K-Member / Rack & Pinion Steering Suggestions
Maybe I misinterpreted DionR. I was thinking he wanted the newer spindle because of brake availability, possibly what is "used" out there. Just my guess /assumption.
72 bluNblu is correct.....but the point (from the customers / builders) of all rack and pinion / coil over conversions are.
1) room not only for headers clearance but larger engine applications
2) weight savings
3) compact modern rack and pinion steering
1) Yup, makes sense. Some engine swaps that aren't well supported don't have good header options. I would argue that there are a lot of swaps that are pretty well supported, but, that mostly boils down to anything *I* want to run has a least a couple options. So I get that.
2) We've been through this. It's not that much weight savings
- ~50 lbs lighter than the OE K member and suspension with factory power steering (vs HDK w/ power rack)
- ~35 lbs lighter than an OE K member and suspension using a Borgeson power steering box (vs a power rack)
- ~31 lbs lighter than an OE K and suspension w/manual steering (vs a manual rack)
Those are vs. stock mopar parts too, and using 1" torsion bars for that weight. If you install tubular LCA's, aluminum strut rods etc there is additional weight savings to be had. The QA1 LCA's save about 8 lbs. The Qa1 K saves about the same. Just that knocks 16 lbs off.
And yes, if you go OE K and OE power steering to an HDJ with a manual rack the savings is about 70 lbs, but that's not a like-to-like comparison. The OE power steering is a boat anchor, even going from OE power steering to OE manual steering saves 40lbs. If you compare the OE K and manual steering to an HDK and power rack it's only a 9 lb savings. Again, with factory parts, this means you can have a factory K and manual steering weigh less with the right aftermarket parts. But that's comparing manual to power again.
A more detailed break down is here
Anybody running the RMS AlterKation? Was it really worth the cost?
3) Gets you a rack and pinion. Can't argue that much, if you really want a rack and pinion that's the best way to do it. I personally don't understand the need, I think a lot of people are comparing worn out steering/suspension parts to a new rack. But it's a good reason if that's what you want.
geometry rarely comes up, it is more about the ease of achieving increased caster (6 degrees positive, piece of cake), the ability to add crazy camber (auto X) and of course hub to hub width. HDK's exclusive, time proven (now 25 years / zero failures) upper shock mount / chromoly support allows for not only a longer shock / spring combination, but a narrow hub to hub. Adjustable ends on all control arms make it possible to not only fit off the shelf rims, but specialty wheels a customer might already own.
As far as turning radius....HDK uses out of the box spindles, so turning radius is not compromised as with those that modify / lengthen the steering arm.
I own both OEM (with HDK tubular uppers) and HDK personal Dusters and drive them back to back. Both have power steering, sway bars and fresh components with the same alignment specs (6 degrees positive caster / .25 degree negative camber on pass side / .50 negative camber on the driver side / 1/8" total toe. All specs with added 3/4" front ride height . While I have no problem with torsion bars vs coil springs except they are in the way, I still like the precise steering of the rack and pinion, not to mention additional benefits listed above.
Sure, but I can get ALL of those alignment numbers with just a set of SPC UCA's, and everything else bone stock factory. Let alone all of the other stuff I usually upgrade. Now with a 3/4" ride height increase you probably do have a geometry improvement vs torsion bars, because you have more control over spindle heights and stuff. The torsion bar system does not like added ride height, and the best geometry occurs with some modest lowering.
I just hate it when people say stuff like they "need" a coil-over conversion to improve handling. No, you don't. And adding a rack and pinion doesn't make you faster. 10 years ago there wasn't nearly as much aftermarket support for the torsion bar system, now you can achieve a lot of the same improvements with off the shelf aftermarket parts.
And again, thanks Denny. For supporting the community and providing a great suspension set up. I mean, if you want a rack and pinion it is the way to do it, and while I don't want/need one other people do, and that's fine. I just want people to be real about what the advantages and disadvantages really are.
Thanks for the education Guys! Very informative!
Hemi-Denny nailed it for me. 120+ pounds of weight savings, greater accessibility in the engine compartment and very easy to assemble/disassemble . Way better steering feel. After speaking with Bill Reilly, I'm satisfied the geometry is great for my needs. (again not suggesting it can't be done with the stock setup). I can't speak for anyone else but , trust me, I didn't spend all this money converting because it "looked pretty" . BTW I don't have any issue with steering shaft angle. See below as the shaft uses a universal provided in the kit. No binding and works great.
120 lbs where? No sir. Weight savings of actual parts are posted above.
