1969 440 Dart build

-
hemijosh426

hemijosh426

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2011
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Harford County
I have been in the constant build and rebuild process of my 69 dart since I was 14, im now 22. I have been thru 3 motors and 3 tranns combos, finally ending up with a 440 and 4 speed, although in the near future it will be getting another 727.

I keep tinkering with the 440 trying to get it to run right, at first it was bogging on take off, or whenver the butterflies opened, so I put a 50cc pump on the carb, and didn't cure the issue till I bumped the timing up. I removed the brand new 440 source distributor and put a factory vaccum advance back in it and got so much more power its not even funny. The 440 source billet distributor must be junk, I know someone else who had issues with one too. I got the timing right, now it surges under part throttle and seems like its starving under hard acceleration. Even under deceleration I can feel it surge. Idle set at approx 900.
here's the motor specs:
Demon 750 float levels set to proper height
76 jet front 84 rear 5.5 power valve 50cc acc pump and 35 squirters
Front needles set at about 1.5 turns rear at .5 ish
Timing is about 36 by my chevy tape on balancer
Valves were just adjusted
Bosch platinum plus plugs solid core wire
Plain 440 dizzy vaccum advance
msd6al with super coil
160 tstat runs about 175 180
.557 purple cam set to factory dots
Mopar dual plane wedge intake

3.91 sure grip 8 3/4 / 833 trans

What can I do to make it quit surging?

And I will post pics as soon as possible, within 2 weeks it will be in hemi orange paint, as of right now just finished up the body work and got it in primer, did quarters on it and rust repair here and there. I am planning to supercharge or turbo it as well, and possible efi system down the road, once I learn more about them.
Thanks!
 
here is the car this past weekend and Cruisin Ocean City 2012, couldnt get it painted in time
468108_4091083560222_1376742506_3762850_1912759338_o.jpg

543233_4104060924648_1376742506_3770548_1346586445_n.jpg

here it is when we cut the quarters off in Feb 2012
459685_3577625124082_1376742506_3533286_2068694289_o.jpg

462166_3805283535400_1376742506_3645162_1129362385_o.jpg

478554_3998171557480_1376742506_3717697_1442095972_o.jpg

472229_4041397838110_1376742506_3737619_28264060_o.jpg
 
here is the car when it had a 383 in it, running a tunnel ram and a Predator
26582_1428622880369_1376742506_1172339_7852435_n.jpg

24811_1436360953816_1376742506_1188031_4270954_n.jpg

24811_1436370874064_1376742506_1188043_928688_n.jpg

26582_1428622960371_1376742506_1172341_2655164_n.jpg


Ran the predator for awhile, loved it. Blew that 383 up that it was sitting on top of, and then I built the 440 that it has in it today. Probably going to tinker with the predator again soon, neat design.
 
Sweet pics,welcome.What cam,compression heads,gear, I can tell you already back off the squirters and rio pumps.The Kendig/Predator eorks well if you are savvy.
 
solid core wires?? MSD says more than once NOT TO USE solid core wires... lol...

on the dizzy did you set reluctor gap?

and lastly you really need to degree in the cam... setting them "on the dots" is fine on a stock motor but when your building a motor its a must... i had to retard the timing set 4* in order to get the cam to +4* timing... lol
 
Thanks for the reply,
its a purple shaft. 557
1.5 roller rockers / mech cam
906 heads, ported
10.5 compression
hooker super comp fenderwells to a 3 inch mufflered system with optional cut outs
aeromotive 195 pump / holley regulator about 7 psi


And yes the reluctor gap is good, fresh cap and rotor too. Moroso solid core shielded wires. I know msd says no solid core, but I know plenty of people running solid core with no issues.
 
Can I ask what octane you are running? And pistons do they have a quench pad? I see your running open chambered heads with 10.5 compression. Whats your dynamic compression?
 
As far as the surging goes, how do your plugs look? Possible lean cond. on the primary side? I've cured that condition before by just jetting up a few #s.
Just a simple idea to try.
 
here's what i would do

"borrow" another carb. maybe you have a buddy with a carb; or you can get one on the cheap, put a rebuild kit in whatever. any old holley / bb thermoquad / etc. can be whatever brand. get it hooked up.

if the surging is still there... borrow / swap out the fuel pump / filter / regulator. if the gas filter has stuff in it maybe your gas tank has junk messing you up.

ideally you want 3/8 lines, and a return line from the pressure regulator as the recirculating fuel helps cool the pump

if the surging is still happening, borrow an orange box ign. those MSD's will occasionally go bad, it's hard to say. maybe the rev limiter is kicking in intermittently or something weird.

also for whatever carb, make sure you have the manual and know exactly which vac. line is the right one for the dizzy, which is the pcv port, which is for accessories (air grabber hoods, popup headlighs etc) and needs to be capped off.
 
I'm betting it's got a lean surge. The 750 I consider on the small side with your combo. If I understand it correctly, you have a "dry flowed" carb. It flows 750 cfm of air, but closer to 650 cfm's when fuel is going through it. I had a similar combo in a '67 dart, same compression, ported 915's, 2" primary, 3-1/2" exhaust, but only the little 484 MP cam. It did however absolutely love the 850 chokeless Holley that was on it.
 
Yes it still has the 68 tail lights. I have a 69 set, but I almost like the 68 more.

I will try jetting it up, as I believe it has a lean condition too. I have not checked the plugs lately, dont have many miles on this combo yet. I also checked the vaccum ports on the carb, and have the distributor on the right one. With the timing retarded, it would not surge as bad, but would still surge. My vaccum guage is an old school one, need to invest in a better one. Its hard to tell on my guage, but looks like 4 inches of vaccum at idle.

As far as dynamic compression, can you explain this to me? I have been told 906 can be close chambered too? I have TRW forged pistons advertised at 10.5 to 1 compression, but that could be with the closed chambered.

Can you check "dynamic compression" with a compression tester? What reading should it be and how can I turn that into a 10.5-1 type of number?

THanks!
 
4" of vacuum is pretty low for the cam and compression you have, i'm wondering about the gauge myself. If you are running enough initial advance i would expect at least 8-9 in. Could be a vacuum leak and if that is a true reading the power valve would be open at idle and you would be dead rich. If i was you i'd make sure no vacuum leaks and then get your timing curve right. After that you can adjust and jet the carb. appropriately. By the way, that's gonna be a beast when your done. :)
 
I will borrow a buddys quick fuel 750 off his running 454, and give it a try. Wont be able to test it for 2 weeks or so, as I took the car apart yesterday to finish painting it. Still have alot of blocking to do to make it look good. I threw it together temporarily for this past weekend, took it to ocean city cruise weekend, it was awesome.
 
nice build i'm 22 i have been buildin my 71 dart with a 440 in it since i was 16. i also have 72 duster with a 383 in it. a-body big blocks are so bad ***. they make headers where u don't have to cut the inner fenders out. there called schumaker headers u can view them at engine-swaps.com
 
I am going to get rid of these hooker super comp fenderwells and go with either TTI or the schumacher, they look great. These hookers I got are leaking where the tube meets the flange, probably have to pull them off and weld them
 
that suxs i'm running the schumaker headers on mine engines.have no problems with them
what brand of roller rockers are u runnin?
i have my 440 pretty built up as well.
i have probe racing pistons its .030
.564 high extreme energy comp cam
have a noisy gear drive and englarge the intake and exhaust valves on my heads. i have the 906 heads.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top