Intakes, victor or airgap on strokers

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340Duster247

340Duster247

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I know it's been beat to death and dual plain is ussualy better then single plain , but everyone's combo is different so I thought I get your guys opinions.
Will a victor or a m1 be a better match for my set up.

This is a street/strip car. Not a daily driver, sees weekends and the odd car meet.

71 duster
360 stroked to a scat 408. 12.2:1 compression
Eddy OOTB heads (soon to be ported)
Eddy airgap
Holley 750dp soon be 850/950 or efi(undecided)
Tti headers
Lunati 242/252 @50. 533/552 lift. 110lsa
3800 convertor 727
4:30 gear

Spraying 150 shot nitrous (plate)

I'm curious because every time I see and read badass small block stroker builds there rocking single plain intakes. Even at car shows when I'm checking out other street/strippers , I ussualy see a Victor intake.

What are your guys thoughts?
 
I agree with Fred, strokers make gobs of torque down low. Unless you're building a truck motor run a single plane. I've never ran a M1 but did run a Victor on my 408, my intake had a bunch of core shift, I port match so it was no big issue.
 
I'd say with deep gears ported heads and big roller cam and light car definitely single plane and probably ported to keep up. Stock eddy heads decent cam 3.55:1 gears and a 3500lb car probably better off with a air gap rpm.
 
Camshaft has a lot to do with how an engine behaves with the intake choice. I usually choose a single plane on the majority of "hobby" motors that I build. I've never had a noticeable lack of bottom end torque that I could feel that could be attributed to use of a single plane intake. Dyno results could probably show a torque difference, but seat of the pants, never did. Your combination needs a quality single plane IMO.
 
Big volume intake comp here
http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/14360stage3dynotest.php

This is based on FI but has flow bench #'s on some of the larger intakes
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/performance/manifolds.html

Another interesting article http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/3intakemanifoldsflowtestingportmatching3172006.phpas

Here is an article about big mouth heads w super victor.

I have been looking at intakes but for a FI stroker that I will be building in next few months.
Enjoy....I certainly picked up some new ideas/thoughts, even learned a few things.
 
magnummopar said:
Big volume intake comp here
http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/14360stage3dynotest.php

This is based on FI but has flow bench #'s on some of the larger intakes
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/performance/manifolds.html

Another interesting article http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/3intakemanifoldsflowtestingportmatching3172006.phpas

Here is an article about big mouth heads w super victor.

I have been looking at intakes but for a FI stroker that I will be building in next few months.
Enjoy....I certainly picked up some new ideas/thoughts, even learned a few things.
Click to expand...

Hmm,interesting was thinking of trying a super victor on the 360 i'm currently using a Air Gap wonder if i'd pick up any e.t.???...would i lose any bottomend off the line??..
 
I'm curious as well. And what's te big difference between the victor and super victor. I see there discription is very similar. Rpm range ect.
 
stroked340 said:
Hmm,interesting was thinking of trying a super victor on the 360 i'm currently using a Air Gap wonder if i'd pick up any e.t.???...would i lose any bottomend off the line??..
Click to expand...

Without knowing much about your engine other than flat top 360 w mild port Edelbrocks, I would guess that you would probably do better with deep ported Air gap unless unless you spend a lot of time above 6800 rpm. The ported airgap should raise the ceiling 500-800 rpm without loosing much if anything on the bottom. With the victor or super victor, you actually might loose ET. The super would be a better choice if you do get one.

Questions to ask yourself....
How often do I rev over 7000 rpm?
Am I willing to have a less streetable car?
Do I want to look cool or go fast?
Whats my Airgap flow?
What do my heads flow?
 
340Duster247 said:
I'm curious as well. And what's te big difference between the victor and super victor. I see there discription is very similar. Rpm range ect.
Click to expand...

The super is approx 1" taller and has a raised floor, which in theory, should keep air moving faster, which would move more air in same time span ie better flow from same runner. This should equate to more torque in midrange, think corner exit speed or 60' times....both will have same ceiling cut off, when the engine will "out suck" the manifold thus loosing power or at least stop making more.

These manifolds in a carbed application, not FI, are designed for an engine that has intake flow # in the very high 200's to mid 300's. Think CNC Big Gulp Edelbrocks, W2, maxed out X/EQ heads....

Dont get me wrong, they will "work" on lesser(is that a word) heads, depending on cam choice, carb size car weight etc. There are exceptions to this, specially when it comes to custom ground roller cams, displacment etc.

A 408 would appreciate it much more than a 360, even if you kept rpm below 6800. A 5.2 or 340 with big heads and a huge roller, probably short on duration thats used at sustained rpm over 5000 rpm...think NASCAR engines...
 
340duster,

In your case, I would get Super V, larger roller cam and send heads to IMM, Hughes, etc and get the full meal deal.
Your only problem will be trying to get your eyeballs back to the front of your skull, assuming you can get it to hook up:D
 
I've been pondering the same, in the middle of my build now for my 73 Challenger. Mostly strip use, main street duty is driving to the track about 30min away.

Rotating kit is in route to the machine shop now.

