Question on Borgenson power steering box

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Dmopower

Dmopower

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I installed a Borgenson steering box kit from this sites vender. Everything was great and installed easily. I used my original 1967 273 power steering pump. The steering feels a little stiff untill the engine reaches 12 to 1400 rpm. Does this power steering box work better with more pressure? would a new pump help? Can a smaller pulley be used on the pump to help. Am I on the wrong track? Thoughts? I appreciate any help guys.

Donald
 
Hmm, I didn't notice anything like this with the Borgeson on my 67 Barracuda slant six. But I had already swapped out the old pump for a Saginaw unit. The Saginaw has quicker response than the Federal/TRW pump that was original in 67. The issue is it takes a different bracket, which you have to get from a later A-body... not sure which years.
 
This steering box?

Borg 1.JPG


Which model power steering pump? The TRW and Federal pumps put out the least pressure of the three that Mopars came with.
Even with my rebuilt Saginaw pump, low speed steering isn't as boosted as the Firm Feel unit I pulled out....but I have wide front tires...275-40-18.

1 A (2).jpg



With a manual trans, this is okay. A blip of the throttle provides enough for parking maneuvers. It wouldn't be as easy with an automatic.
In short, if you have a Federal or TRW, try a Saginaw pump. If you already have a Saginaw and it isn't enough, maybe a smaller pulley on the pump or a bigger crank pulley will increase the pump speed.
 
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BergmanAutoCraft said:
Why not call the vendor and ask? We have some experience with this sort of thing…
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I knew the vendor would see this and chime in also. I wanted feedback from both sellers and buyers. I figured this was the correct avenue to get both and it appears I was correct.

Im not complaining about the vendor or the unit. I assume I am the weak link and a learning curve was in order and wanted input from every angle.

What are your thoughts?
 
Dmopower said:
I knew the vendor would see this and chime in also. I wanted feedback from both sellers and buyers. I figured this was the correct avenue to get both and it appears I was correct.

Im not complaining about the vendor or the unit. I assume I am the weak link and a learning curve was in order and wanted input from every angle.

What are your thoughts?
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Strange you’d come on a forum rather than ask the question directly to get the correct answer the first time…
The Borgeson box operates at a high pressure than the original box. Most Saginaw pumps are fine. The Saginaws we sell have the target pressure and flow set already.
Your 67 can have either pump. You didn’t mention which one you have.
If it’s a Saginaw, you can try removing all the relief valve shims.
If it’s a federal, we’ve sold new ones with some luck. If you are to convert to Saginaw, the only tough part is the pulley is not reproduced and can be tough to find.
 
I’ve got the Borgeson box with my factory pump on the 273 in the barracuda. I added a small ps return line cooler. All I can saw is it works amazing. No troubles at idle or high speed. But my pump does become noisy (strange) at low speed parking lot maneuvering. Like pulling into a car show and being directed to a parking spot. I’ve taken it apart twice and all okay. It is a TRW I believe.
Syleng1
 
Syleng1 said:
I’ve got the Borgeson box with my factory pump on the 273 in the barracuda. I added a small ps return line cooler. All I can saw is it works amazing. No troubles at idle or high speed. But my pump does become noisy (strange) at low speed parking lot maneuvering. Like pulling into a car show and being directed to a parking spot. I’ve taken it apart twice and all okay. It is a TRW I believe.
Syleng1
Click to expand...
If you aren’t using a good synthetic ps fluid, you may want to try some.
 
BergmanAutoCraft said:
Strange you’d come on a forum rather than ask the question directly to get the correct answer the first time…
The Borgeson box operates at a high pressure than the original box. Most Saginaw pumps are fine. The Saginaws we sell have the target pressure and flow set already.
Your 67 can have either pump. You didn’t mention which one you have.
If it’s a Saginaw, you can try removing all the relief valve shims.
If it’s a federal, we’ve sold new ones with some luck. If you are to convert to Saginaw, the only tough part is the pulley is not reproduced and can be tough to find.
Click to expand...
I was looking on another site and saw a small block Mopar Saginaw pump assembly offered by your company for sale. Its a complete kit.

