This 3-speed trans is gonna have to go...

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IIRC
-73s had from the factory, a full-synchro A-230. I think it became standard in 1970.
Ummm, maybe the 230 was standard on floor-shift models only.IDK. How could I forget?
-Anyway, Older models had the A-903 with the non-synchronized low. And before that was the A745. I have rebuilt hundreds of all of those. If your tranny has a side cover, its a 230,albeit with a dead brass on first.The 903s were pretty light duty,and I thought,weak. The 745s had an unusual synchronizer design. Sometimes they were hard to make work.
-Pump up the front tires. 35 or 40 psi will make a world of difference.
-Cant help with the no A/C
- 73s were still a good year to hop up.

I have to agree. No matter what anybody says; double clutching in traffic IS a chore. Back in the day, There were way, waaay, less cars on the road, and traffic was only a big-city issue and only at rush-hour.I too grew up with column shifted non-synchronized-low-gear trannys. Thats just the way it was. I was just excited with my new-found freedom, and double clutching was a very small price to pay.
However,I wouldnt put up with that anymore. Thing is ,youve had nearly a year and a half to change it

As to the standard steering; Again, thats what we had back then. We also didnt have parallel parking. Mostly we had park-it-any-way-you-care-to,parking. Except in the big-city where it was Diagonal-parking.WE also had hard-as-a-rock tires. Polyglass came out in 1970 IIRC. They were still HARD. Hard tires were much easier to turn. And a very large percentage of driving was on gravel or even dirt. Driving on gravel is like driving on ball-bearings. Radial tires came out in the early 70s somewhere, and while they ride really nice, last pretty good, and are alignment friendly, they are harder to steer around corners. So again I agree; standard steering and radial tires, can be a chore, and I wouldnt put up with it anymore. Thing is youve had nearly a year and a half to change it.
I always say; Unlike me, theres three kinds of people in the world today; the ignorant(unschooled), the lazy, the broke,and the I dont give a chits.I hope you fit into the brokes.Broke is hard to break out of.
 
Well, your uncle did look like he was having fun:cheers:
C
 
Wow.

Not really sure what you wanted TylerW, sympathy? But seriously, no one is "berating" or "bashing" you. Yes, some folks have definitely poked a little fun. Myself included. But no where on this thread is any "berating" or "bashing". There are definitely threads on Fabo where that has happened, and this isn't one of them. Trust me.

The simple truth here is that your car is NOT hard to drive. Not compared to a lot of cars here. Certainly not on a level that competes with what a lot of folks here have driven. And probably drove every day for a long time, even if that isn't necessarily recent. But if your car only has 49k miles, recent doesn't really make a difference right? If everything works mechanically, driving your car everyday now or back in 1973, wouldn't be any different.

As far as your offer, if you don't fancy the car I'll happily fly out to Alabama and drive it back to beautiful Northern California, by way of the scenic southwest deserts if you like. Wouldn't be any hotter than going though New Mexico, Arizona, southern Nevada and Death Valley in the back of a fire crew buggy in July. It was 118* degrees in Furnace Creek when we passed through. Heck, it'd be like when I drove my old '56 Ford truck with a 3 on the tree 10 hrs from NorCal to San Diego in June, just for about 4 days or so. But the extra 3 days would be a good trade for not having to drive through Los Angeles traffic working that old truck clutch. And the southwest deserts don't have anything on Bakersfield heat, yee-uck. Or maybe it would remind me of driving my '56 Austin Healey from NorCal to Silver Star, British Columbia in August that one time? That was a little over 2k miles round trip, in a non-synchro 1st gear, true roadster. No windows and NO shade. If I remember right it was about 112* in Redding when we passed through the northern valley.

But if I drive it 2,333 miles back to NorCal I'm keeping it, unless you fly out and drive it back yourself. I may have a lot of projects already, but I'm only 36 so I've got time. I'd put a 4 speed and a turbo on that slant and really surprise some folks.
 
TylerW said:
Other than a couple people....I'm still seeing all these comments about the good old days when you USED to drive one of these. You learned on one, or you had one back 40 years ago. That's real nice, but I'm referring to NOW.
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That stuck in your craw, didn't it?

In other words, people have experience with it. They've been there done that, and many of us will again. The '54 I mentioned? Will be my summer daily again. It's staying three on the tree with manual everything. Including manual disks when I'm done getting it ready. No A/C and Upstate NY summers are nothing to sneeze about, either.

People used to do it all time and many of us here have a experience with such cars as a daily driver no matter when the time period was.

Here's a deal: Since I'm too young at 44 to be used to old cars(dear God....) and I hardly drive this old car because it's too HARRRRDD....I'll rent it out to any of you that would like to drive it across country this summer. It's only got 49,000 miles on it, so it's ready to go.

