This 3-speed trans is gonna have to go...

-
Status
Not open for further replies.
TylerW

TylerW

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 29, 2008
Messages
1,040
Reaction score
149
Location
Elkton, TN
I have hardly driven my '73 Valiant in the last 18 months because the thing is such a chore to drive.

Not only is it a 3-speed on the column, but for whatever reason Ma Mopar decided to install a trans with an non-synchonized low gear. So, you either have to lug second or come almost to a stop to get low gear.

Add to that it's manual steering which most of the time takes two hands to steer around turns. Now I know why most of these were equipped with an automatic.
 
???????????
Sounds like somebody stuck a light duty truck A230 trans in your car.
Double clutch it while down shifting it will slide right in.
 
learn to "double clutch" google it. my first cars were 55-57 chevys. none of them had syncro into 1st until i could afford a 4 speed.

some models of the mopar 3 speeds are 1st gear syncro and some are not. i don't remember the numbers. you can google it
 
imagine that. Owning a car that actually takes skill to drive.
 
What???...no lane departure/ crash immenent warnings on that thing???....how the hell can you drive it? :)
 
Putting the phone down helps with the needing two hands problem
 
If you've never become accustomed to driving 3-on-the-tree and manual steering, it's understandable. Some of us grew up back when basic cars like this were commonplace and we were able to watch and have someone teach us tricks like double-clutching and keeping the car moving slightly when steering sharply to you're not fighting to turn the steering wheel. I bet you can find an old-timer who'll show you and with practice you'll enjoy having the skill. Plenty of grandma's drove cars like yours.
 
A lot of cars/trucks used to come with non-synchronized 1st gears. I didn't realize that went all the way up to '73 on these cars, but I guess on a 3 speed manual on the column car I shouldn't be surprised, that's an econo-box there. I started driving a '56 Ford truck not long after I learned to drive, that was a 3 on the tree with a non-synch 1st. That truck was a lot of fun. Learn to double clutch and drive accordingly. Or swap it for a 4 speed since you've already got the pedal set up. Real cars have 3 pedals.

Two hands to steer? Oh my gosh! How do you talk on the phone? :violent1:

Since its a '73, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that's a 24:1 manual steering box. Which means its about 25% easier to work than the 16:1 manual steering box I have in my Duster. And I'll further guess that you're not trying to turn a set of 275's up front either. Sooooo yeah. That '56 Ford truck would give my Duster a run for it's money on steering effort too. Like was already mentioned, learn how to make all your steering inputs while you're still rolling. Your steering components and tires will last longer too if you're not dry steering all the time (steering with the car at a standstill).

Too bad you're about a year late and a long ways from here, I swapped a /6 and 904 auto out of my Duster, power steering too. She's all manual now- manual steering, manual transmission, manual brakes. Heck it's like driving a real car.
 
You guys are making a lot of ASSumptions here.

1. Who the hell said anything about a cellphone? Where did that come from? Is that another one of those "auto-fill" responses that get posted whenever the words "two" "hands" "steering" "wheel" end up in the same post?

2. Then, I would like to know how many of you are driving 3-speed manual-steering A-bodies with no air conditioning everyday and I want proof if you claim so. I don't think it will be many. It's more likely those automatic Dakota's, new mega-buck Challengers or the other stuff I see posted in the daily-driver threads, or the Toyota's, Nissans, Hyundai's, Kia's and Subaru's a good percentage DON'T dare post in the daily driver threads. So don't lecture me about easy-to-drive cars. If everyone liked 3-speed column-shifted non-synchro transmissions so much, why they would still be offered on new cars, wouldn't they?

3. As much power-shifting as I do at the dragstrip,....I think I know how to drive pretty much anything by now, even with only hand on the wheel:)

4. Do you guys REALLY think I know as little about that car as you ASSume...? Really?

5. Ok..ok..ok...you've shamed me into never taking my cellphone with me whenever I drive that Valiant, driving with the windows up on a hot day, and anything else that could make me suffer enough to be a real man...YEAH!!

Here's my 64-yo friend driving that same car....looks like he's having fun.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfN1zZDPm-U"]Uncle Phil drives the '73 three on the tree Valiant - YouTube[/ame]
 
Sorry. I wrongly ASSumed you would want to embrace the low-tech aspects of the era when your car was built. I did daily-drive a '63 Belvedere back in the '80's, for 3 years in Atlanta, I loved it till a drunk-driver hit it. It had a heater but no other options. No pics but I'm not lying. The people who took time to respond to your post were mostly trying to help, you got a little ribbing along with it. Thanks for the video, it brought back good memories, I hope you or someone will get some good use out of the Valiant.
 
