The only thing un-American about that conversation is the fact that your dumb@$$ friends/coworkers/neighbors/general yahoos aren't intelligent enough to know that a good deal of the parts on those new "American" cars aren't from North America.
Goodness if it comes from Mexico for these folks, too, right? Guess they'll have a problem with 360s - which were built there.
Hell, we should also wage war on Canada too for their assembly plants and interior parts, right? "Grab that there Smith and Wesson, boy - we're going to teach the world a thing or two!"
No. Doesn't work like that.
Ironically enough, the closest thing to communism in this whole discussion is the UAW's internal politics (not the individual worker, necessarily - see WildCat's post above).
Because someone was looking out for you. Arguing with an idiot is a waste of time that could be spent working on your car
Also a word to the wise: If you don't know that much about a subject, stay silent and let people think whatever they want. And if you do...pick your battles. Changing the minds of your pea-brained associates isn't going to make the world a better place.
IMO: There is a great peace of mind fixing cheap, old garbage myself than handing expensive, new garbage over to a repairman that I don't know, with skills that I don't trust, at a dealership who I don't like, who will try to tell me that they fixed the truck with magic fairy dust and voodoo.
Yes, I know there are some great mechanics out there, but I only know of one I can trust implicitly, even when I screw up: Myself.
What's more, I don't trust modern management of the 21st century, or anything it puts out. The corporate workforce has been a poster child for sloppy, dispassionate, and uncaring attitudes since our A-bodies were built, UAW or higher up. Today's incarnation adds 10 times the corporate bureaucracy and politics that existed back then, not to mention the cultural mess that happens every time a company changes hands (here's looking at you, Daimler-Chrysler-Fiat).
Neither do I buy into the "American-made" nonsense anymore, not for any company, including import vehicles made here. Crack open enough parts, and you'll find significant international outsourcing from one supplier or another. Anyone who thinks that any American vehicle today is virgin to China is fooling themselves like a Craigslister asking $20k for a slant six Duster with a tree growing through the hood.
For that matter, I don't care whether it comes from here or there - we've had enough garbage come from North America to render the previous point moot. If everyone weren't so hell bent on profit (can't blame anyone for that though), China could build stuff to a better quality than we can. They have the tools and infrastructure, we just keep accepting things built to crap specifications. Jackstands anyone? I'm not even sure if half of us here in America understand how a proper jackstand should be designed (Germany has a few makes of good ones - impossible to get here).
But I digress. What about access to repair data on new vehicles? Shop manuals? Knowledgebase articles? Recall information? Forget it. You don't get access to it, and when the tools do get sold off from dealers, individuals get locked out of the database. Presto, you just bought yourself a $40,000+ piece of four-wheeled yard art if something in this frail supply chain of information doesn't become public before your warranty runs out. Not to mention closed parts supply networks.
By comparison, the old stuff has the best manuals ever written for them, and the most comprehensive failures and "recalls" ever documented. It's called the internet, and its filled with decades of independent research from the largest team of beta testers ever compiled - owners and DIY'ers. And that includes people who are engineers and scientists by trade, who - given the opportunity and time - are often more effective at locating and/or solving factory design issues on an internet forum in the space of a week than the automaker is in solving the same problem in a year. Let's not forget the fellows with machining and CNC abilities either, who can build superior parts too.
Try digging up resources like that for new stuff. Nope.
My stuff is "proudly FIXED in America by my own two hands." And that's when I can rest easy and be proud of my gas-drinkin', piston-clunkin', air-pollutin', smoke-belchin' four-wheeled buggies from Detroit, Canada, Mexico, or the Federated Isle of Bum-Frick Fenwick.
-Kurt
Goodness if it comes from Mexico for these folks, too, right? Guess they'll have a problem with 360s - which were built there.
Hell, we should also wage war on Canada too for their assembly plants and interior parts, right? "Grab that there Smith and Wesson, boy - we're going to teach the world a thing or two!"
No. Doesn't work like that.
Ironically enough, the closest thing to communism in this whole discussion is the UAW's internal politics (not the individual worker, necessarily - see WildCat's post above).
Because someone was looking out for you. Arguing with an idiot is a waste of time that could be spent working on your car
Also a word to the wise: If you don't know that much about a subject, stay silent and let people think whatever they want. And if you do...pick your battles. Changing the minds of your pea-brained associates isn't going to make the world a better place.
IMO: There is a great peace of mind fixing cheap, old garbage myself than handing expensive, new garbage over to a repairman that I don't know, with skills that I don't trust, at a dealership who I don't like, who will try to tell me that they fixed the truck with magic fairy dust and voodoo.
Yes, I know there are some great mechanics out there, but I only know of one I can trust implicitly, even when I screw up: Myself.
What's more, I don't trust modern management of the 21st century, or anything it puts out. The corporate workforce has been a poster child for sloppy, dispassionate, and uncaring attitudes since our A-bodies were built, UAW or higher up. Today's incarnation adds 10 times the corporate bureaucracy and politics that existed back then, not to mention the cultural mess that happens every time a company changes hands (here's looking at you, Daimler-Chrysler-Fiat).
Neither do I buy into the "American-made" nonsense anymore, not for any company, including import vehicles made here. Crack open enough parts, and you'll find significant international outsourcing from one supplier or another. Anyone who thinks that any American vehicle today is virgin to China is fooling themselves like a Craigslister asking $20k for a slant six Duster with a tree growing through the hood.
For that matter, I don't care whether it comes from here or there - we've had enough garbage come from North America to render the previous point moot. If everyone weren't so hell bent on profit (can't blame anyone for that though), China could build stuff to a better quality than we can. They have the tools and infrastructure, we just keep accepting things built to crap specifications. Jackstands anyone? I'm not even sure if half of us here in America understand how a proper jackstand should be designed (Germany has a few makes of good ones - impossible to get here).
But I digress. What about access to repair data on new vehicles? Shop manuals? Knowledgebase articles? Recall information? Forget it. You don't get access to it, and when the tools do get sold off from dealers, individuals get locked out of the database. Presto, you just bought yourself a $40,000+ piece of four-wheeled yard art if something in this frail supply chain of information doesn't become public before your warranty runs out. Not to mention closed parts supply networks.
By comparison, the old stuff has the best manuals ever written for them, and the most comprehensive failures and "recalls" ever documented. It's called the internet, and its filled with decades of independent research from the largest team of beta testers ever compiled - owners and DIY'ers. And that includes people who are engineers and scientists by trade, who - given the opportunity and time - are often more effective at locating and/or solving factory design issues on an internet forum in the space of a week than the automaker is in solving the same problem in a year. Let's not forget the fellows with machining and CNC abilities either, who can build superior parts too.
Try digging up resources like that for new stuff. Nope.
My stuff is "proudly FIXED in America by my own two hands." And that's when I can rest easy and be proud of my gas-drinkin', piston-clunkin', air-pollutin', smoke-belchin' four-wheeled buggies from Detroit, Canada, Mexico, or the Federated Isle of Bum-Frick Fenwick.
-Kurt
