Need Help with Vinyl Roof Disease on '72 Scamp

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Fred Scigliano said:
that's all fun till you get down to all the work you have to do. ... BUT With all the rust that I see you better look at the frame, remember it is unabody that means not only that I spelled it wrong but the whole car is the frame including the roof so if you try and glue it and bondo it and seal it, then go and put an engine in there that makes good power. Please don't put your wife and kids in the car and try to go 100 mph or what ever. like I said no harm intended you do what you whant
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You're right of course about the fun... It's all fun and games until you're under the car with sweat in your eyes cursing a rusted bolt. Moreover, I think you're right about the bondo. That's what I originally wanted to do but I no longer think that's a good idea, for the reason you mentioned. I have, however, completely stripped the interior, and it's clear that the only rusted part is the sheetmetal. The frame is still in great shape. And no harm taken! I definitely appreciate a difference of opinion! It helps in making a better decision.

harrisonm said:
I totally disagree. The OP said he was short those skills, and this is NOT a job for a novice. I am highly experienced at this type of rust repair, and I wouldn't want to touch it. All the help and suggestions in the world won't help if a person lacks the skills and tools to do a job.
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I would be (foolishly) willing to jump into this project inexperienced...but It turns out I won't have to! I have a friend that has a lot of experience (and tools!) with this sort of thing who is willing to help out. Probably the only way I could get this done!
 
ScamperTom said:
You're right of course about the fun... It's all fun and games until you're under the car with sweat in your eyes cursing a rusted bolt. Moreover, I think you're right about the bondo. That's what I originally wanted to do but I no longer think that's a good idea, for the reason you mentioned. I have, however, completely stripped the interior, and it's clear that the only rusted part is the sheetmetal. The frame is still in great shape. And no harm taken! I definitely appreciate a difference of opinion! It helps in making a better decision.



I would be (foolishly) willing to jump into this project inexperienced...but It turns out I won't have to! I have a friend that has a lot of experience (and tools!) with this sort of thing who is willing to help out. Probably the only way I could get this done!
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Learning new skills is rewarding. It is great you have someone to show you the way. So much easier. We can read how, we can watch videos, but until we start to actually do these things, the skills are not there!!! We learn by doing, and usually make some mistakes along the way. Many times these mistakes can be corrected and we will not repeat them!!!
 
ScamperTom said:
You're right of course about the fun... It's all fun and games until you're under the car with sweat in your eyes cursing a rusted bolt. Moreover, I think you're right about the bondo. That's what I originally wanted to do but I no longer think that's a good idea, for the reason you mentioned. I have, however, completely stripped the interior, and it's clear that the only rusted part is the sheetmetal. The frame is still in great shape. And no harm taken! I definitely appreciate a difference of opinion! It helps in making a better decision.



I would be (foolishly) willing to jump into this project inexperienced...but It turns out I won't have to! I have a friend that has a lot of experience (and tools!) with this sort of thing who is willing to help out. Probably the only way I could get this done!
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That's great news, I'm sure you will do a great job. And don't get to frustrated even after 40 years I still need advice
 
I was involved once with a roof skin replacement on a 72 Charger. it is doable, but you need a mig welder, patience etc. You can hack the skin off the donor car, but you have to be careful when removing the skin from the keeper car. You will need a flange tool also if you are going past the weld seams on the keeper car. may also need quarter panels.
 
Unfortunately, life intervened and I have not been able to replace the roof yet. I started cutting into it and discovered that, as others suggested would be the case, the rot did indeed affect enough of the frames that I'll have to replace the entire roof. Moreover, it turned out my friend couldn't help as much as he had intended. So I decided to patch the roof temporarily (with liberal use of fiberglass cloth) until I can either get a new body or time to tackle the whole project by myself.

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As you can see, it's not that straight, but I don't really care about having a job that looks professional when the roof is in the shape it is underneath. Also, I'm thinking that if I can get subframe connectors welded in, that should make up for the lack of support from the roof.
 
That will last for a while, at least it is preventing more damage by keeping the water out.
 
Too bad you aren't 4000 miles closer, i would help you save this car..............
If the roof is the only big problem rust wise, then the car is well worth saving.
Cudos to you for giving it your best shot!
 
sireland67 said:
That will last for a while, at least it is preventing more damage by keeping the water out.
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That's exactly my idea. It'll last until I can make it better one way or another.

Dartnut said:
Too bad you aren't 4000 miles closer, i would help you save this car..............
If the roof is the only big problem rust wise, then the car is well worth saving.
Cudos to you for giving it your best shot!
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It's good to know that there are people who'd help out with stuff like this!
Well, the floorpan clearly needs some attention too, now that the carpet's gone. And I'm scared about how the inside of the cowl might be. But that's all stuff I can't see... Anyway, I'm never looking to make this particular car more than a beater, although...

BigBlockMopar said:
If my roof looked that bad I would (go through the trouble to) make a convertible out of it.
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That's been everyone's thought. If I have to take the roof off anyway, why not? I'd actually love to do that, but it would definitely be an investment. Something for me to hope for the future!
 
That rear window panel and the surrounding sides were toast on my '73 Dart too.
A good friend of mine helped greatly with welding-in rustfree panels.
This was 7 years ago. I applied a new vinyl top because I got it with the car when I bought it, but as a result of that (lack of prep/proper painted/sealed roof), the rust bumps are already noticable under the vinyl.
Even on the front above the windshield.
The problem with the original style vinyl is the felt layer which provides the grip for the glue.
It also sucks up water and moisture from the edges and possible pinholes, which does not come out again by itself.

When I'm going to fix that (depending on condition) I'm thinking of removing the vinyl alltogether and apply carwrap vinyl with a vinyl-texture.
 
I would not recommend the "make it a convertible" route. I had actually thought that when we did the roof swap on my car. That is far more complicated than it sounds to do. Convertible cars have a lot more reinforcement in the chassis than your car likely does.

You mentioned that the roof frame was in bad shape underneath. What exactly was wrong with it? I can imagine it is covered in rust, but I would doubt it is damaged from the rust; probably just heavy surface rust. I realized after I went through the trouble with my roof swap that the frame underneath was fine and I could have salvaged it by media blasting it "clean." Then I could have probably just done a roof skin swap. My complicated process was the result of working with a rat rod guy who just wanted to chop **** up.
 
If changing the car to a convertible is even considered and found do-able, IMO adding proper reinforcements to the lower end of the car would seem the least of the possible issues to be encountered.
 
That's a good point about the vinyl. I'm considering putting vinyl over the roof just to make it look respectable. If I did that I'd like to go with something that won't just make the issue worse.

1969VADart said:
You mentioned that the roof frame was in bad shape underneath. What exactly was wrong with it? I can imagine it is covered in rust, but I would doubt it is damaged from the rust; probably just heavy surface rust. I realized after I went through the trouble with my roof swap that the frame underneath was fine and I could have salvaged it by media blasting it "clean." Then I could have probably just done a roof skin swap. My complicated process was the result of working with a rat rod guy who just wanted to chop **** up.
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That's how I thought it would be, but once I cut back the skin a bit I realized that the front frame above the windshield was unusable. The bottom half was still intact, but upper part of it where it is welded to the skin was actually rusted completely through in several places. There is no way to weld new stuff to that. I suspect that the pillars have to be replaced also, so... I'll probably end up just copying you!

As for making it a convertible, I don't think there's a quick or easy way to go about it. From my understanding, rocker panels and torque boxes were the only factory differences, but I'd definitely want at least subframe connectors also. All the body guys I've talked to spoke about making an "x" shaped frame under the car. I don't know if that's necessary but it sure sounds like a good idea.
 
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