Tig torch...

Tig torch control....


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Jared told me that what you are talking about is more for industrial welding. All the tig stuff he has done on the race trucks is your standard, run of the mill tig work....
Two old school drag race chassis fab guys both told me that they, as well as most in that industry, prefer to use strike-arc and no knob or pedal. One showed me his formed copper strap that he uses to do the actual strike on so that it won't mar the chassis or result in tungsten inclusions.

Off-road fab guys are a newer breed. Doesn't surprise me that they prefer a knob or a pedal, but it is not an absolute requirement. If you ever want to start a war in off-road circles ask if weaving or figure-8 is the better wash-weld technique. Quite a thread on that some time ago on RDC.
 
Two old school drag race chassis fab guys both told me that they, as well as most in that industry, prefer to use strike-arc and no knob or pedal. One showed me his formed copper strap that he uses to do the actual strike on so that it won't mar the chassis or result in tungsten inclusions.

Off-road fab guys are a newer breed. Doesn't surprise me that they prefer a knob or a pedal, but it is not an absolute requirement. If you ever want to start a war in off-road circles ask if weaving or figure-8 is the better wash-weld technique. Quite a thread on that some time ago on RDC.

When I used to frequent a few off road sites soe of the metal melting discussions did indeed get heated.
 
Contact start / strike arc welding is simply just older technology and has nothing to do with the quality or ability to control a weld.

A lot of chassis builders are dealing with tubing joints that require a lot of precision to start the arc, so I can see how this could aid them, but there are ways around it.

Typically on complex tubing joints, like in cage builds, you need a lot of stickout on your tungsten. This inherently requires a diffuser and larger gas lense, to adequately protect oxygen from the work.

The reason you go with the pedal is actually because of the ability to control the weld on the fly. When you are dealing with odd shapes, it is very difficult to use a hand trigger and produce anything, except for assembly line results on continuous, small or short bead passes. Like if you are doing a hundred 1" stitches on 3/16" stock.

Cars need a lot of control, because you are inherently dealing with a lot of different thicknesses and positions of metal, sometimes even several thicknesses and angles at once.

This is actually the reason that I elected not to get a water cooled torch. I use a CK 17 whip that keeps the torch light in my hand and I run the whip off of the foot pedal that I made, so I've got less line tripping me up. I have whip in a velcro loop attached to my belt loop on my pants, with a single loop, so I can adjust whip length from my hip to my hand at any time, but only carry the weight of the line that goes from my hip to my hand, to help control and keep from fatiguing.

I run a 185 amp machine that has 110 and 220 voltage input capabilities. I've tripped the shitty breaker in my old garage on it, but that doesn't say much, because the whole thing was on a 20 amp. I have yet to trip duty cycle.

Typically, you won't hit it on a project when working on cars, because nothing requires a weld to be done, that long, on a car. Heavy welds are usually simple joints, like on frames, motor mounts, cages, spring purches, etc. It is not common to push a bead that is several feet long on anything that is beyond sheet metal, and the last thing you want to do is burn a bead that long, without stopping, on sheet metal.

I have yet to find a use in the home garage for a water cooled torch, unless you are doing nothing, but welding all day, you simply don't need it. It's only going to cut down on your accuracy, control and increase the weight and difficulty to weld. If you've got one, by all means, use what you've got, but don't worry about it if you don't have it, working on a car or hobby level use of any kind.

If you are doing heavy work, be sure to get a good size tungsten and go with something that will hold up, like a 2% thoriated, versus a 1.5 or 2%lanthanated. I've used them all and I think the thoriated can be used on anything. I like 3/32" for most work. I'd suggest to go a little bigger on frame work.
 
Been doing all my practice so far with just the torch switch, trying to work on puddle control and moving/feeding wire at appropriate speeds. Prob won't mess with my pedal until I feel a little more confident with just the switch.

Ditch the torch switch and try that puddle control with the pedal.

The torch switch that I have, I kept, but I use it with velcro, when I need a tac weld that I can't obtain with a foot pedal, for that stage of assembly.

If you plug that pedal in, you will be surprised at how easy it is to start the arc and control amps. Set the pedal max amp when floored, a bit higher than you will be running it at, so you can melt stuff in when needed. The nice part about the pedal is that you can back it off when needed, to keep the weld from burning through or the puddle from growing too much.

If you're finding that you have to chase the puddle quicker, once the metal is warm, you won't have that problem with the pedal, because you can slow it down or even pulse the pedal and keep the arc on, unlike trying to pulse with an on/off torch trigger.

It seems counter intuitive to try and run a welder at first with a foot control, but you will actually discover that it is much easier to weld with it, than to try and get good at using a trigger that doesn't allow you to control amperage right when you need it.

I had initially thought the same thing; that I would use the torch trigger until I got better. After finding myself going for the amp control on the box a few times to turn it down or up, I quickly realized as I was welding, how nice it would be to just bump it up a little more or slow it down a little more, instead of having to change the speed that I was moving, to get consistent results.

Break that pedal out.
 
I've yet to see an air cooled torch that was as small any any of the water cooled torches that I've seen and used. The size factor alone makes me very resistant to an air cooled as I've had many times when the water cooled torch was too big to fit where I needed to go without resorting to 2" of stick-out. I did not notice any difference in weight. I did notice how hot the air cooled got when the gas flow was appropriate for the weld. When I'm going to be extended out and can't otherwise take the lead strain off my hand I wrap the lead around my forearm. Good/bad practice, I don't care. It works for me. I've only had it bite me once and I was knowingly pushing 250 amps thru a 200 amp torch.
 
What sizes are the torches you are using, ntsqd?

The torch that I am using is a 17. Water cooled torches come in all sizes. 9, 17, 18, 20, 26, etc.

17, 18 and 26 are larger size head with their own set of consumables, while 9, 18 and 20 are small.

The size of the lense or cone makes access a big difference. 2" of stickout is massive. If you need that much depth, it sounds to me like the neck of the torch is getting in the way. A pencil type, flex head or a longer gas nozzle or lense is needed on the head of the torch. I can't imagine what kind of gas flow you would need and what kind of diffuser with two inches of stickout and still get a clean weld. The flow increase would cause a lot of turbulence at 2", even with a diffuser and would eat up a lot of gas.

I'm debating on getting a #9 torch with a flex or swivel head, for really tight areas, but I went with the 17 because of it's capacity to go up to 200amps, with my machine running up to 185, or 205 on helium.

If your machine runs up to 250amps, the head of that torch might be a little big for some of the sheet metal or chassis work that you are trying to do. Look into getting a second torch set for that thing, to get closer to your work and you will see better results in color, less porosity and scatter from better shielding and better control of the bead.

The more torches, types of cones/ lenses and tungsten as well as tungsten sizes you've got in your tacklebox, the better you can suit your welder to the job. There is never a perfect tool for every job and tig welding is no exception.
 
What I meant by "without resorting to 2" of stick-out" was that the air cooled torch wouldn't fit between the maze of tubes and still have a decent arc gap w/o an excessive stick-out.
 
I see.

I know that a smaller size torch is available with water and air. If you weld a lot, like if you work at a fab shop or something, water cooled is the way to go.

So far, I haven't had any trouble running my air setup, but I wouldn't be against building a small cooler for some stouter jobs in the future.
 
If you don't use it all that often you can just run it constant loss by hooking it to the garden hose and letting it drain into the lawn or flower bed or whatever. I have two friends who each independently came up with doing it this way and it works fine.
 
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