Rallye Wheels - Help Needed

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matthon

matthon

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So, I bought a Valiant with SBP Rallye Wheels on all 4 corners. Car sat a long time and I went to pull the only wheel with a flat off it today and it will not budge.

Jack handle on breaker bar, impact gun, a few appear to move a tiny amount.
I tried working the lugs back and forth, no luck.
I've never had lugs not come off before.

I have zero experience with these wheels.

Is the center cap held on with bolts from the rear, on all Rallye wheels?

Is there a known issue with the chrome lugs seizing to the studs?

I wanted to use some penetrating spray, but I didn't want to leave it all over the center caps if it will somehow ruin them.

Just trying to pull 1 to move the car, and the others to clean/paint and determine the width so I can get some tires.

Any info the wheels is appreciated, lug size, width, silver paint, anything.

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Yeah the center caps have 3 bolts holding them on from the back.

Reverse threads maybe what side of car you dealing with here?
 
Dealing with driver's side, but as stated above I tried the lugs both ways.

I believe this car hasn't been messed with too much, so it should have righty-loosy.

Most recent experience with chrome nuts were new cheapo Cragar chrome garbage that destroy themselves and the stud if you look at them wrong (went with McGard, way better).

Problem is, they'll move a little one direction, then stop, then a little the other, then stop.

I bet they're just stuck on from sitting, and I don't want to destroy the studs/lugs, I'm probably just too paranoid to commit to a direction.

Last car I dragged home had all but the left rear changed to RH, or was it left front?

I'll commit to LH and see what happens.
 
I don't see an L but they are filthy.
I'll check tomorrow.

20230102_213008.jpg
 
It could also be on one of the hex flats--it depends on the manufacturer. They can be tricky to see on the flats, though. Have you tried both wheels on that side?
 
No I haven't, just wanted to get the flat off to roll it off the trailer.
Based on prior experience, both could be LH, or one, or none.

I'm betting both.

I'm not a big fan of these wheels, but I dig them on this car. I don't dig chrome lug nuts, but they'd look stupid without them.
 
I've had excellent luck with Gorilla brand chrome lug nuts, both personally and professionally. Our shop uses them to replace OE nuts with stainless caps that bulge and fall off. I've sold hundreds, maybe thousands of 'em. Great quality and relatively inexpensive.
A wee touch of Nevr-Seez on the end of the threads and you'll never have this kind of problem again. It's standard operating procedure in rust country.
 
matthon said:
Problem is, they'll move a little one direction, then stop, then a little the other, then stop
Click to expand...
You may have spun the lugs and that is the movement you are experiencing.

If you can see the back of the lugs look for movement as you turn the nuts "a little"
 
Drill the top off the nut so you can get some lube into the threads. Worst case you have to drill the studs out.
 
If they're OLD chrome lug nuts, what happens is, the chrome flakes off and gets in the threads and locks them down. The only solution is to break them.
 
Use a 6 point socket and a long breaker bar.

The drivers side nuts turn backwards. Left to loosen
 
Those aren’t OE lugnuts, so I’m assuming you’re having trouble getting the socket on all the way as well? Have you put the socket on and tapped that with a hammer to try to break the bond between the nut and stud? I doubt spraying them down with penetrant will even reach the threads, so yes, approach this aggressively!
 
I still would try the other wheel and see which direction takes them off just to see if it is LH. JMO Last resort 6 point socket long breaker bar and try to snap them off.
 
If they move at all, get some good quality penetrating oil at the base.

I've seen LH chrome nuts with hash marks perpendicular to the plane of the stud, halfway down each side, right at both sides of the point of the hex (wow, that was more complicated to describe than I thought).

Keep working them back and forth, each time going a little farther CW (loosey) and spray that penetrant every time you go a little farther.
 
Spray them down with some PB Blaster penetrating oil, let them sit for a couple of days then give it a go again.

Have you tried airing up the tire to get it off the trailer? Spray soapy water on it to find the leak, may just be bead leaks.
 
Is that one lug nut actually rusted through on the cap of it?

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If so get some penetrating oil in there on it.

By the looks of that you are probably going to have to drill the lug caps to get penetrating oil in there.

20230103_064038.jpg
 
Here again if that is a rust hole in that lug nut, you can see that the stud is topped out in the chrome lug nut causing extra friction as you are trying to remove it.

Screenshot_20230103-070318_Gallery.jpg

Too long of studs for the chrome lug nuts.

