Soda Blasting & POR 15

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POPS6T6

POPS6T6

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Well, I checked into this, actually met a guy and had him hit a piece of metal for me today, and I have to say I AM VERY IMPRESSED!!

I am restoring a 1966 Barracuda that has seen some better days, it spent all of it's life in Ohio and Alabama, and the wear and tear on the metal is pretty serious. It also has a serious undercoating that is one huge pain to remove by hand! Well I found a local guy who does soda blasting, so I took up one of my more seriously damaged pieces (the splash guard from inside the driver’s side fender). This piece had some of the undercoating on it, and also major rust on it. The soda blasting stripped the undercoating off and believe it or not, there is great metal under there. Also it stripped off all the loose rust from the rusty areas and he advised me that I should use some phosphoric acid, and POR15 to treat that. My initial plan was for him to just do the underside of the car, and the engine compartment, but while I was there, I watched how he was working on an older (1940's) Caddilac, and you would not believe how easy it was for him to remove the paint also! And the best thing is, that you can leave your windows and chrome on the car as the soda does not mar those surfaces at all. He quoted me a price that was in my opinion VERY reasonable ($150 an hour) and he said that he could do my ENTIRE car in about 2-3 hours. I think that sure as heck beats sanding and stripping by hand.

Has anyone else experimented with this yet? It seems very economical, and a very efficient way to prep the body of my car.

Also I have read everything on POR15 here on the site, and it looks like I will be treating the entire bottom of the car with that as well.

Just thought I would share and if anyone has any input, as always it is appreciated.

One question I do have, is there a cheaper alternative to the phosphoric acid than what they sell at POR15?

John
 
I used "Miracle Paint" on the body underside, frame, shock and spring mounts, etc. This stuff is really tough and you don't have to use phosphoric acid to treat the metal. You can paint right over rust, as long as you get the loose stuff off first. After this stuff cured on the frame, I whacked it with a hammer and couldn't chip it. Don't get it on your skin or hair! It took two weeks to get it off my wrist where it got past my gloves, and it DOES NOT come out of your hair. I ended up getting a haircut! :goodman: Here's the link- http://www.hirschauto.com/acb/showdetl.cfm&DID=27&Product_ID=10&CATID=1

Be sure to click on the link titled "questions and answers about this product"
 
I think the soda blasting is a great way to go, i have also looked into it seems great.
i was told by the local guy that after blasting i should cover it w/ epoxy primer.
The price i was quoted was $1200+ just for the blasting so that price sounds like a deal
 
I removed all the factory undercoating from my 68 with a propane torch and putty knife. The only way I had to do it. I'll tell you right now I wouldn't even think twice if someone offered to do the next one for that price cause a propane torch and putty knife ain't no fun at all. Spent about 3 days under there eating that crap.

Afterwards I used Por-15 and it turned out fantastic. Just like the Miracle Paint Ramcharger mentioned you can whack it with a hammer afterwards and it don't come off. Same problem with it about getting it on you. It has to wear off. And you need to have real good ventilation. Gave me a headache unless vented real good.
 
I have seen and heard great things about soda or media blasting! It doesn't warp or damage flat panels like sand but you should remove all rubber and chrome because you are going to bare metal and will be painting and it is good to ensure no surprises are lurking under anything that was not removed....paint jobs don't come cheap!!
 
Make sure you have them clean, vacuum, blow, and whatever else it takes to get it out of all the nooks and crannies. I would also suggest pulling all rubber, and glass to get it all. That is paint, rust and being able to clean away the soda. It will find it's way into your paint when it's sprayed. And just when you think you got it all make sure and clean it again.
 
POPS6T6 said:
One question I do have, is there a cheaper alternative to the phosphoric acid than what they sell at POR15?
Click to expand...

Any metal prep you purchase is phosphoric acid. I usually get mine at the hardware store, it's more concentrated than the stuff sold at paint supply stores so you can dilute it making a quart bottle go along way.

But, if you are having the car soda blasted why not just prime it with an epoxy primer? POR15 does not stick to unrusted metal as well as it does to rusty metal. If you use the epoxy primer the acid etch and POR15 is not needed.
 
Use the Phosphoric acid or the rust converter stuff in the spray can, Then Epoxy primer :thumbup:
 
I thought you were going to soda blast the car! If you are then there will be no rust and you can use the epoxy primer right over the bare metal, no need to use the phosphoric acid.

If you are not going to soda blast the car and there is rust use the phosphoric and POR15. Putting epoxy primer over rust is not going to stop the rust.

Epoxy primer will not stick to POR15, you will need to use their primer or dust the POR15 with any type primer just after the POR15 starts to skin over.
 
dgc333 said:
I thought you were going to soda blast the car! If you are then there will be no rust and you can use the epoxy primer right over the bare metal, no need to use the phosphoric acid.

If you are not going to soda blast the car and there is rust use the phosphoric and POR15. Putting epoxy primer over rust is not going to stop the rust.

Epoxy primer will not stick to POR15, you will need to use their primer or dust the POR15 with any type primer just after the POR15 starts to skin over.
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From what I understand, and from what I have seen by visiting the guy who will do it and having him hit a piece of rusted metal for me, Soda blasting does not "remove rust", it basicly cleans the rust so that you can treat it. The upside to this is that you won't have warped or bent metal, and in some cases huge holes where sandblasting would eat right through. Soda blasting removes the paint, the undercoating and all of the loose rust and preps the metal for a finish, usually a product like POR15. It is actually perfect for POR15 as POR15 would not stick to sandblasted (ie:clean new metal).
 