TylerW said:
You guys are making a lot of ASSumptions here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfN1zZDPm-U
Click to expand...

i stick by my answer, we can't wave magic wands and fix your perception

you only have so many options

make sure the column shift and linkage is free, not rusted / bound up/ bend and operating properly, the clutch is operating properly, and learn to double clutch.

upgrade the gearbox to either the full syncro 3 speed or a 4 speed
 
TylerW said:
You guys are making a lot of ASSumptions here.
Click to expand...

You posted a thread whining about how your car is "a chore to drive" because it has manual steering and a non-synchro 1st gear, on a forum geared toward classic performance vehicles. Did you really expect to hear that your bone stock 3-on-the-tree /6 Valiant is the hardest car to drive on the forum?

And yes, I really do drive my '74 Duster with 16:1 manual steering, manual brakes, no-a/c, and 4 speed on the floor almost everyday. I drive in the rain, sometimes even in the SNOW, although here in California lately I probably log a lot more time when its 110* F out. If I need to go somewhere, that's what I drive. To work, to the store, wherever. And no, I will not even concede that your car is harder to shift because it has a non-synchro 1st gear, because mine has a kevlar/ceramic clutch and only pulls 10 mmHG of vacuum at idle. Double clutching doesn't help me any. I don't drive anything newer than it, because I don't OWN a car newer than 1974, and haven't since I bought my '72 Challenger in 2008. Yes, I also drive my '72 Challenger, which does have power steering and an automatic transmission. But in the last year or so the Duster has been the daily, and will continue to be as long as the car is willing and I can keep her supplied with 91 octane. It's just too much fun!

And I would be willing to bet that there are quite a few members on this forum, that although they are not currently daily driving their classics, have still logged a lot more seat time than you have in cars that are just as much of a "chore" to drive as your Valiant. Plenty of little old lady's drove manual steering 3 on the tree cars, because that's what there was.
 
I have a '70 Valiant sedan with manual steering & a 3-speed stick on the floor, I love to drive it. I put over 2000 miles on it last August -October while house hunting here in PA.
 
Seriously Tyler W?

A; I don't have exact figures, but i'll bet less than 30% of cars had A/C til early 70's and
were driven everyday by everybody thru the 80's as they passed hands as used cars.
B; You're "powershifting" but haven't learned to double clutch on Your own?I guess heel&
toe downshifts while on the brakes are definitely out of the question. step away from the
road course son! Oh, and those were manual brakes for at least 50% of us.
C; Yes, we & 80 yr. old women all drove cars like that every day & no we don't all claim
to still do so. mainly for practical reasons.(we don't want to show up for an interview
all sweaty,etc. , half of the morons staring down instead looking up could take out our
classic Mopars& have.. so everyday is bad odds).But did you buy the car for practical
reasons?
D;I don't know if you are a fan of REAL antique cars but if this one is too much trouble for
you .... stay away from model-T 's and about anything built 30 yrs. after!
E; Yes, we are busting your balls for the reasons stated by blunblu, you can certainly
find a trans w the help of those here, although a set of 4.56's might help w the
lugging thing..........:D
 
I used to daily drive a 65 Belvedere with slant 3-speed & zero options & not once did I whine about how tough it was to drive. It had no air in Houston TX. I would drive vintage now but it just isn't feasible in the northeast with crappy salted roads, you'd be left with nothing but a pile of iron oxide. I have 3 old cars with manual steering (including A-body with fast ratio) & actually prefer it to PS.
 
TylerW said:
5. Ok..ok..ok...you've shamed me into never taking my cellphone with me whenever I drive that Valiant, driving with the windows up on a hot day, and anything else that could make me suffer enough to be a real man...YEAH!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfN1zZDPm-U
Click to expand...

LOL, don't take offense Tyler, everybody is just bustin' your chops.

You appear to be a young buck, so your more accustomed to the modern vehicles. Back when I first got my license, cars like that were very common and all we had to drive, or at least could afford when we were 16-17 years old.
 
I had a '60 Falcon like this when I was sixteen. Took about ten minutes to figure out. Get someone who understands the relationships between engine, car, and tranmission speeds to help you. Good part is almost no one will want to borrow your car.
 
magnumdart said:
I had a '60 Falcon like this when I was sixteen. Took about ten minutes to figure out.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I was driving these cars at around ten/twelve years old, my Dad would let me drive in an area that had very little obstacles and no traffic.
 
Learned to drive with a three on the tree. Truck stayed that way for years until Ford's weak *** shift linkage finally gave up and it was converted to a floor shift. Short shifter for a bench seat truck (Hurst conversion) made it a pain in the ***.

