MuuMuu101's 68 Dart, A Learning Process...
- Thread starter MuuMuu101
- Start date
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Shannon Hudson's Green Valiant. [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ztP6xUskg8"]Start: $400 - Finish: Mean Green MOPAR: Violent Valiant - /BIG MUSCLE - YouTube[/ame]
The problem is it was rebuilt in the 90's and the engine is a little tired out and has leaks. Plus, on top of that, the intake is a bit tall and will interfere with my hood with the supercharger. So, I'm thinking about throwing the supercharger off to the side and getting aluminum heads and such to get weight down.
Nope... He changed his mind. He bought the SRT4 engine and figured he might not have enough torque at cruising RPM's so he decided to go another route. Pentastar 3.6L. He said he was able to buy one off of a 2013 vehicle which is apparently the same bellhousing pattern as a small block and Gen III Hemi. I had thoughts of doing the swap 6-12 months ago, but the tuning alone would make me go insane especially since it would be my first time and it has variable cam timing. Plus, good used engines are still a little hard to find. It should be a good engine. I'd figure it weighs somewhere around 50-100 lbs less than a Gen III Hemi since the block is aluminum. It's also a 60 degree block so the heads are further away from the sides. On top of that the exhaust manifolds are cast into the heads so exhaust routing shouldn't be difficult. It could make it easier to turbo too. But with that light of weight and 300 hp at the crank NA, it's not that bad of an option.
I love your build as well. I wish I had as much skill and attention to detail as yo do.
Went and visited Hotchkis yesterday. I dropped off some parts and discussed the game plan with them. We also measured and mocked up my side impact members and they should be pretty neat. Then I took the engine and drove it all the way to IMM engines. Unfortunately, I didn't realize there was coolant still in the water pump. So, once I made the first stop leaving the driveway I heard a stream of coolant dump onto the floor of the SUV.
racerhog
RacerHog likes his Mopars
I think that falls under..... "Stuff Happens".... 
JBrian
Well-Known Member
Shannon did the gauges for my 1971 Duster dash. Glenn at GCar did the dash. Hope he treated you well as they both do outstanding work.
Me too! Looks like we did similar options! Tach... Voltmeter conversion...
I really don't have an update. The car generally stays in the back of my mind. Espescially this past week since I was focusing on some testing to get into graduate school and my birthday was on Friday.
Although, since the new CAM rules came out, I was thinking of new, composite aero ideas since the front spoiler and rear diffuser don't have to be within the constraints of the bumper on "non-integral" bumper cars. I'm sure it would help on a race track, but I don't know how well they'd help on a low speed autocross.
To get any significant aero forces below 50mph your spoiler would have to be the size of a garage door. Pretty much useless for an autoX. Won't hurt anything, but it won't help much either. You might see some minor cooling benefits if your front spoiler is directing more air into the radiator instead of letting it go under the car, but you're not going to see any significant downforce.
Road course is a different story. Typically aero doesn't start to a become significant handling issue until you're talking about sustained speeds over 75-80mph. At least if you're talking about downforce and drag.
most of the autocross events try and design the track to have an average speed of less than 35 mph. I know goodguys events shoot for this number.
Yeah, if I end up taking on the project it would be more of an exercise of "can I do it?" I know aero on an autocross won't be much of any benefit. The front spoiler would only be beneficial to reduce lift at higher speeds and, as mentioned before, to possibly provide cooling to my engine bay (which I may need if I keep the supercharger). And I can't do a spoiler for the rear. Rules state no spoilers unless it's OE design (and a '68 Dart never had a spoiler). However, there's nothing against diffusers...
So, another bit of an update. I just talked to Brian at IMM engines. When he tore my engine apart, he was surprised that it had all stock internals. He said the block was good but was in need of a rebuild as all of the bores were about 0.003" out of round. Anyway, we talked it over and speculated what would be the best method to pursue for this engine (supercharger vs. stroking) and we decided stroking.
Here are some specs on the engine: 408, forged SCAT rotating assembly (4.00" stroke, 0.030" overbore), EQ Magnum Cylinder heads adapted to the LA block, hydraulic roller cam and lifters, ARP fasteners, Milodon Road Race oil pan and pick up, 1.6 aluminum rocker arms, Marley 5/16 push rods, 750 DP carburetor w/ 1/2" carb spacer, MSD Ready 2 Run distributor, match-ported Edelbrock LD4B etc.
It should make about 500-575 hp according to Brian. ETA on dyno day is going to be sometime around mid-January.