There's no AC, but you guys are tough. It'll be fine, load up the whole family. This is only going to apply to the months between June and September and I personally think it would be an even better trip if you stuck to the two-lanes and planned your route to include both significant portions of the desert southwest, and large cities with a lot of stop and go traffic and parallel parking.

There's nothing but AM radio either, but that's ok. All you need to hear anyway is the sound of that Slant six roaring away with the 3.23 gears it has.Right???
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Oh, no! Been there, done that, too. F*** AM, who needs a radio? The one in my Ramcharger went out in the first six months I owned it and I never replaced it. Trips to TN, trips the MN, trips to ME, all without a radio, the hum of tires on the pavement on the sound of the 318.

No A/C? Try running a car with no heat when it's freaking below zero out. Toes get cold in a hurry. Fingers, even through gloves, can barely feel the steering wheel.

Am I thinking about the past? Hell, no, I'm thinking about this past winter when I had to borrow my old man's van to get back and forth to work for a month while I figured out why my F150 wasn't running. Couple of times I had to take my six month old to my sister's in that van as my wife was heading in the opposite direction to go to work.

The 3-speed sucks balls, they also have..no matter how many wistful, pot-altered memories there are of them.
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Pot altered? Wow, that's about an ignorant statement. (And here you're bitching about people telling you to put the cell phone down.)

Some of us prefer standard shift and it's such second nature that becomes automatic. Just do it, without even thinking about, hitting shifts every time.
 
BTW
Im looking for a nice needs-very-little-bodywork shell, to put my spare power train into.
318, P/S, PDB, maybe A/T, maybe 833. I have for trade 2; A/T,P/S,P/B cars. You might find one of those more to your liking. Both are drivers.
 
TylerW said:
Seriously guys...if I had known this was going to be an open invitation to berate a fellow member, I would have never started this thread. Some of you take the fun out of everything and I am reminded why some people stopped posting on this board.
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Who is berating you, I sure don't see it. In regards to the car, it is the same NOW as it was 40 years ago. The only thing that has changed are the times.
 
I drove my 1966 Valiant on the streets and the track for 6 1/2 years, I am looking forward to getting rid of the standard and moving forward to a 904 auto, Loved it for many years and drove it with joy till my shoulder and hip said no more.. I knew how to drive it, I knew how to maintain it, but it's time to move forward.. same boat for me.
 
TylerW said:
Other than a couple people....I'm still seeing all these comments about the good old days when you USED to drive one of these. You learned on one, or you had one back 40 years ago. That's real nice, but I'm referring to NOW.
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My Dart still has a 3 speed. At first I didn't like it because it wasn't a 4 speed but I've grown quite fond of it. It is a synchronized A-230 though and it's not a column shift either. Having a pistol grip shifter makes it more fun to row through the gears. Combine that with the lumpy idle of the 340 and I don't even care that it's not a 4 speed. I like having three pedals and if you would like having an automatic then go for it! It is your car after all. You could probably sell the pedals and some other parts and recoup a lot of your money. Slant six 904's can be had for pretty cheap. Or save the pedals and put a 4 speed in your Dart. :glasses7:
 
AJ/FormS said:
IIRC
-73s had from the factory, a full-synchro A-230. I think it became standard in 1970.
Ummm, maybe the 230 was standard on floor-shift models only.
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Would have been after '70...I had a 71 Duster back in the day and 1st was non-synchro on that.

Thing I didn't like about the A bodies with 3 in the tree (well. other than the linkage wearing/binding after a while) was that with the dash overhang it was easy to bang your knuckles into the dash pad shifting into 2nd, especially if you have large hands like me. Went with the floor shift instead.
 
Wow....reading some of the replies on here is down right funny
 
On a lighter note, I'll admit I'm a little envious since I don't have a Mopar anymore, that I'd gladly drive a 3-on-the-tree or any transmission except a Power-Glide!
 
TylerW said:
I have hardly driven my '73 Valiant in the last 18 months because the thing is such a chore to drive.

Not only is it a 3-speed on the column, but for whatever reason Ma Mopar decided to install a trans with an non-synchonized low gear. So, you either have to lug second or come almost to a stop to get low gear.

Add to that it's manual steering which most of the time takes two hands to steer around turns. Now I know why most of these were equipped with an automatic.
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Wanna drive something that is truly a pain....come drive our 1958 International grain truck....6 speed, non snycho trans, no power steering and it's a cab over with the big international engine sitting right on the front axles. Oh and dont let me forget about the 2 independent diff brakes on the two rear axles, each manually set and released from each other.....
 
