440 into a /6 duster

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1973_440_DUSTER

1973_440_DUSTER

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I recently trade for a 1974 dodge truck. 440 and a 4 speed. Looking to put the 440 in my car. I know I need to connect the frame together. But what else may be concerned about using a truck motor and trans and anything I should know before diving into this project. Thanks.
 
Its a good sized list. Here's the basics you will need to research.
You need a short tail a833 4-speed.
Replace truck oil pan, bellhousing and engine mounts with parts that
will work with your k frame. Headers or manifolds also.
Radiator
 
you sure you got an a833? Might be an NP435 in that truck.
NP435_4_Speed_Manual_Transmission.jpg
transmission.jpg
 
Personally I would build the truck. Check out Schumaker industries. There are also a lot of articles out there discussing it. I am still fine tuning and working out bugs on mine. Addressing brakes and suspension is a must. Fitting it in there is one thing, making it work is another. Do you have power brakes? Power steering?
 
I did a 440 in a dart and dartn440 is right the Schumacher kits work well. Mine is a auto though so not sure what else you will need. There was a member her that did a 4 speed 440 and did a pretty good thread on the z bar which seemed like he worked out the bugs, forgot his user name though.
 
A big block swap is not for the faint of heart.. if you give up easy on stuff, this may not be for you.. not trying to talk you out of it but it just not easy. This was my first time doing the swap as well

That aside - here is the short list depending on your car's options - plan on it doubling any costs/time you may have planned when the time comes to get stuff done -

Reuse the slant 6 engine harness - have to shorten/legthen a couple wires = plug and play
with a big block motor

If 3/4sp-
short tail 833 like said
driveshaft - I'm sure custom length
car trans mount/ Xmember if different from an automatic trans piece
speedo gear/cable if different from an auto or what's in the car
car bell housing, flywheel/clutch
modified Z bar or hydraulic clutch setup

If auto-
A727
same slant 6 X member/mount
custom length driveshaft
3,000rpm stall converter minimum
factory floor shift or aftermarket cable shifter
Lokar kick down cable if no manual valve body
$70 throttle cable bracket from eBay
- much easier route in my book

Schumacher/ trans-Dapt swap mounts
Schumacher torque strap, and motor mount shims
V8 radiator and WP housing to match outlet sides
B body pass side, C body driverside manifolds OR-
TTi, or Schumacher headers - TTi headers do not fit PS, they can be made to fit with pounding a few of the tubes though
2.5" minimum exhaust system
8 3/4, ford 8.8, ford 9", or 3/4 ton JY Dana 60 axle (<- If I did it over again this is what I'd do)
3/8" fuel sending unit, and front to rear line
disc brakes in front minimum
US Car Tool subframe connectors and drive shaft loop
Mini starter from newer 5.9 magnum truck

These are the minimum parts needed to make it easier to install and get it running, it will still be difficult beyond this as these car's were not designed for this.. couple pics of my car to give you an idea.. had my engine in and out over 6 times fitting and refitting everything - (383/727 71 Demon with CPPA/TTi based 2" headers)









 
WOW! I can't believe you had to mash the tube around your pitman arm so much. When I had used those 2" headers before the addition of power steering, I didn't have to take a hammer to anything. I guess that just shows the inconstancies in the way the factory put these cars together.
 
kerryike said:
WOW! I can't believe you had to mash the tube around your pitman arm so much. When I had used those 2" headers before the addition of power steering, I didn't have to take a hammer to anything. I guess that just shows the inconstancies in the way the factory put these cars together.
Click to expand...
Plus they are 440 headers on a 383 - even the 440 they came off of needed this much but they didn't get but a couple dings just let the stuff rub and make there own clearance.. I pounded them to fit better..
 
I used the Schumacher tri y's tight but no real mods needed and I have ps also, just had to grind the box a small amount,
 
TTI 440 headers on a 440 in an a body do not need modifying. They are tight in places but if the engine is placed right it isn't an issue.

To the OP. the 440 swap isn't a big deal anymore.

The only I'd tell you is to source a spool mount K-member. The biscuit mounts leave much to be desired.
 
roccodart440 said:
TTI 440 headers on a 440 in an a body do not need modifying. They are tight in places but if the engine is placed right it isn't an issue.

To the OP. the 440 swap isn't a big deal anymore.

The only I'd tell you is to source a spool mount K-member. The biscuit mounts leave much to be desired.
Click to expand...

I wish everyone would stop trying to scare away people from this swap.
 
I am not sure it's a matter of scaring people away from a 440 swap, rather an understanding that the entire car needs redone from front to back to be safe and reliable. Good luck with your swap.
 
I'm a little surprised to see people saying the swap is anything other than easy. My Gold Duster is my first Mopar project and I walked right through the swap. On a scale of 1 to 10 with difficulty, I rate it a 2. My car was a slant 6 car. I used Schumacher mounts and headers and it dropped right in on the original K frame. The more involved things were upgrading the brakes and driveline. Don't try and retain the original brakes and rear axle if it has drum brakes in front. Frame connectors are only needed if your going to make it hook up with traction. Lots of options with frame connectors if you need them. I did custom ones on mine, you can see them in my photo gallery. I see some nice ones on eBay now by US Car Tool also. The rewards are well worth the effort as far as I'm concerned.
 
