We keep being told that 20-22* initial is the maximum ever reqd. Hmm. Below is by Chyr guru Steve Dulcich in MM, Sept 2013. A 318 engine with a sizeable sol lifter cam. One way of getting 28* at idle would be by using MVA.
28* initial timing for a 318? How can that be?
- Thread starter Bewy
- Start date
-
remytherat
Well-Known Member
We get the point. There are many ways to skin a cat. Some better or worse than others.
A locked out distributor will have more initial than that anyways.
Not worth debating.
A locked out distributor will have more initial than that anyways.
Not worth debating.
PRH
Well-Known Member
Initial timing threads…….(to include ported/manifold vacuum threads)…..
I’ll add those to the “do not respond” list……..with
-best oil
-best spark plugs
-302 heads
No one is changing anyone’s mind on those topics.
I’ll add those to the “do not respond” list……..with
-best oil
-best spark plugs
-302 heads
No one is changing anyone’s mind on those topics.
Last edited:
the highlighting and pen work leaves much to be desired.
however, if we examine it closely there are tell tale signs in the penmanship...
i for one look forward to the upcoming manifesto.
however, if we examine it closely there are tell tale signs in the penmanship...
i for one look forward to the upcoming manifesto.
mopar head
DoD nuisance Alien/Squatch extermination team
I was going to recommend a straight edge
Mbaird,
To answer your question. Steve was unclear in his answer how to get the 18-28*. It could be done with MVA or without it. The engine doesn't care which way, just as long as the engine gets the reqd timing...
To answer your question. Steve was unclear in his answer how to get the 18-28*. It could be done with MVA or without it. The engine doesn't care which way, just as long as the engine gets the reqd timing...
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
Piss poor build. Simple as that. And you only get the quote the OP wants you to see.
jeff alder
Well-Known Member
TT5.9mag
Two atmospheres are better than one
It’s funny, at the end of the page you get the real story.
“Then, we have the MP cam. A stick with 20 degrees less duration would definitely help the fuel consumption situation” .
So we have a (presumably) 318 with 360 open chamber heads with a torker and a 750dp with a way too big camshaft that eats a ton of fuel. Yup sure sounds like Steve recommended a bunch of idle timing to crutch a shitty build put together by someone who only read the bottom of the camshaft page. A recommendation for MVA that is not. Moreso a recommendation to build better quality, more well thought out packages so you don’t have to do shtuff like push a bunch of idle timing to it.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
Isn’t pretty crappy that Bewy posts just enough to try and make his point, but never enough to get the full story.
That’s why he never uses his words. The copy and paste is a dead giveaway he’s talking out of his hat.
I'm beginning to think he doesn't use his own words because he doesn't have any of his own since he really has no understanding himself. All he has is information from other sources.
mopar head
DoD nuisance Alien/Squatch extermination team
Well duh, of course.
This isn't an endorsement for manifold vacuum advance or any other method. But, if that much timing at idle is good for a scenario where the camshaft is too big for the build then you need to revise your 99.9% of motors don't need it statistic. I have a feeling that .1% is way conservative for the number of builds with a too big camshaft.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
I don't think "using you own words" is a game changer in this case. You layed out your own testing and the positive results you had with manifold vacuum on two of your vehicles. And it has either fell on deaf ears or was explained away as some rare example of an exception to a rule. I give you credit for giving your results despite how unpopular it is to use manifold around here. I suspect part of the reason it is so unpopular is because of who is advocating for manifold vacuum advance and less about method. Just to clear I am not advocating for or against manifold vac advance.
TT5.9mag
Two atmospheres are better than one
My biggest problem is with the selected material, or moreso the purposely non selected material to validate an agenda instead of clear precise factual information and letting users decide for themselves. Sounds a lot like the news doesn’t it?
Maybe. I mean I get what your saying , but just listen to it. You have to admit that sound is so cool.
TT5.9mag
Two atmospheres are better than one
Ive built more than a few engines for other guys. One of the questions I ALWAYS ask is “do you want it to sound fast or do you want it be fast?” You’d be surprised by the answers I get.
I get it. Hard to trust the message if you don't trust the messenger. But that by itself doesn't mean the message is wrong.
-
