Substitute wax and grease remover

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ACME SS

ACME SS

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First I need to say that I have painted well over a hundred cars in my life and I always use high quality wax and grease remover prior to sanding, body work, primer, final wipe down prior to tack ragging. A gallon of the stuff seems to last forever so the cost is not an issue for me.

Enter supply chain issues... Since I retired and the stock market is taking a dive, I have switched from the big name locally mixed automotive finishes to a mail order brand. (I save HUNDREDS on a paint job) I ordered some paint online from Auto Body Toolmart the other day and just got an email that it is back ordered. The order included the wax and grease remover I need for the pre-sanding step so I'm dead in the water.

Anyone have a good substitute for wax and grease remover? I don't want to soften the paint with lacquer but I thought perhaps a urethane reducer would not be quite so harsh? Anyways, I'm interested in a good off the shelf alternative for pre-sanding. Obviously I will have the right stuff when the paint arrives.
Thanks
 
George Jets said:
Wash the cars with Dawn Dish soap, it cuts the wax. Rinse well of course.
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yeah thats probably all I need to do. The car was painted 4 years ago with house of Kolors candy and the clear got solvent pops in it. It has never been waxed and only has 400 miles on it since the paint job but I have no idea what might be in all the microscopic craters that I exposed when I color sanded it and buffed it. I honestly never saw the solvent pops till after I drove it into the sun after 2 weeks of color sanding and buffing. It has been a thorn in my side ever since. It's all the super tiny craters with who knows what that I'm worried about spreading around when I DA it for the new paint.
 
ACME SS said:
yeah thats probably all I need to do. The car was painted 4 years ago with house of Kolors candy and the clear got solvent pops in it. It has never been waxed and only has 400 miles on it since the paint job but I have no idea what might be in all the microscopic craters that I exposed when I color sanded it and buffed it. I honestly never saw the solvent pops till after I drove it into the sun after 2 weeks of color sanding and buffing. It has been a thorn in my side ever since. It's all the super tiny craters with who knows what that I'm worried about spreading around when I DA it for the new paint.
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More than likely it is the solvent pop from the clearcoat, solvents trying to get out before the surface skins over. Surface skins over from too hot of a day, too fast dry of a clear activator, then clear solvents got trapped beneath the surface.

Doubt any silicones are trapped in the solvent pops, just paint chemicals which by now have left the scene.
 
George Jets said:
More than likely it is the solvent pop from the clearcoat, solvents trying to get out before the surface skins over. Surface skins over from too hot of a day, too fast dry of a clear activator, then clear solvents got trapped beneath the surface.

Doubt any silicones are trapped in the solvent pops, just paint chemicals which by now have left the scene.
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It was a case of too much air flow in the booth and too fast of a reducer. I had hoped the pops were all at the surface and I could sand them off and buff but they seem to be in the entire clear coat or deep enough that won't work.
 
ACME SS said:
It was a case of too much air flow in the booth and too fast of a reducer. I had hoped the pops were all at the surface and I could sand them off and buff but they seem to be in the entire clear coat or deep enough that won't work.
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Ouch... is it a warranty job?
 
Go to a local paint supplier and buy a wax and grease remover. They usually carry multiple paint lines and probably have one in stock. I paint cars for a living and am finally seeing certain toners go on back ordered.... unfortunately one of my highest use toners has been on back order for a few weeks. If it doesn't come soon I'll be dead in the water for certain cars.
 
Ironracer said:
Ouch... is it a warranty job?
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No, I wish. I do 100% of all work on my cars except tire changes. It's my wifes car and she says "its fine honey" but it is not and it is a reflection of my craftsmanship so I decided to repaint it. Honestly, I have tried to not look at it for 4 years but it just won't fix itself LOL.
 
67Dart440GT said:
Go to a local paint supplier and buy a wax and grease remover. They usually carry multiple paint lines and probably have one in stock. I paint cars for a living and am finally seeing certain toners go on back ordered.... unfortunately one of my highest use toners has been on back order for a few weeks. If it doesn't come soon I'll be dead in the water for certain cars.
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Your right and I know it. Just didn't want to have 2 gallons of it but I can probably get it in a quart.
So I have a question for you. All these pop craters...thousands of them that I sanded into and then buffed unknowingly. They are extremely small but when I look at them under magnification, they are filled with buffing or sanding powder because if I take a sharp dental pick I can pull the dust out. I know it sounds bad but they are maybe the size of a small metallic particle. Will I be ok to spray a 2K sealer over them prior to basecoat to seal in the dirt? I'm painting it with a urethane basecoat/clearcoat which is almost a perfect match of the previous paint.
The previous paint job is house of Kolor clear over a basecoat of tangerine color/trans nebulae binder/metallic additive sprayed over 2k black sealer. (I spared you as many spacey sounding K words as I could).
 
Look for a wax and grease remover called GON made by XIM. It is one of the best I've ever used. Most body guys still refuse to use wax and grease remover before they do repair work and all they do is grind the contamination into the surface or spread it all over the surface. Most paint manufacturers will suggest a water based cleaner first, then a strong solvent wax and grease remover. Dawn and water like mentioned above is a good way to start. I never skip a solvent wax and grease remover due to so many cars now having a ceramic coating on the clear.

