Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
Do you have a self service salvage yard in your area that would have 76 back cars?
Pitman arm is hitting tortion bar! Help?
- Thread starter 73moparman
- Start date
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with the wheels straight is the pitman arm going straight back or at an angle?It should be straight back.If its not than the tierods need to be readjusted.Make sure the steering box mount isn't bend upward.Check both sides of the k frame and make sure they are the same from the ground and not twisted.For some reason the pitman/steering box unit is too high.I'm thinking 1" at the end of the pitman.the steering box mounting face maybe twisted where the bottom is rotated upward also.No one knows if the lower(forgot the name)arm the torsion bar is connected to is right for that car or if the bushing for it is good if its wore the torsion bar will be higher than normal but that wouldn't account for the headers hitting.
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
(forgot the name) control?
If anybody knows if a company makes a pitman arm that has a longer drop that would cure tour hitting problem but not fix the problem.may be a tough task.Take yours to a parts store and have them check thier stock for one or go to a junk yard and take yours and look around.Honestly I beginning to believe you have a frankienstien on your hands.You said the car was extra clean and the pictures show that so it makes me wander why that owner didn't fix this already,my guess is he couldn't sorry to say.
Thats what I was going to say but didn't want to cause any confussion if it wasn't it.
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
LOL, you made me think for a while if I had it correct. I think it is, isn't it?? Getting old is BLEEP!
yeah I'm only old in body and my mind is leading the way.:cheers:
Dartman1969
69 Dart Custom
73-76 Linkage
In 73, A-body front suspension was upgraded in a few ways. The bigger b-body balljoints were now employed. A heavier spindle now used b-body sized bearings as well. The pitman and idler arms were also changed to enter the centerlink from the top. The pitman arm is the same as the 73-up b-body item.
Note that the pitman and idler pictured are fast ratio items. These were simply longer than the standard parts, and otherwise equal. Notice the top-down mounting of the idler and pitman and the now vertical mounting of the inner tie rod ends.
Pictures can be seen at http://www.bigblockdart.com/techpages/linkage.shtml
Bill;
Do you have any knowledge of these longer fast ratio items?
~Michael
In 73, A-body front suspension was upgraded in a few ways. The bigger b-body balljoints were now employed. A heavier spindle now used b-body sized bearings as well. The pitman and idler arms were also changed to enter the centerlink from the top. The pitman arm is the same as the 73-up b-body item.
Note that the pitman and idler pictured are fast ratio items. These were simply longer than the standard parts, and otherwise equal. Notice the top-down mounting of the idler and pitman and the now vertical mounting of the inner tie rod ends.
Pictures can be seen at http://www.bigblockdart.com/techpages/linkage.shtml
Bill;
Do you have any knowledge of these longer fast ratio items?
~Michael
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
Michael,
I have no clue about any of the fast ratio items. There are others on the forum that have talked about it and many people looking for the fast ratio gear box.
Bill
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
Dartman1969
69 Dart Custom
Bill;
Thanks for the links. I wasn't thinking when I asked (I got to stop doing that
)The OP has power steering not manual so it does not apply.
~Michael
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
73moparman,
How does this compare to yours? I found this picture on the link Michael a/k/a Dartman1969 posted above.
How does this compare to yours? I found this picture on the link Michael a/k/a Dartman1969 posted above.
gregpurcell
Greg Purcell
Are you using all 73 and up parts? 72 and down had a different center link, idler and pitman arms. Put any of them in the mix and you've got problems. Also is the tie rod on upside down?
gregpurcell
Greg Purcell
Are you using all 73 and up parts? 72-down had different drag links, pitman arm, idler arm and tie rods. Put any 72 and down parts in the mix and you've got problems. Also, is the tie rod installed upside down?
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
We have questioned the tie rod but two examples have been show where the tie rod is in correct. Plus the OP stated it was installed with the taper and would only go in that way.
