Smallblock wont start syndrome

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7duce swinger

7duce swinger

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I need help again guys. Ive read a few threads and havent got anywhere. Last night my car was running great. I took off the carb, to try out a holley, then put my edelbrock back on. I left it like that. Today i went to start it, and it was backfiring like hell flames out of carb. I took the distributor out redid the timing, and still nothing.i did tdc, compression stroke, number 1 on cap pointing to #1 cylinder wire, crank it and starts after revving it, but it will not idle. Also it has a nasty idle, sounds like not all cylinders are firing, but sounds regular at high rpms. What should i look for? Could it be my timing chain jumped, and messed up the timing? I have checked the timing, and its not 180 out, so any help is greatly appreciated.. Im very frustrated at the moment please help. Ps. Could it be a vaccum leak? Thanks
 
Was it a "older" Holley? center bolt fall down into the intake and get stuck, holding one of the intake valve open?
Do a compression check
How many miles are on the timing chain?
 
You got me thinking about that, then i remembered it didnt have the two center screws. If i get it up to around 1000-1500 rpm it sounds normal. If i start it , it quickly dies. Now If i start it and give it a little throttle, and rev it, it will stay on up until i let go of the throttle then it stalls out. Sounds good above 1000 rpm. Timing chain maybe has quite abit of miles, around 30,000. Could it be the chain jumped a tooth? Also the chain has no slop what so ever. Idk the thumper cam has me believing its normal then it dies out on me. When my uncle comes over tomorrow, ill do tha comp test. Could it be it had something to do with me beating on it last night? I maybe took it to 5800rpm or so. thanks for any help.
 
It was a holley 4160. My motor has 9.3:1 cr, if it matters. All new wires, dist.,echlin ignition, and new spark plugs. The holley isnt on anymore as of last night, right now its a 600 cfm eddy.
 
If it jumped a tooth it would not want to idle and power would be vary poor. if it has one dead hole, do to a intake valve, the power would improve with rpm.

I'm talking about driving it....... or is it breathing like a fire breathing dragon:angryfir: LOL

How long ago did you put the cam in?

what eng and cam does it have?

If you have a vac gauge you could find out if you have a major intake valve leak.
 
Put ur hand over the carb. While holding the throttle open to keep it running ...let the throttle off and see if it will idle with ur hand covering the carb opening some...good way to find carb/vac leak.
 
Thanks 1wild&crazy, ill try that in the morning, and report back. Cudafever, if i try to put it in reverse or drive, it stalls out unless i give it a little gas. If i do that its fine. It will drive perfectly above idle and higher rpms, as soon as i let off the throttle it falls on its face, there is no powerloss at all. I can smoke the tires if i wanted, i just cant keep it on if it depended on my life lol. The cam is a comp thumper cam 279th 486./473. lift Engine is a 318 with 9.3:1 cr, with 596 heads and chrome ign. box. If i recall correctly i swapped the cam in about 5 months ago(memory is bad) but around 5 months for sure..
 
IF that's the case then i agree with wild! you have a Vac leak. Gasket pushed out cracked broke exc.

Use some brake clean or carb. clean to locate the leak. when the eng jumps and smooth out for a moment, you have found the leak!
 
Update... I tried holding my hand over the carb and even spraying carb cleaner to see if the engine smoothed out but no difference there. It did not sound different or smooth out the idle.. Sooooo what i did do, was give it gas while moving the distributor around, and at the same time screwing in the idle screw on the carb ( picture me with one foot inside and in between the door while hanging on to the car and distributor) lol its easy since the hood isnt on, .. that helped some, but didnt quite get it to idle where it use to. So now its idling a bit high @1000 or so. If i turn it off and try to start it, it chatters like a **** then wines down til i try again. Sooooo with all that said...im thinking my timing needs to be fixed. Also the car has never chattered like this, nor grinded so what do you guys think??
 
first get a timing light and see what your timing is at idle and at full advance(with "vac" advance hose removed and plugged
2nt put the Holley back on and see if it acts the same
 
Sorry i havent reported back ive been busy with a 65 buick skylark... Well what i have done, was put a different distributor in, set the # 1 piston at top dead center, line the rotor up with the number 1, and it fires up.. I still do not have a timing gun since i ran over my old one... I have gotten it to start and idle, but im still gonna time it with a gun to get the total timing.. What i was wondering was, what happened to my distributor?? It was brand new, 5 months ago?? What and how, mostly why is what i am wanting to know. Could it have been a faulty dist, Or whaaat?
 
points distributor?

if so the condensor and or points went south, thats what happened.
But you say u have a chome ign box, so im guessing that the pick up went south, check the dist for loose or worn parts.
 