TylerW said:
Seriously guys...if I had known this was going to be an open invitation to berate a fellow member, I would have never started this thread. Some of you take the fun out of everything and I am reminded why some people stopped posting on this board.

A couple of you in particular I thought were above taking shots at somebody, but obviously not. It's ok though, I have learned my lesson to NOT post anything here except strictly technical topics.

Thank you for your concern but I know fully well how to double-clutch. It's fun on a tractor or a dump truck, but not so much in a car. Maybe that's just me though.

Other than a couple people....I'm still seeing all these comments about the good old days when you USED to drive one of these. You learned on one, or you had one back 40 years ago. That's real nice, but I'm referring to NOW.


you are so correct as far as one or two that are above taking shots and really giving some help in your situation and also sticking to specific technical problems is the best way about posting. if you put yourself out there with a general question or statement like one member so eloquently put it, put your idea out there so we can all pick it apart, I mean this was his real statement and it rang so true! I find that a lot of times I think out of the box and that doesn't set well with a lot of people on this forum. and if YOU were teasing or a little ribbing or joking around you are all of the sudden crying or whatever more instigating words that can be remedied. I couldn't agree more than putting an automatic transmission and power steering in the car. I mean it's not really like you're going to get some kind of an award at a car show for a numbers matching slant 6, 3 on the tree car. And if you did really who would care it wouldn't get you any more thumbs up on the road, as a matter of fact you would get last thumbs up on the road because you would be in the car less because it's so damn uncomfortable to drive. if you live close by I would give you a hand. A lot of people on this forum don't have the knowledge the drive the money the place and the big one to get up off the couch and do it part. and for those of you who have gotten upset by what I just said remember to stop your crying! lol And for those of you who's giving me a great technical advice in the past with my build it's still always appreciated! the only way I would have a three on the tree car with a No synchro first gear is if I was totally rich and had a fleet of cars I would have one as a novelty.:happy1:
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...and here I thought we were putting the fun INTO this thread!

1) lol i've been driving my '87 dak w/the factory AM Jams only & no a/c (the way it came)
for i forget how many yrs. just parked it to give it a rest after a brutal winter.
2) it's not that we're tough, You're just spoiled now like 90% of us!
3) are you kidding? double clutch downshifting is like the most fun ever!especially when
you get to doing it so well you actually don't need to slap the clutch the second time.
4) nobody here can blame you for wanting to make the car more livable. but you did come
off a tad whiny in your initial post, and we made the most of it!:D
5) pot? never touched the stuff tho' everyone else in my band did of course. plenty of
second hand at concerts etc. my memories are accurate & intact thx!!:color:
6) a fully sync'd three gear & floor shift conversion is surely an improvement for low$
& still more fun to drive
7) I prefer manual brakes set up properly, manual steering w/ a quick enuff ratio, but
parking in a crammed lot sucks no matter what bump & roll techniques you employ,
so i guess that depends on your most frequent parking situation....but it's great
for the lats,delts,core,etc. !!!
8) don't take these posts too seriously, regardless of their intentions, life's too short!
 
Ok well, it's now July and time to relieve the Valiant of that 3-speed. Nearly all the automatic stuff is gathered up and ready to go in.

It'll be such a difference to not be needing to:

1. Double-clutch to get low while rolling just like Grampa's old 1940 flatbed truck

2. Fighting the linkage to get it unstuck out of neutral at an intersection periodically.

3. Again fighting the linkage to get the clutch to engage all the way periodically.

4. Stretching 2nd out to avoid lugging the engine when going to 3rd.

Now I know what you'll say..."you could just rebuild that linkage..." NO!! That 3-speed is out of here, gone.

However, here's the silver lining to this dark cloud: I'm going to sell all that stuff pretty cheap, so all of you that profess love for a crashbox column-shifter car, here's your chance to own it and install it in your very own vehicle. I'm sure from reading the fond rememberances so far that you will quickly realize what a mistake it was for Mopar to offer synchronized transmissions and especially automatics as an option. The ad is in the sale forums, go there right now.

As an aside, I'm shocked no-one wanted to drive my car. I didn't get one PM about it.J-par said the revealing statement though. He referred to it as a "novelty" and that's exactly right. People like seeing them and talking about them and thinking back to the old days but nobody wants to fking actually drive one.

Two other pieces of trivia: Yes that's the original transmission. Everone thinks it was swapped in but it has the car's VIN on it and the PP250 and 10,000 day date are right on target. Why Chrysler put that transmission in that car nobody knows. That car was ordered though and it was also optioned with an R21 AM/FM radio and 22" radiator on a stripper Valiant.

Also, I bought this car because my late Grandparents had a twin to it, so I had to take it with a 3-speed because it matched otherwise.
 
