Some of you will be SO disappointed, LOL

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67Dart273

67Dart273

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Or at least I am, LOL. I've always been a 'low buck' guy, and the whole Dart has been "low buck."

So here I am buying "fancy new stuff"

I had played with a used Holley Pro-jection EFI, then found a (used) Holley Commander 950, which I got running "fairly well," ......but......

The low end off idle launch is not that great, and you REALLY need two guys to program the thing. You really do. The logging software only goes so far

I was considering Megasquirt, but frankly, it's fairly convoluted, and by the time you add up all the bits and pieces, AND the fact that REALLY there isn't any actual support nor guarantee of any kind....................

So with the advice of Danny over at the Holley forums I finally pulled the trigger on this, on sale, over at Jegs, IE this seems to be the least expensive path to upgrade from the Commander system.

http://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/55...K-5wtmqvrgCFeV7QgodBlgA5A&CA_6C15C=1797510431

This has more options and much improved software over the old Commander as well as "self learning" (via the software) capabilities

And who knows, this may be a mistake.................

This is not the turn-key system, this is the ECU and harness kit, and all sensors to upgrade an existing system.
 

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This is what I'm currently running.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=209528


IF I had one or two guys to help with programming, I'm sure I could eventually get things done. with the old ECU

This ECU/ harness price is way under the close - to - 2 - grand or more for a "complete" system, really the only things I'm re-using is the TB and the pump. AND with the section of the harness known as the "injector harness," ALL of this can be later used on either a homebuilt MPFI hopefully in the works, as well as a blower, nitrous, or BOTH
 
Congratulations! More sensors with help. My experience suggests MAP, TPS, coolant and intake air temperature are essential for optimal tune.

For tuning the wife drives. I provide tach and MAP gauge for her to read. We use back roads with varied terrains at quiet times. I will suggest various MAP values to hold, while increasing in RPM. I monitor WBO2, and adjust as necessary. It is also possible to verify by holding various RPM, on hills, with MAP following load. All this tuning is done warmed up, and near steady short term conditions.

Accelerator functions are tuned for throttle changes. My system is likely different, it has adjustments for change in throttle sensitivity and volume. The persistence is controlled by decrementing fuel adder with combustion events. It naturally has less persistence at high RPM, a desired feature. It also unloads fuel adder at closed throttle. Correct tuning results in excellent throttle response. My experience is EFI is much better at the low end compared to carbs, and has been proved with dyno experince.
 
Actually Dave the big big difference between the current Commander 950 and this ECU is "self learning" for the fuel map, along with some other features, IE "drivers" and outputs you can program out of the ECU

The two systems essentially use the same sensors, except that the Commander was originally narrow O2, and can be configured with either Holley or aftermarket wideband, and I'm using an Innovate kit. In fact I probably won't even change my old temp and MAP sensor to start with. Not currently using spark control.

Unfortunately, the NEW ECU only uses Holley/ Bosch/ NG? wide O2. I'm not sure yet, other than software, whether I can even output a dash mount A/F indicator.

I'm hoping to play with a turbo "later," as well as go from the 318 back to the 360, although this little 318 is fun. And, play with MPFI along the way.

So I'm hoping the "self learn" features will be a plus

Of course I'll be receiving this at the worst possible time --- the peak of the "driving season," LOL
 
I am a controls freak, self tuning would spoil the fun. :)
My system auto tunes in closed loop, but I choose the values in the 3D WBO2 table.

Best of luck, please let us know how it goes.
 
Believe it or not, I still have the original TBI 950 cfm Pro 4 Injection from Holley in the box, never used complete with computer sitting on a shelf in my shop. The receipt says $895. from Jegs from in 1991..
 
Was taught onOBD1 "block learning". On anything turbo ,blower ,love the feedback and f.I. Still too cheap,to commit.
 
Well, LOL, THAT was short - lived. Just received the box from Jegs.


The "main bag 'o parts" was opened, so not sure if anything is missing

The O2 sensor bag was opened

The CD shows signs of handling -- big smudge on the thing

and a little MT bag with a part no. something about a crank sensor which I don't think belongs.

Jegs was nice enough -- FedX will pick it up tomorrow, all I had to do is tape it back up, and they'll send me another. -----------So------------the wait-----------continues...................
 
Well I hate to see you leave the cheap bastards fold, but am very interested in how much better the new controller works. I wonder if your poor low-end is more due to the TBI being overly large and/or poorer for mixture distribution than MPFI.