I know this is a shot in the dark but man, it sure looks like a Small Block Chevrolet setup!

Is it possible there are similarities in the Chev and Mopar setup?
 
Super-Cuda said:
I was looking on another site and saw a small block Mopar Saginaw pump assembly offered by your company for sale. Its a complete kit.

I know this is a shot in the dark but man, it sure looks like a Small Block Chevrolet setup!

Is it possible there are similarities in the Chev and Mopar setup?
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Our site is Bergmanautocraft.com. We only sell Saginaw pumps with keyed shafts with the correct muscle era reservoir. Our kits are all mopar using factory steering couplings, hoses, pumps, pullies and brackets. No GM style press on pumps or universal brackets/hoses here.
 
Saginaw was a division of GM for decades until they were spun off with several others divisions into Delphi. Chrysler bought the pumps and adapted them to their applications because they are a good pump.
Mostly Saginaw pumps didn't show up on LA engines until 1969. Because the aluminum water pump came along in 1970, that makes the brackets a one year deal. Original stuff is out there, but not everywhere. So, if you have one in your shed, you could rebuild it and use it. Or call Peter and get everything brand new.
 
S'cuder said:
Saginaw was a division of GM for decades until they were spun off with several others divisions into Delphi. Chrysler bought the pumps and adapted them to their applications because they are a good pump.
Mostly Saginaw pumps didn't show up on LA engines until 1969. Because the aluminum water pump came along in 1970, that makes the brackets a one year deal. Original stuff is out there, but not everywhere. So, if you have one in your shed, you could rebuild it and use it. Or call Peter and get everything brand new.
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67-69 Cast iron water pump cars could have come with Saginaw pumps.
 
BergmanAutoCraft said:
Strange you’d come on a forum rather than ask the question directly to get the correct answer the first time…
The Borgeson box operates at a high pressure than the original box. Most Saginaw pumps are fine. The Saginaws we sell have the target pressure and flow set already.
Your 67 can have either pump. You didn’t mention which one you have.
If it’s a Saginaw, you can try removing all the relief valve shims.
If it’s a federal, we’ve sold new ones with some luck. If you are to convert to Saginaw, the only tough part is the pulley is not reproduced and can be tough to find.
Click to expand...

"Strange you’d come on a forum rather than ask the question directly to get the correct answer the first time…" Before you wrote this I said I wanted to get the input of the vendors and the users. It is not strange that I posted it here. There is no way you were going to forward my post to all users. I'm sorry you got butt hurt because I want information from a variety of sources but insulting your customers is NOT a great business plan in any way.
 
S'cuder said:
Yes, and they'll fit. But pretty unusual to see an original one in the wild. I don't think I've seen a '69 or later without a Saginaw.
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No 70-72 A bodies had Saginaws. They didn't fit due to the limited space between the back of the pump and the driver side motor mount tower.
 
BergmanAutoCraft said:
No 70-72 A bodies had Saginaws. They didn't fit due to the limited space between the back of the pump and the driver side motor mount tower.
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That makes sense. All my experience with 1970 and up is B-Body, B-Engine.
 
S'cuder said:
Saginaw. You can tell by the oval shaped tank. If it has a dipstick, you also have the early cap, which is desirable.
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Thank you. The Vendor said "If you aren’t using a good synthetic ps fluid, you may want to try some." This will be my next step.


Thanks to everyone that took time to chime in!!
 
BergmanAutoCraft said:
Our site is Bergmanautocraft.com. We only sell Saginaw pumps with keyed shafts with the correct muscle era reservoir. Our kits are all mopar using factory steering couplings, hoses, pumps, pullies and brackets. No GM style press on pumps or universal brackets/hoses here.
Click to expand...
Awesome!

Thanks for the reply.

Cheers!!
 
BergmanAutoCraft said:
If you aren’t using a good synthetic ps fluid, you may want to try some.
Click to expand...
Good to know. I am running a standard power steering oil from NAPA.
I do not believe my install instructions say anything about a specific fluid, let alone a synthetic. I’m pretty good about following directions like that. But I am humble enough to admit maybe I missed it. Either way- I will give it a shot. Very easy fix and if this changes my issue- Wahoo!
Syleng1
 
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