Shifting problem with 833

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Duster Bud

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Hi All,
This is my first post here....so bear with me.
I am trying to figure if I need to rebuild my 833 tranny or if I have over looked something.
First off...I have only had the car (72 440 Duster) for a few days and my first test drive was today and the car failed badly.
The shifter was badly worn when I got the car and I have replaced all the bad parts hoping that was all that was wrong with it. The car shifts fine just sitting with eng off...but under power...it is VERY hard to get first gear. Someone said it was the bearings have gone bad causing poor alinement. I got no noise or whine form the tranny nor could I feel any problems/vibration through the shifter. I can get 3rd easier than 1st but it's really hard to get any gear at times at a dead stop. It's no fun holding up traffic while finding any dam gear just to get out of the way. I'M going to take another look at the shifter & linkage and the clutch throw distance...but feel it's not the problem. Bent shift fork? Or time for a rebuild? Thanks guys, Bud :sad1:
 
Hi Tony,
Thanks for the reply.....
I checked it yesterday and will again today...it seemed to only have a very small amount of play...maybe -1/2" at the clutch arm outer end at the clutch rod. I am new at this 4 speed big block stuff. I was really disapointed after spending $15000.00 on a car that I hoped I could do an easy shifter fix on. Love is blind. Bud

:scratch:
 
I would adjust the clutch linkage so the throwout bearing just releases from the fingers of the pressure plate when the clutch pedal is at its highest point. That way you know you are getting the full travel of the clutch pedal and are getting full disengagement of the pressure plate against the clutch disc. With that, you can rule out clutch problems and focus on the transmission internals.

You can adjust to get a larger free play after that to get the clutch to engage off the floor as it is comfortable to you.

Rod
 
Thanks Rod,
I re-checked the shifter and moved one rod one revolution. I also took 99% of the clutch free-play out and it helped some. I can get it into 1st gear and can shift through the gears. Seems like 4th gear grinds just a bit. Time for another test drive. I took the 4.11 out and put a 3.00 chunk back in (Ford 9"). That was too tall so I will work on the 3.23 or I think I can get a 3.50 from a friend of mine. Thanks for the help guys! Bud
 
Have you changed the fluid in it yet? Changing out ALL the fluids is one of the first things I do with any new (to me) vehicle that comes my way. You'd be surprised at the difference in shift quality you will see depending on the fliud used. Most ode skoo guys will just say "it's a gearbox, use gear oil in it," but that is not entirely true. Maybe for warm weather racing-only conditions. But for cooler weather and street driving some of the better synthetick MTLs are much better. Specialty Formulation's MTL-R turned my 833 from a balky slow-shifting picee-o-cr@p I thought needed a rebuild into a slick-shifting, good-running gearbox.
 
Good idea Ace,

I took it for another test drive...YEAH! Much better with enough throw to dis-engage now. NOT as nice as I hoped for but at least I drove it. Took the guy that sold me the 3.00 (ford rear) out for a test drive...and yup...it was junk....jacked it up and both wheels turned the same way(non-posi)..I guess the spider gears were toasted. Oh well....I didn't like that rear anyway....too tall for 1st gear. I would likely use the clutch up in a few months of driving. I bought a 3.50 off eBay and will put it in tonight.

QUESTION: Is it a bad idea to add any additives to the gear case or rear (non-posi only) ? I put a little STP that was sitting on the shelf in with the rear end grease. I guess it might make the gear case lube too thick. I was just thinking it would help the worn parts some.

I think the gear case oil change is a really good idea. It's cold outside too.

I am getting a weird CAM groweling sound....I will save that for a different fourm. Thanks guys! Bud
 
I agree with Ace on the oil especially with the 833's, start out with a good new oil. It sounds like your clutch freeplay is set correctly at 1/2" at the peddle. Could be a number or other problems such as shifter linkages are in need of adjustment or the brass bushing in the flywheel is siezing to the tranny input shaft causing it to not disengage from the engine when the clutch is disengaged.
Side note, if you turn one wheel and the other turns in the same direction, with the rear up in the air, then it is a posi or limited slip or shur grip and I never use additives in the tranny oil only in the rear end if it's a posi.

Terry R
 
I had the same problems with mine. A decent rebuild with new bearings, and definately a new pilot bushing, cured the gremlins. While you are at it, it's good to check the alignment of the input shaft to the pilot hole. This was quite reasonable(300 bucks) and included all seals, and gaskets. I use Lucas oil in my trany.
 
If you hae a Hurst shifter, did you use the 1/4" rod to align and set up the rods? Also, if it has stop bolts for the shifter make sure they are backed off when testing. If the shifter is sloppy, Hurst has a rebuild program that's really reasonable and will put your shifter to like new condition. And nothing shifts like a 833 and a new and properly adjusted Hurst shifter.

don
 
I havn't had my 67 Barracuda long and was wondering how to check the oil in my 4-speed (I think it is a 833) transmission. I have always had automaticis and don't really know. I guess it has a plug like the rear axle which when it is full it is close to the top or level with the top of the plug opening. I would like to change the oil to some good quailty oil like mentioned above. So how do I check it?
 
demon seed said:
Yup, pipe plug on the side, oil level with the bottom of the threaded hole.

Terry
Click to expand...

Thanks.
What is the wieght of oil that you recommend for the trans?
What is Specialty Formulation's MTL-R?
 
