ive been kicking the idea of a 6.1 for some time and recently come across a 2010 crate engine with the fast wiring kit with throttle body. it is a smoking deal but i am not familiar with what years work with what wiring ect. does this kit work with this year or will there be other issues ?
do i want this hemi ?
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Compare the part number for the FAST kit ....here's the 6.1 FAST kit from Summit
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FST-301013/
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FST-301013/
$8,000 wich includes motor mounts/isolators, fast wiring, milodon pan and pickup, balanced crank pulley. this is canadian funds. for comparison i found a used 6.1 with 30,000kms for $3,000. i would then have to but the fast kit, pan, and mounts that would add up to $4,500 ish and would have a used motor.
the benefit of the used would be it would come with altenator, power steering and brackets but that should be a simple find.
the benefit of the used would be it would come with altenator, power steering and brackets but that should be a simple find.
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
What Swifter Said. To really evaluate the deal we need some numbers.
Prices for USED 6.1L Hemi range between $4,000.00 and $6,000.00 depending upon condition and or mileage. There's a few on ebay right now for around $5,500.00 which in my opinion is a bit high.
The list price for the FAST setup is $3182.35
Brand New 6.1 from Summit $6832.99
FAST transplant kit for $3182.35
TOTAL $10,015.34
My view on pricing:
If the motor is used with a price of LESS than $5,500.00 for both components would be a smokin' deal
If the motor is a new crate motor LESS than 7K would be a smokin deal for both components
This is my view of "smokin deal" your idea might be a little higher or lower
All that being said a couple of warnings so you know what your getting into:
At a minimum you'll need the following parts to complete the swap:
New Oil Pan and Pickup tube
New fuel system including fuel pump and Pressure regulator
Motor mounts
Headers, with an Alter-K-tion you can use Jeep Manifolds, otherwise you're buy TTI, 5.7 Jeep manifolds will work with the factory K-Member, but would be overly restrictive on a 6.1
Radiator, either modified factory or new one, inlet and outlet are in different locations
Oil Filter Relocation Kit (unless, you are using an RMS Alter-K-Tion, I think??)
I didn't price any of the above out because prices vary widely. For example the cheapest pan and pickup is the one from Milodon, but it won't work if you are using a the RMS Alter-K-Tion. Fuel systems can be put together for as little as a few hundred dollars, others buy custom stainless tanks with intank fuel pumps for over $1000.00
Finally, a word about FAST and plug and play, FAST does come with a couple of "tunes" which will get the motor running, and this is VERY helpful but it isn't a perfect tune. Finding someone with FAST experience and a chassis dyno would be money well spent.
With all that in mind, I am a very big proponent of the modern hemi swap, but want people to enter it with their eyes open.
Best of Luck,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
Prices for USED 6.1L Hemi range between $4,000.00 and $6,000.00 depending upon condition and or mileage. There's a few on ebay right now for around $5,500.00 which in my opinion is a bit high.
The list price for the FAST setup is $3182.35
Brand New 6.1 from Summit $6832.99
FAST transplant kit for $3182.35
TOTAL $10,015.34
My view on pricing:
If the motor is used with a price of LESS than $5,500.00 for both components would be a smokin' deal
If the motor is a new crate motor LESS than 7K would be a smokin deal for both components
This is my view of "smokin deal" your idea might be a little higher or lower
All that being said a couple of warnings so you know what your getting into:
At a minimum you'll need the following parts to complete the swap:
New Oil Pan and Pickup tube
New fuel system including fuel pump and Pressure regulator
Motor mounts
Headers, with an Alter-K-tion you can use Jeep Manifolds, otherwise you're buy TTI, 5.7 Jeep manifolds will work with the factory K-Member, but would be overly restrictive on a 6.1
Radiator, either modified factory or new one, inlet and outlet are in different locations
Oil Filter Relocation Kit (unless, you are using an RMS Alter-K-Tion, I think??)
I didn't price any of the above out because prices vary widely. For example the cheapest pan and pickup is the one from Milodon, but it won't work if you are using a the RMS Alter-K-Tion. Fuel systems can be put together for as little as a few hundred dollars, others buy custom stainless tanks with intank fuel pumps for over $1000.00
Finally, a word about FAST and plug and play, FAST does come with a couple of "tunes" which will get the motor running, and this is VERY helpful but it isn't a perfect tune. Finding someone with FAST experience and a chassis dyno would be money well spent.
With all that in mind, I am a very big proponent of the modern hemi swap, but want people to enter it with their eyes open.
Best of Luck,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the numbers.
PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong but although the Canadian Dollar is now about equal to a US dollar things are still more expensive in Canada? Is that Correct?
The Milodon Pan and pickup is worth about $300.00
The motor mounts are worth about $150.00
It seems like you've got a good deal.
I'd offer the guy $7500.00, to me that would be a smokin deal.
Let us know what you decide.
Regards,
Joe Dokes
PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong but although the Canadian Dollar is now about equal to a US dollar things are still more expensive in Canada? Is that Correct?
The Milodon Pan and pickup is worth about $300.00
The motor mounts are worth about $150.00
It seems like you've got a good deal.
I'd offer the guy $7500.00, to me that would be a smokin deal.
Let us know what you decide.
Regards,
Joe Dokes
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
Based upon the higher costs associated with living in Canada, this might definitely qualify as a smokin deal.
I'd buy it.
regards,
Joe Dokes
I'd buy it.
regards,
Joe Dokes
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
You are correct, NONE of the 6.1L Hemis have VVT or MDS. The new 392 / 6.4L Hemi utilizes VVT, MDS, and Variable intake runner length. This is done to maximize torque. The 392 has more torque at a lower RPM, this is the benefit of VVT.
The 6.1L Hemi is one of the easier Hemis to transplant into a classic mopar, because it doesn't have VVT or MDS and its heads flow around 300 CFM as cast, with a set of long tube headers and a decent cam, the motor is capable of 500 HP.
Essentially the FAST ECM replaces the 80mm drive by throttle body with an LS style 92mm throttle body, with a GM style Idle Air Control (IAC), and Throttle Position Switch (TPS). The FAST ECM will then use all your other hemi sensors to control your fuel and spark.
One of the things you would want to research is which version of FAST XFI, the kit contains. If it is XFI 2.0 or later is should support a self tuning feature. Essentially this utilizes the wide-band O2 sensor to dynamically tune the fuel injection as you drive. The algorithm is so powerful, that those who have used it with the FAST EZ systems have given it glowing reviews. It is not quite as good as dyno tune with a talented tuner but it is pretty close.
Hope this Helps,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
The 6.1L Hemi is one of the easier Hemis to transplant into a classic mopar, because it doesn't have VVT or MDS and its heads flow around 300 CFM as cast, with a set of long tube headers and a decent cam, the motor is capable of 500 HP.
Essentially the FAST ECM replaces the 80mm drive by throttle body with an LS style 92mm throttle body, with a GM style Idle Air Control (IAC), and Throttle Position Switch (TPS). The FAST ECM will then use all your other hemi sensors to control your fuel and spark.
One of the things you would want to research is which version of FAST XFI, the kit contains. If it is XFI 2.0 or later is should support a self tuning feature. Essentially this utilizes the wide-band O2 sensor to dynamically tune the fuel injection as you drive. The algorithm is so powerful, that those who have used it with the FAST EZ systems have given it glowing reviews. It is not quite as good as dyno tune with a talented tuner but it is pretty close.
Hope this Helps,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
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