Some of us are tired of hearing you *****. Put the automatic in and STFU. That is all LMAO
 
You sound exactly like Lucas Black.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdhEqX1Y43o"]Fall Previews - CBS Press Tour Red Carpet: Lucas Black - YouTube[/ame]
 
First off, you don't "double clutch" to get low while rolling with a non synchro first gear. You don't put it in low until you come to a STOP. PERIOD.

I drive my 75 F250 with a Borg Warner T18 4 speed with a non synchro first gear. Every. Single. Day. I have zero trouble. I think a lot of what you are experiencing is your own impatience and you are simply trying to rush driving the car.

It's not a four speed with all synchronized gears. It's a non synchro three speed with an archaic column shift. Could it be possible that you just might be expecting it to be better than it is?

No one here has berated you or made fun of you.......we just poked a little fun. You know.....like friends do?

Now, don't you get offended by what I said here.......instead sit down and actually think about it. Your car isn't a fuel injected almost drive itself POS cookie cutter modern crapbox that any moronic idiot can drive.....and will almost drive itself.

It was build in a time when everyone with any sense at all knew what that third pedal was for, knew how to start a cold car with a carburetor and knew what manual steering and manual brakes were.

Once again.....nothing personal. No offense meant. I just see a lot of younger people who have zero clue about older cars.

We had a guy worked at the transmission shop I helped run the office of for a while. They actually hired him as a mechanic's helper. This kid wasn't 25 years old. He had NO CLUE how to start a carbureted vehicle cold.......I kid you not.

We had an old Dodge D50 truck in the lot. Boss told him to go out and bring it in the shop. He went out there and just kept spinning the starter. It would start and die. Start and die. We were all sitting in the office eating breakfast wondering if he would ever figure it out. He didn't.

I walked out there, stuck my foot in depressed the gas pedal once to the floor and hit the key. Instant idle.

Times change. Things change with the times. It's a fact of life. Us older guys get a kick out of seeing this kinda stuff.......forgive us our evil sense of humor. It's bittersweet, really, in that one day, none of these type vehicles will exist anymore and no one will give a ****.

How about letting us old guys give a **** without too much lip?
 
RustyRatRod said:
First off, you don't "double clutch" to get low while rolling with a non synchro first gear. You don't put it in low until you come to a STOP. PERIOD. I drive my 75 F250 with a Borg Warner T18 4 speed with a non synchro first gear. Every. Single. Day. I have zero trouble. I think a lot of what you are experiencing is your own impatience and you are simply trying to rush driving the car. It's not a four speed with all synchronized gears. It's a non synchro three speed with an archaic column shift. Could it be possible that you just might be expecting it to be better than it is? No one here has berated you or made fun of you.......we just poked a little fun. You know.....like friends do? Now, don't you get offended by what I said here.......instead sit down and actually think about it. Your car isn't a fuel injected almost drive itself POS cookie cutter modern crapbox that any moronic idiot can drive.....and will almost drive itself. It was build in a time when everyone with any sense at all knew what that third pedal was for, knew how to start a cold car with a carburetor and knew what manual steering and manual brakes were. Once again.....nothing personal. No offense meant. I just see a lot of younger people who have zero clue about older cars. We had a guy worked at the transmission shop I helped run the office of for a while. They actually hired him as a mechanic's helper. This kid wasn't 25 years old. He had NO CLUE how to start a carbureted vehicle cold.......I kid you not. We had an old Dodge D50 truck in the lot. Boss told him to go out and bring it in the shop. He went out there and just kept spinning the starter. It would start and die. Start and die. We were all sitting in the office eating breakfast wondering if he would ever figure it out. He didn't. I walked out there, stuck my foot in depressed the gas pedal once to the floor and hit the key. Instant idle. Times change. Things change with the times. It's a fact of life. Us older guys get a kick out of seeing this kinda stuff.......forgive us our evil sense of humor. It's bittersweet, really, in that one day, none of these type vehicles will exist anymore and no one will give a ****. How about letting us old guys give a **** without too much lip?
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I thought you were tired!
 
RustyRatRod said:
First off, you don't "double clutch" to get low while rolling with a non synchro first gear. .
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Disagree, w e used to do so all the time. No you would not want to do so with a TRUCK "granny" compound low it's just "too low." In the days when I had my 57, and later 63 pickup, we did this routinely
 
67Dart273 said:
Disagree, w e used to do so all the time. No you would not want to do so with a TRUCK "granny" compound low it's just "too low." In the days when I had my 57, and later 63 pickup, we did this routinely
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Something I have just never done much. My motto is "If you're rollin, that's what 2nd gear is for"
 
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