Hey Mullinex95,
I can't help but wonder if your car is one I was looking at to buy before my Duster. Was the car in Ga? Is it a fastback? I know it's is the same color and year I saw on Trader Online....I really like 67 Cudas but wanted a coupe so I passed on it. Couldn't find one so the 440 Panther Pink Duster was an easy sell to my wife. If it has a 440 it can be any color it wants to..I say.

Yeah Guys....What's that special Lube call again and who sells it? I know about Lucas oil ...but that other M-something is something I don't know about.
This is a really good site! Thanks for all the help! DusterBud
 
http://specialtyformulations.netfirms.com/store/nfoscomm/catalog/index.php

It looks like they are temorarily closed, but you can still click through the catalog to see the different lubes they offer. Other than that I'd recommend Royal Purple synchromax for a cold weather 833, or possibly RP Maxgear for warm weather/racing. There's tons of other high quality synthetic tranny lubes out there from XOM, Amsoil, etc. Any new, lighter synthetic tranny lube will be way better than the old standard conventional gear oil or ATF people have been putting in these things for the last thirty years.
 
Thanks ACE !
I'm on my way to the Auto parts store now. I keep swapping the pinion yoke and installing a new seal on all these different ratio 9" Ford Lincoln rear hog heads. What a pain finding the rear disk hoses..still no luck. I didn't put this rear in...I bought it that way. Now I'm worred about the torque on the pinion nut when I re install....I guess an impack wrench is out of the question? Anyone else go to 9" Ford Rears and know the torque setting? Thanks ! Bud
 
Dince the facotry never built a 440 Duster you have a combination of drive train parts that likely weren't married at the factory. One thing that could be causing your shifting problems is if the bell housing was not registered to the center line of the crank. Mopar used offset bushings to move the bell housing around so it was centered. If the bell housing is off then the input shaft of the tranny could be dragging on the pilot bushing not allowing the input shaft to stop turning between shifts.

If you wind up pulling the tranny check the registration before tearing into the tranny for a rebuild.
 
Duster Bud said:
Hey Mullinex95,
I can't help but wonder if your car is one I was looking at to buy before my Duster. Was the car in Ga? Is it a fastback? I know it's is the same color and year I saw on Trader Online....I really like 67 Cudas but wanted a coupe so I passed on it. Couldn't find one so the 440 Panther Pink Duster was an easy sell to my wife. If it has a 440 it can be any color it wants to..I say.

Yeah Guys....What's that special Lube call again and who sells it? I know about Lucas oil ...but that other M-something is something I don't know about.
This is a really good site! Thanks for all the help! DusterBud
Click to expand...

Yep it came out of GA and it's a fastback. It's a good solid car and is fun to drive. I've installed a bigger cam and did away with the white letter tires. I've got big plans for the car but I'm not loaded with money. Congrats on the Duster. I would have bought it too with the 440. I bet your wife want to drive it more than you do. LOL
 
dgc333 said:
Dince the facotry never built a 440 Duster you have a combination of drive train parts that likely weren't married at the factory. One thing that could be causing your shifting problems is if the bell housing was not registered to the center line of the crank. Mopar used offset bushings to move the bell housing around so it was centered. If the bell housing is off then the input shaft of the tranny could be dragging on the pilot bushing not allowing the input shaft to stop turning between shifts.

If you wind up pulling the tranny check the registration before tearing into the tranny for a rebuild.
Click to expand...


The guy (age 30) did a fair job on the transplant...I have done a lot of correcting and fixing. He said he only put 75 mile on the rebuilt eng. The car had a 340 before the new 440 and was a 318 when mfg. Gold Duster with the snake skin roof I think.
I have changed the tranny fluid to LUCAS Synthedic Oil...The clear stuff. Plan on another test drive to see if it helped.
I think you could have a good idea why it is shifting poorly...I just have to keep checking and fixing stuff until I'm happy with the way it runs,drives and shifts.

Thanks for the help! Bud
 
mullinax95 said:
Yep it came out of GA and it's a fastback. It's a good solid car and is fun to drive. I've installed a bigger cam and did away with the white letter tires. I've got big plans for the car but I'm not loaded with money. Congrats on the Duster. I would have bought it too with the 440. I bet your wife want to drive it more than you do. LOL
Click to expand...

I thought so....Does it still live in GA? I came very close to buying it....

Take your time and Enjoy it! :headbang: Bud
 
Duster Bud said:
The guy (age 30) did a fair job on the transplant...I have done a lot of correcting and fixing. He said he only put 75 mile on the rebuilt eng. The car had a 340 before the new 440 and was a 318 when mfg. Gold Duster with the snake skin roof I think.
I have changed the tranny fluid to LUCAS Synthedic Oil...The clear stuff. Plan on another test drive to see if it helped.
I think you could have a good idea why it is shifting poorly...I just have to keep checking and fixing stuff until I'm happy with the way it runs,drives and shifts.

Thanks for the help! Bud
Click to expand...


I don't know the specifics on the Lucas oil you are using but A833's don't like syntetic gear lube. It's too slippery and the synchros just can't speed up / slow down the gears fast enough to prevent gear crunch. If it's a synthetic manual tranny fluid that has the proper friction modifiers in it you should be good to go.
 
Duster Bud said:
I thought so....Does it still live in GA? I came very close to buying it....

Take your time and Enjoy it! :headbang: Bud
Click to expand...

No I live in SC.

Could you tell a difference when you changed to LUCAS? How much does it take to feel up a 833?
 
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