Here are some specs on the engine: 408, forged SCAT rotating assembly (4.00" stroke, 0.030" overbore), EQ Magnum Cylinder heads adapted to the LA block, hydraulic roller cam and lifters, ARP fasteners, Milodon Road Race oil pan and pick up, 1.6 aluminum rocker arms, Marley 5/16 push rods, 750 DP carburetor w/ 1/2" carb spacer, MSD Ready 2 Run distributor, match-ported Edelbrock LD4B etc.
It should make about 500-575 hp according to Brian. ETA on dyno day is going to be sometime around mid-January.
I wish I could have some sort of taboo Mopar engine inside of my Dart, but simply, I don't have the amazing fab work, patience, or skills you have. Your car is going to be awesome. It will definitely turn heads when you drive down the street or pop the hood.
I'd be interested in hearing your cam specs if you are willing to give those out.
I don't know what they are as of now, but when I get the spec sheet from my engine builder I'll probably post the entire combo on here and/or in the small block thread.
Small update. Talked to the engine builder yesterday. He's a week behind so Dyno day will be January 22nd.
Thinking about the timeline and how long it takes for them to get work done, I highly doubt my car will make it to Mopars at the Strip. I'm going to really push for it though since the guys at Hotchkis usually hold the autocross. It would be great if I could get a lot of practice in it giving people ride alongs all weekend long.
Thinking about the timeline and how long it takes for them to get work done, I highly doubt my car will make it to Mopars at the Strip. I'm going to really push for it though since the guys at Hotchkis usually hold the autocross. It would be great if I could get a lot of practice in it giving people ride alongs all weekend long.
gold66cuda
Well-Known Member
Hey MuuMuu, I know you have put a bit of time and a pile of money into this project but you could make Muscle Cars at the Strip no problem, time to take the bull by the horns buddy. Hate to sound harsh but here is the plan. Your engine is getting dynoed on Jan 22 and thats a Friday so you pick up your car from Hotchkis on Thursday Jan 21 and get it home and ready for its new bullet. You and a couple of buddys go to the engine shop watch the dyno test, drop out the break in oil when its cooling down and getting taken off the dyno then throw it in your or your buddys truck and drag it home and spend the next couple of hours dropping it in. Come back to it on Saturday morning and complete exhaust, driveshaft, rad, oil and water it up and fire it up check for leaks. If Hothckis hasn't completed all the suspension work spend a couple hours and throw a set of torsion bars in it, a round of their adjustable shocks and sway bars at both ends. Have a buddy run to the tire shop and get the tires and wheels mounted up and when he gets back throw the tires on drop it on the ground and take it for a test drive. After this weekend of thrashing is done you will have a couple of months to shake it down and get her dialed in and sorted out and take the four hour drive to Vegas and have some fun. Once you get back from Vegas drop the oil recheck every nut and bolt on the thing rest it for a couple of weeks and bring it out to Willow Springs and have some more fun. Again hate to sound harsh but giddy up lets get going, I for one would love to see this car out tearing things up, it can be done , hundreds of guys on this forum do this kind of thing every year or every second weekend. Your a mechanical engineer, that's what they do!
You're not being harsh, just trying to be realistic and encouraging. Right now, the roll cage and interior should be finished. I already installed the suspension (entire TVS with adjustable shocks and 1.06" T-bars), brakes (Dr Diff 13" Brembo-like brakes and 11.75" rears), and wheels and tires before I sent it to them. The suspension just needs greasing and aligning while the brakes need new lines (as I screwed up) and has a sticking problem on the front passenger caliper I need them to look into. What makes it more difficult than just dropping in the engine is that they're doing a T56 swap along with the new engine. So, cutting and welding will be required. That's something I don't really have the provisions for and my only friend who has a welder is focusing on school so he can graduate as he's way overdue. While the engine is out, I'd also like them to add in a Borgeson PS box and weld up the K-member.
Right now, MATS is on my list of places to go. After that, if everything seems fine, I plan on going to Willow Springs for Spring Fling and possibly to Friday's cruise, but skip the show for the Optima event which is back in Vegas.
gold66cuda
Well-Known Member
Well that is great news, glad you took as I meant it, keep the pressure on you will love that thing when its all done, you wont want to get out of it. The Borgason unit is a great upgrade, go with a type 2 pump, type 1 didn't work to well for me. Keep your eye out for some bigger torsion bars, your going to want them and they will work well with your shock choice. We need a couple more a bodys at the Spring Fling at Willow Springs. Keep us updated!!
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