No points, it was a mopar perf brand.. Now im using thr factory unit(electronic). No loose wires.. It has a new rotor, new cap, its 5 months old. I dont understand how it could just go out on me like that. Before i put the factory unit on, i had the car running perfectly (yesterday). Today in the morning, i get up and am working on the buick, i then go to start it up (the dart) not the buick, that thing sucks... It starts chattering , backfiring, and will not fire up like when i had it idling and running perfect the day before.. It seems everytime i would get it going and then turn it off it would go back to being way off. Why would that be? Is mopars stuff not high quality or could it just have heated?? Well its done and fires up, idles at 700 rpm. Has great throttle response, and has no problem starting besides the chatter noise it sounds like starter problems but thats only a year old?Thanks for the help guys!
 
I've seen a couple of cases where a bad starter could cause flickers in the electrical system ( most evident when headlights on ). Could that fault kill a piece of electronics some where else in the system ? Yep
These older builds dont have enough isolation, no diode protection, or even enough amps for modern electronics.
 
Process of elimination. Car running fine, removed Eddy Carb, put Holley on, removed Holley and remounted Eddy Carb and now the car wont run... Did you by chance remove any plug wires like #'s 5 & 7 and switched them around when putting them back on? If not then it to me sounds like you have a vaccum leak somewhere. It has to be something that is being over looked. I would pull the carb off and start from scratch and if that doesnt work perhaps your timing chain jumped a tooth.
 
I was trying it with the vacum disconnected, and same thing.. I never removed any of the plug wires at all, from both the cap and the spark plugs.. I only removed the mp distibutor, and put the factory one back on. Once i did that it fired right up!... I tried spraying water/soap in a spray bottle to see if i had a vaccum leak..it works as well..carb fluid is dangerous!!! My brother did that with his mustang due to a faulty intake and.. Lets just say he didnt have eye brows for awhile.. Well its good now, what i did notice was theres a little plastic clip close to the shaft, i guess to keep from wobbling? Well its cracked and the shaft wobbles.. I think that was the culprit, anyone else think so too?
 
make sue the advance plate bolts didnt slip loose, remember its an adjustable unit.
I would have checked initial timing and then mech advance to see if the initial had dropped and caused the no idle situation.
 
7duce swinger said:
I was trying it with the vacum disconnected, and same thing.. I never removed any of the plug wires at all, from both the cap and the spark plugs.. I only removed the mp distibutor, and put the factory one back on. Once i did that it fired right up!... I tried spraying water/soap in a spray bottle to see if i had a vaccum leak..it works as well..carb fluid is dangerous!!! My brother did that with his mustang due to a faulty intake and.. Lets just say he didnt have eye brows for awhile.. Well its good now, what i did notice was theres a little plastic clip close to the shaft, i guess to keep from wobbling? Well its cracked and the shaft wobbles.. I think that was the culprit, anyone else think so too?
Click to expand...

Hmmmm sounds like a bad MP distributor....
 
OK not timing chain because it runs grate on the road.....right?

Why did you change to a difference carb in the first place? Was this problem creeping in, and is why you experimented with another carb?

If it all started after the carb swap, #1... how did the Holley run.!???? #2.... could the removal of the original carb dislodged some crap out of the bottom of the fuel bowl into the metering of the carb?

Install the Holley back on, with new gasket, and evaluate!!!!!
 
I only removed the mp distibutor, and put the factory one back on. Once i did that it fired right up!... I tried spraying water/soap in a spray bottle to see if i had a vaccum leak..it works as well.. Well its good now.
Click to expand...

Glad to here it,s fixed, ....If it don't start tomorrow, then re read my previous post. :sign3::D
 
It starts up fine besides my starter is possibly going out lol.. The reason i had tried the holley was because i am selling it to a friend and wanted to see if it was in running conditioned.. I just had it powdercoated chrome main body, and silver vein bowls, along with the metering block in red. Everything is new, new gaskets.. I put it on, and it ran fine, idled great only needs the floats set correctly. I did not run the holley on the street by the way. I put the eddy back on and left it. The next day was when problems arised. It ran great on the road, but after it would sound retarded, and not idle, til i put a little more throttle which is what stooped me... 1wild&crazy, i did not know they were adjustable? Ill keep that in mind for the next time! Thanks to all!
 
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