I always thought the way the original systems make you input a full 2-D fuel and spark map was overly-complicated and non-intuitive. I think they should have general functional relations that you just tweak, which seems to be how Megasquirt is done. At least they automatically have fuel flow proportional to rpm (almost), since the injectors pulse with the tach signal.

There are usually many of these "never installed" systems being sold on ebay or craigslist. I would berate HotLines for dragging his feet, but I am worse, having two Commander 950's never installed. On my to-do list, but other priorities. I am also a bit gun-shy, having fussed with a Pro-jection kit on one car for decades (not enough sensors to work well). If my wife had her way, all my kits would be on ebay, along with my "old junk cars".
 
No it runs a lot better when cool. The injectors, though, are way too big, and must be operated at low pulse widths. Danny Cabrel, over at the Holley forums, has assured me that the massive airflow is not a real problem.

Well..........just sitting here and saw the FedX truck roar by "on camera." Don't know why'n 'ell he didn't stop!!!!

I may be sorry I didn't "go Megasquirt," but franky, their documentation just sucks. By the time you wade through everything, and add up all the relay boxes, injector drivers, cables, etc, it all starts to add up!!! And whether this goes well or not I might just buy some MS stuff to play with.

If you decide to turn loose of some of that Commander stuff, let me know first, assuming you have the later TBI unit in good shape, and the smaller injectors. Mine is the largest / highest HP they made, hence the oversize injectors.

(Actually Holley documentation is nearly as bad as MS for this system. Instead of having downloadable pdf's that I can print, much of their docs is built into the software --and though you are supposed to be able to print it out, seems to me for the cost of this, Holley could've done a little more.
 
Well yesterday I spent a couple bucks on a little machine called an Asus Eee PC, a tiny little notebook, no CD/ DVD drive. Sitting here on top of my "real" laptop, you can see it's little.

This had no Winhozed license sticker, so I'm not sure if it came with windows, or Linux. Kubuntu was on it.

Anyhow, I sucessfully installed XtraPutrid (for EFI programming) and am here installing Linux Mint for the small time it might see the www and download and transfer files. Winhozed will never see the internet, and won't need virus protection. XtraPutrid will only have the bare stuff needed to program the EFI and some other utilities.

This is a tiny thing as you can see, and very light. Hope it works out, and didn't cost me much
 

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I use a similar 10.1" netbook and like it much better in a car than a larger notebook. About all I can do is hold on to a 15.6" notebook, and try to keep from snapping off the screen hinges when my wife drives fast :).

The netbooks can be held with one hand and and the other used to operate keys. The W7 seems to work well for most applications, if not use XP compatibility mode at run.

The vertical screen size (often 600), is less than some applications are made for, it can be a problem on some applications that require input at the bottom, however there are often keypress options.
 
UPDATE

In the last few days I finally got the new harness / ECU in. Loaded a base file and it didn't run too bad. Then I tried to change a few things, and pretty quick it would barely run. I have no idea what I accidently changes, because yesterday morn. the very first thing I did was to go back to the default "base map" and start over.

I need to learn the new software, but this is already a big improvement. I was unable (by myself) to correct some of the programming troubles of the Commander. Don't get me wrong--it's a perfectly good system, it's just that I'm unwilling to pay lots of dyno time, and since I don't have a wife/ computer operator.....................

This thing already runs better "in the heat of the day" than the Commander ever did. I was in front of a Dodge pu on an onramp yesterday, and whanged it in 1-2. By the time I got down to the end doing over 70, I couldn't tell if it was a Dodge 'er what back there. This was just over 90F yesterday.
 
Del,
I can help you out by email if you want. I will need to know more about the documentation, so sending urls for pdf will get me going. The weather here us too humid for me to paint. I have the time and work for free.
 
Thanks, Dave. I "bitched" over at the Holley forum as well as to Holley. The thing is, much of the docs are NOT online nor are they in pdf. Much of it is in the proprietary windozed style "help" files. However, I have separated that file, it is 10 mb or so. I even found a little program that allows me to open the file in Linux. Probably the easiest thing would be to copy the CD and mail you a copy. It's not software that is required to be registered or activated. You can download the software, although I believe there's some things on the CD that's not in the online file.

I DID manage, finally, to print out most of the stuff that was in the "help" file, but the printer of course effed up a few pages. You cannot print single pages as you can with a pdf. I finally took 'screenshots' of the damaged pages and printed them as photos. They of course are not as readable.

But I've been beat the last few days, and have had little time to really sort out the new software.
 
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