Get some penetrating oil on them, you are going to really have to "reef" on them to get them off with what is going on there, rust and all.

Reef, like a 4' long pipe on the end of your 1/2" breaker bar.
 
413 said:
Use a 6 point socket and a long breaker bar.

The drivers side nuts turn backwards. Left to loosen
Click to expand...
I said a 6 point socket so there will be no slipping on the nut, apply the torque to the threads.

I said a breaker bar to give a decent tug on it to break the threads free, not to break off the studs.

Many folks have cheap junk tools that slip on the nut/socket and flex the breaker bar or extension instead of turning the nut.

I doubt that nuts is rusted through. Common for them to get a break in the chrome and rust on an edge.

Yes center punch the end of the nut and drill through them to apply penetrant to the threads. You will need a good quality drill bit.

if the tire won’t air up when flat, jack up the car and then it might take air and fill up when the tire is not distorted, done this plenty.
 
SBP Rallye wheels were all 14 X 5-1/2 from the factory. No other sizes. The aftermarket has made other sizes available but it's almost a sure thing yours are factory. Yes, the caps have retention screws accessible with the wheel off the car.

Lug sizes are only 7/16"-20 so they snap off easier than the more common Mopar size 1/2"-20. As already mentioned, the left hand side are opposite thread. CW to remove.

You have 20 nuts around that car. I'd start in the rear because those studs are easier to replace if you break one off. A good impact wrench can easily snap it. I'd probably start with a long breaker or cheater bar with a 6 point socket. A 1/2" ratchet with a cheater bar would be good because once you get one started, continue until it is all the way off. It will heat up from the friction and stopping will cool it down locking it on the stud even tighter. Your goal is to get one off to analyze what is happening. It very well could be double-seated on the end of the stud and at the wheel. Penetrating oil may help a little, couldn't hurt anything on the wheel so no worries.
 
The center cap is a '72 only SBP rallye wheel cap so I bet the wheels are '72 vintage too. (not that it matters in your case)
Drilling the top off the lug nuts is a good idea, and then use penetrating fluid on the exposed end is a good plan of action.
That might also relieve some tension between the stud and the nut itself with the vibration and all.
Also, what I would do is apply some heat with a butane torch to the side of the lug nut making sure that you are pointing the flame away from the center cap itself.
You don't need to heat it up red hot, but get it nice and warm and try to spin it off with the aforementioned breaker bar and a socket that fits well.
I'll bet that they move if you do that.
If they twist off, then you did all you could have done given the circumstances.
You were going to replace the studs anyway after all of this, right?
The only thing else you could do which is a pain in the *** and difficult to do is to use a die grinder and grind away the side of the lug nut on one of the flats and it will for sure come off.
Finally, first try left hand threads to turn it off (clockwise) to spin it off and if that doesn't work, try spinning it counter clockwise if that doesn't work because you never know what someone has done in the past...
Good luck, and let us know how it works out!
One thing for sure, I would change all of the studs to right hand thread after all of this and use anti seize on the threads...
 
Dartnut said:
The center cap is a '72 only SBP rallye wheel cap so I bet the wheels are '72 vintage too. (not that it matters in your case)
Drilling the top off the lug nuts is a good idea, and then use penetrating fluid on the exposed end is a good plan of action.
That might also relieve some tension between the stud and the nut itself with the vibration and all.
Also, what I would do is apply some heat with a butane torch to the side of the lug nut making sure that you are pointing the flame away from the center cap itself.
You don't need to heat it up red hot, but get it nice and warm and try to spin it off with the aforementioned breaker bar and a socket that fits well.
I'll bet that they move if you do that.
If they twist off, then you did all you could have done given the circumstances.
You were going to replace the studs anyway after all of this, right?
The only thing else you could do which is a pain in the *** and difficult to do is to use a die grinder and grind away the side of the lug nut on one of the flats and it will for sure come off.
Finally, first try left hand threads to turn it off (clockwise) to spin it off and if that doesn't work, try spinning it counter clockwise if that doesn't work because you never know what someone has done in the past...
Good luck, and let us know how it works out!
One thing for sure, I would change all of the studs to right hand thread after all of this and use anti seize on the threads...
Click to expand...
I agree to all of that and most of the rest of this thread. But maybe you might want to use one of those 4 1/2" grinder/cut off wheel tools, that everyone has, instead of a drill to cut off the end of the lug nut. You definitely gotta get new lug bolts before you call it done. Right? :)
 
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