340 .70 over (422)
Scat 11:1 Forged rotating assembly, H Beam Rods
Will be running Edelbrock heads 63cc heads (Mild Port)
Lunati 60405 or Similar spec in a solid flat tappet.
904 w/3500 Stall
3.91 or 4.10 gears note sure yet
850XP Holley

I've got a new in box RPM air gap I bought, prior to going with the stroker build. Been reading lots of info about going single plane or staying with the Air gap.

I really do like hearing everybody's experiences and sharing their expertise!
 
Interesting, IMM told me I would probably be better off port-matching my LD4B for my 408 than using my M1. Granted, I'm not drag racing. I'll be doing a lot of autocrossing, some road racing, canyons, and street driving with it so the more torque I can get down low, the better.
 
magnummopar said:
Without knowing much about your engine other than flat top 360 w mild port Edelbrocks, I would guess that you would probably do better with deep ported Air gap unless unless you spend a lot of time above 6800 rpm. The ported airgap should raise the ceiling 500-800 rpm without loosing much if anything on the bottom. With the victor or super victor, you actually might loose ET. The super would be a better choice if you do get one.

Questions to ask yourself....
How often do I rev over 7000 rpm?..not much
Am I willing to have a less streetable car?..sure
Do I want to look cool or go fast?..go fast
Whats my Airgap flow?..not sure its just port matched with the divider milled down
what do my heads flow?..forget they were pretty decent numbers though
I'm planning on sending the heads to Hughes for their fully ported cnc job..
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
340Duster247 said:
I'm curious as well. And what's te big difference between the victor and super victor. I see there discription is very similar. Rpm range ect.
Click to expand...

From what I've read the Super Victor is a better intake only if it's fully ported. A victor will serve you well. Unless you have some serious mismatched parts you will NOT be lacking bottom end.
 
justinp61 said:
From what I've read the Super Victor is a better intake only if it's fully ported. A victor will serve you well. Unless you have some serious mismatched parts you will NOT be lacking bottom end.
Click to expand...

I have never used a Super V, but I have a sneaky feeling that the intake used on the Pro Flow 360 kit is the Super V FI....which I have used quite a bit but only with FI.

I doubt the average person could tell the diff between the 340 Vic and Super Vic. 0-60 ft times would probably be the noticeable diff if any.
 
If you have a stall of say 3400-3600 range then you will be in the single plane powerband. Single plane will give straighter shot of fuel and air to engine= more power than a 2 plane in my opinion especially in our light a-body rides!:)
 
Well I don't know from Victor and Super Victor but I've had the Super Victor and the Victor 340 here in the shop. The thing I like about the Victor 340 is that it exactly matches the 318 intake gasket. The Super Victor more closely matches the 340-360 intake gaskets.
 
I run a dual plane on mine 236/243, ported eddys and 11.5. I know IMM has lots of time in the dyno room, so I'd listen to his suggestions.
 
I went from an Airgap to a Super Victor. Lots of other changes were made in addition to the S Victor.

I can tell you I definitely lost some bottom end, but midrange and higher the S Victor rules! I think IF you have good flowing heads and big enough cam, the S Victor is the only way to go. I was shocked when my shift came on in 3rd gear the first time I wacked it. Real quick.

Don't believe that "over 7000 RPM" stuff. I shift at 6700. Didn't get to the track last year, so no comparisons..

You absolutely will have to port the S Victor. Out of the box the ports are teeny tiny. No big deal though. I've done it.....twice.

3500 RPM and above.....hold the f@#k on!

Oh yeah. You gonna need that 950 carb.
 
Iron Mike,

The ports are teeny compared to what, the 340 victor? According to Edelbrock, they are about .020 narrower and the same taller....98x2.15 vs 1.02x2.04

I have no idea of what your build is, but a more fair comp would have been to swap the manifold only then do some comp tests. If the "lots of other changes" included a cam, porting heads or rockers then it could be one, some or all of it combined together. The V series is the way to go if you have "gone big" with your build. With OP's stroker, newly ported heads and possibly a cam change, I believe he will benefit from either of the Vic's. It appears the Super V is designed for a bit better air movement at lower lifts but without both in my hands at the same time, I couldnt be sure. I think its a newer design too.

3rd and 4th # are W and H of port.

SMALL-BLOCK CHRYSLER APPLICATIONS
#2815 Super Victor 3500-8000 1.21" 0.94" 0.98" 2.15" 6.30" -
#2915 Victor 340 3500-8000 1.12" 0.92" 1.02" 2.04" 4.92" 4°
 
Ironmike said:
Don't believe that "over 7000 RPM" stuff. I shift at 6700. Didn't get to the track last year, so no comparisons..
Click to expand...

from the Hughes dyno test, " Again the Victor 340 is only greater than the modified M-1 from 6700RPM, but by then the race is over. "

It will, given the right combo of heads and cam make more power at 5000+ than AG but only with correct combo, otherwise you will loose mid range power for upper end. I would think if your heads dont flow 280+ then you are wasting $$$ that would be better spent DEEP porting AG or other choice. Your intake needs to flow 5-10% better than heads depending on whos theory you follow...
 
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