Fast forward a bit and daily driving a '54 Ford. Three on the tree, manual steering, manual brakes, manual choke, vacuum wipers (fun to watch them slow down at idle and then speed back up going through the gears). The car is a blast to drive!

Fast forward a bit more and driving a an NP435 in a Ramcharger. Granny low has no synchronizers (that's okay, unless you're pulling off with a load or crawling through a field, just take off in second) and reverse has no synchro's. That's okay, just give it a little clutch as you're slipping it into gear. It'll mesh and won't grind.

Do the same thing on downshifts, going into first. Push the clutch all the way to the floor, pop it in neutral, start out on the clutch with a little throttle and it'll pop right in.
 
Bad Sport said:
Yeah, I was driving these cars at around ten/twelve years old, my Dad would let me drive in an area that had very little obstacles and no traffic.
Click to expand...

Bruce, you sound like me. I was tearing up all the back roads when I was thirteen. Hell, by fourteen I was driving into town.
 
magnumdart said:
I had a '60 Falcon like this when I was sixteen. Took about ten minutes to figure out. Get someone who understands the relationships between engine, car, and tranmission speeds to help you. Good part is almost no one will want to borrow your car.
Click to expand...

I had a 60 Falcon. 85 hp 144 cid "six." Less power than a Briggs and Stratton Lawn mower. Zero anything. Cardboard headliner and visors. AM radio, all the time. The heater didn't work most the time.

Shifting? It was NON syncro, and you could NOT lug it around a corner in second like you can a 225. When they were new, my Gramps had a 60-61 Comet. My Dad and Gramps both knew how to double clutch. I learned. "It was part of life."

First car I drove was Dad's 55 Chev wagon, gues what? non syncro three on tree.
 
Seriously guys...if I had known this was going to be an open invitation to berate a fellow member, I would have never started this thread. Some of you take the fun out of everything and I am reminded why some people stopped posting on this board.

A couple of you in particular I thought were above taking shots at somebody, but obviously not. It's ok though, I have learned my lesson to NOT post anything here except strictly technical topics.

Thank you for your concern but I know fully well how to double-clutch. It's fun on a tractor or a dump truck, but not so much in a car. Maybe that's just me though.

Other than a couple people....I'm still seeing all these comments about the good old days when you USED to drive one of these. You learned on one, or you had one back 40 years ago. That's real nice, but I'm referring to NOW.

Here's a deal: Since I'm too young at 44 to be used to old cars(dear God....) and I hardly drive this old car because it's too HARRRRDD....I'll rent it out to any of you that would like to drive it across country this summer. It's only got 49,000 miles on it, so it's ready to go.

There's no AC, but you guys are tough. It'll be fine, load up the whole family. This is only going to apply to the months between June and September and I personally think it would be an even better trip if you stuck to the two-lanes and planned your route to include both significant portions of the desert southwest, and large cities with a lot of stop and go traffic and parallel parking.

There's nothing but AM radio either, but that's ok. All you need to hear anyway is the sound of that Slant six roaring away with the 3.23 gears it has.Right???

It'll be great. All you that bitched me so bad just now can relive the old days just like it happened. Just like going back in time and I'm sure that it'll be just as fun as you remember. If it's during my vacation I might even accompany you part way in the big Fury convertible, or maybe I'll be too weak to handle that car and I'll just rent something with an air conditioner.

And remember...no cellphones. That's apparently the worst thing because hey, have to keep both hands on the wheel at all times. Please don't flood my inbox with messages about this all at once and crash the system.

Now then..stop bashing me. I bought that car with every intention to swap it to an automatic and that's what will happen. The 3-speed sucks balls, they also have..no matter how many wistful, pot-altered memories there are of them.

This is how I handled the V6 Mustang I had for a while. Sounds to me like rubber in 4 gears...so spare me the speeches about shifting and all that.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVOQvCx8X6g"]Banging gears in the V6 Mustang - YouTube[/ame]
 
TylerW said:
Now then..stop bashing me. Ie
Click to expand...


i don't understand what the hell you want, here

there are no magic wands, and if there were, Id be waving it at my car

it "is what it is." you have a choice. learn to drive it as is, and get it as optimal as you can

install a different transmission

or get a different car.

this idea of "then and now" is BS. these transmissions, if they are IN PROPER working order, operate the exact same way right now in 2015, as they did in 75, 65, 55, 45, or ??

when I was young WE DID drive with no AC even though I don't know why you are bringing this up???????

WE DID drive with the windows down, with no cellphones ???? and with stick shift 3 speed gearboxes. i'm old enough that my cousins and I drove an early 50's Ford 1/2 ton WITH NO syncro gears, otherwise known as a "crashbox." You double clutch in and out of ALL 4 gears if moving.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
-

Back
Top