I Talked To A Friend Who Ownes A Portable Soda Blaster And It Should Remove All Rust Your Guy May Be Usin T Fine Of A Soda.
I Saw A Wheel He Did Half And Half Of One Half Rusty As Hell The Other Like New. Maybe Lookinto It A Little More
 
After you have it blasted,use the epoxy primer on the car.That will keep any surface rust from appearing on it.You will still have to addres already rusted areas.Repair those then use epoxy primer on thos areas.Nothing is going to stop or kill the rust on metal but cutting it out and replacing the metal with new metal.You can use products that will slow the rusting process down but you can't kill it.It will always come back.You have to put something on the bare metal after blasting.No need to use a metal prep if you can get it primered quickly.Metal prep the bare metal and you will still get areas of surface rust.Prime the whole car is the best way ,that way it can sit until you get ready to start further.
 
I Soda blasted my car, turned out great really shows all dents and dings. Then just epoxy primer the whole thing. For some reason I can't upload any pictures but if you want to see any let me know.

Rick

[email protected]
 
1969340dart said:
After you have it blasted,use the epoxy primer on the car.That will keep any surface rust from appearing on it.You will still have to addres already rusted areas.Repair those then use epoxy primer on thos areas.Nothing is going to stop or kill the rust on metal but cutting it out and replacing the metal with new metal.You can use products that will slow the rusting process down but you can't kill it.It will always come back.You have to put something on the bare metal after blasting.No need to use a metal prep if you can get it primered quickly.Metal prep the bare metal and you will still get areas of surface rust.Prime the whole car is the best way ,that way it can sit until you get ready to start further.
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Some of this info is not true. I took some lessons from the Dupont guy, he said do whatever the manufacture of the paint you are putting on calls for. So here is what I used.

1. Remove all doors, trunk lid, hood, fenders.

2. After blasting with the car in a dry garage you have about 10-14 days to get ready, the soda is still on the car and puts a film of powder all over. I only let my car set 2 days. Rolled car out, fresh water rinse throughly.

3. Rinse all doors, fenders, trunk lid and hood.

4. Use what ever metal prep you application calls for. I used Dupont Fullthane paint, so I had to use Phospate metal prep.

5. Prime all parts first, then body of car. I had to use epoxy primer for my application.

6. Do filler work over primer, DO NOT SAND THROUGH PRIMER, this important because your car is now sealed.

7. Paint all parts, inside and out. This is good to do that way you know your cowl areas are nicely painted.

8. Paint body of car. Let all dry.

9. Put your parts on the car, try and align all parts as best you can at this point, don't settle to "do it later".

10. Wet sand car, use filler as nessaray.

11. Tack car down, respray entire car with all panels on. Buy more than enough paint, I put on 2 gallons. This is important because you want your car to be all one color.

Thats about it pretty much.

Rick
 
POPS6T6 said:
Just thought I would share and if anyone has any input, as always it is appreciated.

One question I do have, is there a cheaper alternative to the phosphoric acid than what they sell at POR15?

John
Click to expand...
Phosphoric acid? The 'Marine Clean'? I don't know but it smells ALOT like 409...

I have used POR15 multiple times and am very satisfied with the results.
 
Here's a '65 Barracuda covered in Por15. I've emailed the owner a few times and spoken with him, he says they did a great job and the car will never rust again!

http://www.stripmasterspor15.com/car022.html

I've used Por15 a lot. Did the whole floor of my car, after 6 years one little spot rusted through and that's probably because I only coated it on the inside of the floor, not the outside. I didn't remove any rust first either, just painted the **** on right over top (prepped a little with the products they recommend).
 
John,

I got the picture thing to work. My price was 750 and about 6 hours, but all my panels were off. I also repainted all my interior trim the the gold. I sprayed some on the drivers quarter panel. Next car will be gold I think its awesome color. If you wanna call me pm for the number.


Rick

before blasting.jpg


blasting.jpg


blasting1.jpg


getting ready to go.jpg
 
64_Barracuda said:
John,

I got the picture thing to work. My price was 750 and about 6 hours, but all my panels were off. I also repainted all my interior trim the the gold. I sprayed some on the drivers quarter panel. Next car will be gold I think its awesome color. If you wanna call me pm for the number.


Rick
Click to expand...


Rick,

That came out pretty clean didn't it? Amazing. Here is the deal, I wasn't planning on taking the windows out, nor the interior. I wanted to get the underside of the car cleaned, and treated and hopefully stop (or extremely slow down) the rust process on the car. I live in California now, and hopefully the lack of snow and salt and all those fun things from the midwest will help also. He quoted me about 3-400 to strip the paint, the loose rust, and all of the undercoating from the car. I just hope that would be enough for me to treat the car with the POR15 and prolong the life of the car until I can afford and have the time to do a complete restoration of the body etc.

John
 
Just a quick note about the phophoric acid. I work at a paint store & we sell something called klean & etch, it's actually made to clean & etch concrete as a safer alternative to muriatic acid.
It's made by the krud kutter company.
It is phosphoric acid solution , I have used it for small things in the past and seemed to work good.

Just wanted to pass that along !
 
John,

Yeah the Soda Blasting is the way to go, especally on cars with a few pait jobs on them and to find all the rust and bondo. I will never sand another car all the way down again. It just saves time. No more dang chemicals or anything. There is one guy here in Virginia Beach that does it, mostly he does the hulls of fiberglass boats. But he is always busy with work. I may look into the business when I retire from the Navy. I think this process is here to stay.

Rick
 
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