As to your solvent pop issues you should have enough material to easily remove them when prepping for the new paint. I have never seen a solvent pop so severe that it would hold any visible contamination like compound dust or glaze. Are you sure this is actually solvent pop and not some form of contamination like fish eyes or oil/water contamination from air lines that are not properly dried?

If you are sanding the clear for adhesion of the new paint and you don't need to seal it why bother? If you can get the panel repaired with say 600 to 800 orbital you can just apply basecoat directly to that. If your panel requires more aggressive sanding to repair the issues then sealing is necessary but I would not apply any product to a panel that has any visible defects from the previous paint job.

Pictures will help.
 
Also one thing everyone also thinks solvent pop is only from clear. They look at over application, temperatures, reducer selection.. but what they don't realize is solvent pop can also come from improper flash times in the basecoat. If the base isn't fully flashed then the solvent will pop the clear.
 
$80+ body shop degreaser is expensive, but it does go along way.
Looks to contain isopropyl alcohol and other petroleum products.
Smells like lighter fluid to me, Naphtha.
Maybe experiment with both, mixed? or not:)
 
67Dart440GT said:
Look for a wax and grease remover called GON made by XIM. It is one of the best I've ever used. Most body guys still refuse to use wax and grease remover before they do repair work and all they do is grind the contamination into the surface or spread it all over the surface. Most paint manufacturers will suggest a water based cleaner first, then a strong solvent wax and grease remover. Dawn and water like mentioned above is a good way to start. I never skip a solvent wax and grease remover due to so many cars now having a ceramic coating on the clear.

As to your solvent pop issues you should have enough material to easily remove them when prepping for the new paint. I have never seen a solvent pop so severe that it would hold any visible contamination like compound dust or glaze. Are you sure this is actually solvent pop and not some form of contamination like fish eyes or oil/water contamination from air lines that are not properly dried?

If you are sanding the clear for adhesion of the new paint and you don't need to seal it why bother? If you can get the panel repaired with say 600 to 800 orbital you can just apply basecoat directly to that. If your panel requires more aggressive sanding to repair the issues then sealing is necessary but I would not apply any product to a panel that has any visible defects from the previous paint job.

Pictures will help.
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Here is a picture of the clear sanded with 1200. The white spots are the craters and I'm pretty sure they are white because of the dust from sanding. They are not fish eyes, that I know. It is possible it was contamination from the airlines...I painted it at a buddies place and I was at the mercy of his setup, although he did have a Sharpe dryer on it and the compressor was one floor below the booth. And like I said before, those specks are about the diameter of a metal flake. I have put a sharpened dental pick in one under a magnifying glass and I removed the sanding dust but wiping it down with wax and grease remover (just got some) does not flush it out.

Edit: I just sanded an area with 400 on my DA and took quite a bit of clear off and they are still present. I'm thinking maybe I should just use a bit of fisheye eliminator in the basecoat as an insurance policy and spray the base directly over the sanded clear if I go over it again with 600?
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You may have to strip that finish off and start fresh.

There is a lot of material on there already with that house of color custom paint job and now you want to go over that with a different product.

Dissimilar paint products and thick paint films lead to early shrinking fading and loss of shine.
 
Like you I have always used wax and grease remover. I have heard of people using Naptha. Dunno.
TRY TCP Global and Southern PolyUrethane. I have used both and like their products.
PS Cost of EVERYTHING is going up!! and will for another ??????????
 
Do not use fish eye eliminator.... it is basically silicone that over contaminates the product into one giant fish eye. You will never eliminate it from your guns or booth and will have to use it forever.
 
George Jets said:
You may have to strip that finish off and start fresh.

There is a lot of material on there already with that house of color custom paint job and now you want to go over that with a different product.

Dissimilar paint products and thick paint films lead to early shrinking fading and loss of shine.
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Farmington! We moved to ID 2 years ago from Lakeville.

I hear you about the paint film but it should be OK, as the car was stripped to bare metal prior to the HOK which is all 2K.
 
ACME SS said:
Farmington! We moved to ID 2 years ago from Lakeville.

I hear you about the paint film but it should be OK, as the car was stripped to bare metal prior to the HOK which is all 2K.
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That's interesting, Lakeville, now Idaho. Have some good friends that were just out to St. Anthony Sand Dunes last week in Idaho.

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Biggest, Baddest Dunes in the USA.

☆☆☆☆☆
 
I usually buy Kleenstrip prep-all locally as its cheaper or Kirker wax and grease remover from DADs custom, but if they are out this works in a pinch. But yes, stupid expensive.

RGAZ
 
I was going to say GONE, maybe I have in my head wrong, it may well be GON. It has always worked well for me.
 
I like spray cans of 'Pre' From Eastwood. It is frequently on sale, works well, easy to use and I have never had a problem getting it.
 
Welcome to Idaho !
Do you have access to a Hotsy ?
Try washing it down with a heavy Dawn solution then power washing it off .
 
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