What do I gain by going to 'performance' front end parts?

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Mopar to ya

Mopar to ya

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I am not having any issues with my front end, but this winter I am going to install all new parts, just so I know everything is new and will last. I get good discounts at all the parts stores. My question is: what do I gain going to 'performance' parts? Is it going to be worth twice the price and more? I looked at PST because they are offering a FABO discount. The super performance kit is $450. I can buy everything in that kit for a little more than $200 from NAPA in their top line parts. Thoughts and comments?
 
You'll get more out of RMS A arms, then new bushing and ball joints.
 
More what? Responsive handling or steering? I really don't have handling issues. I'm really trying to understand the gains and if they are worth so much more money. Keep in mind that this is almost a daily summer driver for me. It has yet to see the track, though it will on occasion. Other than that it's a normal street machine.
 
All depends on what you are looking for. Just a basic OE replacement over a worn out set will make a huge difference. If you are running it hard and want optimal performance, like 70 Duster said, go with tubular arms with hi performance bushings etc. I have the RMS complete front end and it's awesome stuff if you have the budget or just do a coil over swap with stock K. Lots of options just weigh your budget just like anything else. Good luck
 
Mopar to ya said:
More what? Responsive handling or steering? I really don't have handling issues. I'm really trying to understand the gains and if they are worth so much more money. Keep in mind that this is almost a daily summer driver for me. It has yet to see the track, though it will on occasion. Other than that it's a normal street machine.
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so far on my 65 satellite (440 auto) I've seen this. I have PST poly bushings and all their kit in it. It's tighter than it was (suspension was really bad) and has a solid steering response and is supposed to last longer (it transmits more road noise to the inside of the car though) it did squeek but that was my ault for not lubing the poly before install, took it back off lubed it and all was good. it has Gas shock all around
this car does see some track time.
I just did a friends 70 challenger with stock parts and gas charged shocks , all rubber and no poly. it seems that it tightened up his car also.
Driving his car is just as smooth as the 65's and quieter no extra noise other than the normal engine noise. (440 six pack 4 speed)

My choice on the next car (66 dart convertible) is Rubber because it's going to be a DD(and I couldn't find offset bushings in poly). I can't see the quality difference unless your pushing your car in either track or road racing twisties. plus I figure that if the originals or replacements that I took off the car lasted 199,000 and 40+ years and that even if I put on 30k (not happening) a year driving the dart it'll be another 7 years till I gotta do it again. then they'll probably have come out with some other material that last's even longer than poly.
 
Unless you are upgrading your wheel and tire package along with performance shocks just go with stock stuff because you won't see much difference.

The upper "A" arms will allow for more alignment freedom but you can also get some of that with offset upper bushings in your stock A-arms.

I know this is overly simplified but if you are running some craptastic 14" or 15" white letter tire and plan on continuing to run a tire like that you just won't be able to take advantage of these upgraded suspension components (or the gain will be rather small).
 
If you want to stay close to stock but want a better road feel and longer life, then go with the urethane bushings. I just did this and as I recall, either the upper or lower control arm bushings were not available in urethane. Lube them to prevent squeaking.
 
I put poly bushings all around , much better , steering is more precise , road feel much better , handling is excellent , much better that the old rubber . Plenty of new sports cars have a hard time keeping up with my Dart around the back roads . No lean , no bounce , only thing that would improve it would be I R S . Also have the upgraded stage II steering box
 
Never been one for Poly bushings, too damn squeaky for me. Don't know if A-bodies are the same but I was told not to run poly strut rod bushing on my 64 Fairlane, few people on one of the Fairlane forums I used to frequent had issues with the strut rods tweaking form the poly bushings.....
 
Did not put the poly on the lower control arm , used the stock moog lca bushing . So far no squeaks using the black energy suspension bushings , if that makes difference
 
inkjunkie said:
Never been one for Poly bushings, too damn squeaky for me. ..
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The freakin squeakin has been drivin me nuts this past year. I wish I would have known about it before, I woulnt have gone poly bushings.

PS - is there something to spray on to stop the squeaking?
 
Huh. So the consensus seems to be that poly will get me better and more precise handling, but they tend to squeak. I can lube them, but squeaks drive me nuts. I guess if I am going to do this, I want to do it once and do it right. I am installing QA1 shocks at the same time.
 
Mopar to ya said:
Huh. So the consensus seems to be that poly will get me better and more precise handling, but they tend to squeak. I can lube them, but squeaks drive me nuts. I guess if I am going to do this, I want to do it once and do it right. I am installing QA1 shocks at the same time.
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Get a greaseable lower control arm pivot and use a poly over bushing, problem solved.
 
Except if you use a poly lower control arm bushing there is nothing to hold the lCA located on the pin besides the torsion bar. There has been an ongoing debate over the suitability of poly in LCA bushings for years. It has to do with the fact that poly bushings don't have any "grip" on the lca pin or the outer bushing shell the way that the rubber bushings do. Some creative individuals have found creative solutions to this issues, but rubber works for me.

I would go with rubber bushings and other strength enhancing mods like k-member reinforcements and subframe connectors. I have the poly bushed RMS upper arms and they do squeak something fierce. There are 2 different thicknesses of strut rod bushings make sure to get the correct one.

Have you already bought the QA1's? Bilstein makes a real good shock and is likely cheaper than qa1. Do you have swaybars? Larger torsion bars? Larger rims and lower profile tires? These are things that will improve handling and response without the tradeoffs involved with poly.
 
mcnoople said:
Except if you use a poly lower control arm bushing there is nothing to hold the lCA located on the pin besides the torsion bar. There has been an ongoing debate over the suitability of poly in LCA bushings for years. It has to do with the fact that poly bushings don't have any "grip" on the lca pin or the outer bushing shell the way that the rubber bushings do. Some creative individuals have found creative solutions to this issues, but rubber works for me.

I would go with rubber bushings and other strength enhancing mods like k-member reinforcements and subframe connectors. I have the poly bushed RMS upper arms and they do squeak something fierce. There are 2 different thicknesses of strut rod bushings make sure to get the correct one.

Have you already bought the QA1's? Bilstein makes a real good shock and is likely cheaper than qa1. Do you have swaybars? Larger torsion bars? Larger rims and lower profile tires? These are things that will improve handling and response without the tradeoffs involved with poly.
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I'm not looking to improve the handling so much as to assure everything is in good working order. And if I am going to do it, I figure I will do it with the best parts to suit my purpose. If I am going to get better handling, I sure wouldn't complain. I have not bought the QA1 yet, but I looked at Bilstein and it seems to me they were more expensive. It's been a while, though. Are they adjustable and rebuildable? I do not have sway bars but have been tossing that around as well.
 
Agree that intended use of the car ought to dictate choice of poly or rubber. Have had no squeaks with PST.

Anything you do to replace 40 yr old rubber in the front end is going to make things better. Same for replacing shocks. Strongly recommend a gas charged shock.

Front and rear sway bars are good. IMHO the factory LCAs with sway bar tabs are the way to go. Aftermarket tabs are too wimpy. An exception is an aftermarket LCA with tabs (but that's a few $s more).

Low profile tires are good, too. Go too low with the crappy streets here at the Edge of the World and you're going to bend a rim. I've found 60 series to be a good trade-off.

I have done all of the above to both cars and made them much more pleasant to drive. The most dramatic change I have made is to change the front end settings.

.5 degrees negative camber
1/16" toe-in
as much caster as posible up to +4º

The most I could get out either car was +2.5º. Still the turn-in difference was stunning. If you like it, thank AutoXCuda, he's da front-end guy.
 
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