this OP was saying, then something must be causing the problem.

In the end, it seems that his problem was a simple misadjustment of the clutch rod. The simplest of fixes.
 
Is it the original bell for that block. I have seen several clutch & shifting problems here at the shop do the bell not being indexed with the crank. Also causes premature main and thrust bearing wear.

Many over look this procedure and get lucky. They sell offset block pins that can be rotated, Also good aftermarket bells have weld in pin holes to be installed after indexing is done. Just something you might want to look into. Steve
 
thanks for all your input, yes it was a clutch adjustment. It works pretty good now, not perfect all the time but acceptable. ALso helps when I do like Inertia suggested and pull into 2nd then put in 1st.

PS - it was not the original bell housing for the 360 engine I put in.
 
I replaced fluid in mine with Valvoline 75-90 weight full synthetic and its like a new tranny. very easy now
 
dans4door1970 said:
I replaced fluid in mine with Valvoline 75-90 weight full synthetic and its like a new tranny. very easy now
Click to expand...

Thanks for weighing in Dans4door, cuz I've been seriously considering trying the synthetic since I've heard several people talk about how it improves shifting. You were the tipping point for me, and now I'm gonna give it a try
 
I would also give the Pennzoil Syncromesh a try...come in a yellow bottle...very good stuff. I use it in my 4 speed.
 
switching to synthetic gear oil really helped! I highly recommend it. Significant differenct in shifting, and always slides into 1st gear for me now when I'm stopped at a light.

I've always been a stubborn traditional oil kinda guy, but now that I've tried synthetic in my gearbox, I'm seriously thinking about going synthetic in the engine too.
 
screeminDemon said:
switching to synthetic gear oil really helped! I highly recommend it. Significant differenct in shifting, and always slides into 1st gear for me now when I'm stopped at a light.

I've always been a stubborn traditional oil kinda guy, but now that I've tried synthetic in my gearbox, I'm seriously thinking about going synthetic in the engine too.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that synthetic will increase the liklyhood of oil leaks.
If you have ANY engine leaks at all, it will leak WAY worse than with regular oil.
 
also the clutch pedal assembly... there are little white plastic bushings & other parts up in there that can get worn out, sloppy, etc. something to check if you continue to have problems.
 
TrailBeast said:
Keep in mind that synthetic will increase the liklyhood of oil leaks.
If you have ANY engine leaks at all, it will leak WAY worse than with regular oil.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the tip Trailbeast! I have a small nagging oil leak that I'm living with but I wouldn't want it to get any worse. I will stick with good ole crude oil for my motor.
 
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