Racingduster
Certified Welder
Dosent ABODYJOE have a link to a 72 service manual on a web site? wonder if that would help anybody
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
I believe he has it here on FABO. Trouble is the car is a 1973 and has the 73 up spool K-frame. We need a 1973 up manual.
Racingduster
Certified Welder
I was thinking maybe it would help eliminate some of the "other" parts.
I think you guys are all kind right. Looks like its a combo of a couple of issues, wore out bushings, miss matched parts per year and some bent parts. If it were me and I had the time, Id take it all apart,clean it and start over.
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
I think I would find a fully loaded V8 K-frame from a 1973 or newer A-body and go with it to build. Best thing would be buy an unmolesred 4 door donor car if he could find one for the right price. I would think in MN there would be some A-body grocrey getters with rust issues.
Racingduster
Certified Welder
THIS could be an issue. Pull the mounting bolts and check them very carefully for fit. Are they threaded all the way or do they have a shank that might be bottoming out before the steering box is tight?
When the steering box loosens up, it could allow the linkage to shift upward/flex and cause the problem you're experiencing.
Dartman1969
69 Dart Custom
autoxcuda
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I wouldn't just go by pictures. You need measurements. The "look" of these tie rods will very per brand/manuf. And the way the boot hangs over the end will make it look taller or shorter.
This is a 73-76 A-body K-frame. The tie rods are 11/16" C-body tie rods.
The tie rods aren't the issue. There is something else. Start with that steering box that is falling off that car and keep working from there. Figure out whats wrong rather than throwing parts at it.
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
I mentioned about worn bolts and elongated hole in the K-Frame as being a possibility earlier in this thread. Another member thought about the welds on the nuts being broke loose. Another member thought about the bolts having shoulders on them and the possibility they are bottoming out before the steering gear box is tight. The OP has stated that he isn't removing any of the steering gear box bolts until Thursday when he is installing his new one so any additional information there is not available at this time. Another possibility is the center link is bent down in the middle and has caused the tie rod end to be raised.
It would help if someone that has 73 up would be kind enough to take some measurements for the OP to compare. I am still not convinced that the tie rod end isn't too tall and when you look compare these pictures you can see a big difference in the height. A measurement from the top of the center link to the top of the tie rod end being supplied by a member would be a great benifit to eliminate my thoughts. There is a reason that they changed from an ES319 seriers tie rod to an ES401 series tie rod but maintained the ES319S tie rod adjusting sleeve. When members here have changed their pre 1973 drum brakes over to large bolt pattern disc brakes they have maintained their original tie rod set up so that makes me think the tapered shaft on the tie rod end remained the same diameter and length. I have never said throw parts at this car other than using a complete V8 spool K-Frame set up from a donor car (rusted grocery getter) so the OP will know what parts are really there.
Known facts are that the steering gear box is coming loose plus the tie rod end is hitting the torsion bar and headers. It would be logical that one of the problems is causing the other. As stated by another member the steering gear boxes have a known issue of working loose and that is why the threads are loc-tited. If the steering gear box is coming loose and the assembly is moving up the tie rod end could be hitting because of it. When the tie rod end (you can see a worn spot on it in one of the pictures) is hitting the torsion bar it could be knocking the bolts loose on the steering gear box. At this point I think this car has an ES319 series tie rod on it and it is too tall based off the pictures posted below. Now this is my opinion and I may be absolutely wrong and Lord knows it won't be the first time.
Tie Rod End looks like it is sitting shorter to the center link when compared to Pitman Arm. It also shows a grease zerk.
Tie Rod End looks like it is sitting taller to the center link when compared to Pitman Arm. It also shows no grease zerk.
Tie Rod End looks like it is sitting shorter to the center link when compared to Pitman Arm. It also shows a grease zerk.
You pointed out a difference I haddened noticed before. Lots of people opt for C-body tier od ends and adjust sleeves because of their larger then A-body's thread diameter.
That tie rod endin his pic is taller than the stock A-body.
That tie rod endin his pic is taller than the stock A-body.
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