Maybe its because its my first swap but I spend all weekend with 3 other people trying to get things changed and all i have right now is a 440 with a 727 bolted in...no headers or rear put back in yet. Granted I the taller TrickFlow heads I'm using and the fact the car was a factory AC car are probably causing problems as well. Spent the good part of a day beating the passenger side valve cover down and grinding on the rocker shaft hold downs in order for the motor to "clear" the blower motor. I say "clear" but I unscrewed the blower motor and moved it to the side...it still hits the valve cover.
 
Let me put it this way. If your car is al setup for a V8. Swapping to a 440 isn't too big of a deal. I've done 2 440 a bodies. I know all the tricks. Use the wealth of knowledge here. It helps.

For the record I deleted the heat and heat and AC on both of mine. I don't really drive it under 40 degree weather.
 
roccodart440 said:
Let me put it this way. If your car is al setup for a V8. Swapping to a 440 isn't too big of a deal. I've done 2 440 a bodies. I know all the tricks. Use the wealth of knowledge here. It helps.

For the record I deleted the heat and heat and AC on both of mine. I don't really drive it under 40 degree weather.
Click to expand...

Yep...what he said. I have a home made heater delete plate on the firewall for now.
 
If I didn't want heat I could have saved a day lol. Sure it would have been easier without power steering too. So moral of the story the more creature comforts your want the harder it is.
 
Sure. I think with aftermarket items it gets a bit more tricky, but not impossible. I wanted a clean look. With stock heads and stock valve covers I have blower motor clearance. I used Mancini master cylinder adapter, stuck the battery in the trunk.
 
These swaps are only easy once everything fits.. Hedman B body headers do not fit like 30+ people said they would "with a couple dings".. unless I missed something, which I pounded the F out of them only for them to not fit.. TTi or Schumacher are the only headers that fit..

I have Stealth heads, and MP valve covers - that clear the heater blower motor fine..

I SH*T you not had my motor in and out at least 10 times now with the rebuild, trans was out 3 times as well while "fitting everything"

This was my first BBM swap into my Demon, but I'm no stranger to Mopars, had a 340 Dart, and a 68 318 charger I was planning a 383 swap in - this was the hardest project car I've ever had..

Like I said though once you find the setup's sweet spot where everything fits and clears, it will take you an hour max to pull the motor for any type of work.. I have 2" headers w/ 3.5" collectors which makes working around them hard..

My setup required the trans to go in first, then headers, and then motor..
 
I have done 3 440 A-body swaps. All were 4-speeds.
I modified the v8 spool k-frame on all 3 with C-body mounts. Cutting & welding needed.
I also welded washers on the driver side spool mount to make it solid.
Lakewood bell housing on all 3. Flatten firewall to floorpan seam with hammer.
Modified the pivot point for the z-bar so it lined up with inner fender. The quality control
on the old scatter shields was crude at best and were never the same. Or it could have
been the car itself but they all needed improved a bit.
I used hooker fender well headers, B-body HP manifolds and Tti 2" on the last one.
All 3 exhaust options I used have their good points and bad. They all work just depends on what you can live with. I learned it helps to tack your k-frame with the exhaust in place and remove K-frame for final welding.
Never tried the Schumacher's myself. I did two of these before schumacher started
making parts.
Another area where welding was needed is the trans tunnel hump. I found it easier to
wait and weld this in after shifter is in to confirm placement so boot fits nice. I like the poly trans mounts.
I agree that you are not just swaping engines with our A-bodys. You are swaping
the entire drivetrains and cooling. I only converted 68-69s so I had drum brakes, small axles and weak springs to change out.
I say go for it. Just expect some difficulty's. In the end you may say that wasn't so bad.
If you are like some then you will want to try a Hemi which requires a certain level of crazy. So many more problems than the 440 swap. I'm still working the kinks out of this one. It helps a ton to enjoy the building aspect as much as the driving.
 

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Dartn440 said:
Yep...what he said. I have a home made heater delete plate on the firewall for now.
Click to expand...

Mancini make them. Cheaper than making your own.


Dartn440 said:
Sure. I think with aftermarket items it gets a bit more tricky, but not impossible. I wanted a clean look. With stock heads and stock valve covers I have blower motor clearance. I used Mancini master cylinder adapter, stuck the battery in the trunk.
Click to expand...

A 2 things I won't build an abody without.

Master cylinder offset kit
Battery in trunk


On a full build add a alterkation to that list.
 
70 Duster (was a /6) with 383 4-speed. Schumacher mounts, TTi headers and NO hammering.

You can see in the pic where the #7 tube has three new (as yet unwelded) seams to very slightly
reposition the tube for clutch cross shaft clearance.

Had this been an automatic car, even this would have been unneccesary. I don't know why TTi
doesn't just build them like this and then they could be listed to fit either transmission.

You should assemble the engine/trans/headers on the K-frame outside of the car, test fit everything
before final paint and detail then install from the bottom for a clean, sanitary, no dent job.


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