Is valve shrouding a concern in a 318 w/ 2.02 & 1.6 valves

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yellow rose said:
How do you figure you NEED 15:1? I can tell you as the compression ratio goes up, the tuning window gets smaller. I will not go over 13:1 for anyone unless you have a track record with me of being able to tune compression that high.

And then, you posted a comp cam. How did you get that cam? You don't want that find and 15:1.
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***Buries head in hands***....#-o
lol...i'm out of this one at this point.
 
273 said:
Are you gonna lose a few hp compared to 360/340 bores probably but not enough to worry about especially if your going 450 or less hp. You can notch it if you want to try to gain some back.
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Yeah.... target is as much as possible. Estimated approximately 625-725 hp...
 
This engine is for a sprint car, the friend who is helping me with machining said I need to get 15:1 compression. We're running methanol.
 
Johnny Pace said:
***Buries head in hands***....#-o
lol...i'm out of this one at this point.
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Johnny, I'd love to have your guidance for this build to be honest. I need someone who has a lot of experience building small block Mopars. I'm doing the best I can and just learning as I go. So far I only have a block and a forged crank out of a 273. That cam was recommended by CamQuest, however before I buy one I am going to request a recommendation from Comp directly through their customer service.
 
we are probably the largest sanction sealed circle track engine provider in the country....and not a single engine we offer is over 12:1. what random, no rules class is going to let a Chrysler 318..or 360...with a completely random parts list to run in competition?
http://paceperformance.com/rt-3682-circle-track-engines.html

I'll be glad to help...and we sell comp cams. I just need a budget, and a rules list. And the realization that some guidance is in order :)
 
Johnny Pace said:
we are probably the largest sanction sealed circle track engine provider in the country....and not a single engine we offer is over 12:1. what random, no rules class is going to let a Chrysler 318..or 360...with a completely random parts list to run in competition?
http://paceperformance.com/rt-3682-circle-track-engines.html

I'll be glad to help...and we sell comp cams. I just need a budget, and a rules list. And the realization that some guidance is in order :)
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Wow that's incredible. Mostly all the 360 sprint cars down here in California run about 14:1 compression, the really fast guys have 15.3:1. USAC West Coast 360 Sprint Cars is the class. The rules are here.

I would really appreciate that, I've been trying to find a Mopar specialized vendor who would want to help me out in any way. I'm pretty sure there's only one Mopar 360 sprint car in the entire state of California, the engine is out of a NASCAR Cup car and I believe he's running winged sprints. I'm going to run wingless, and everyone else runs a Chevy. I need all the help and support I can get in all shapes and sizes. My budget, well it's small, very small. :/ Let me put it this way, I'm very fortunate to have found some people who have wanted to help me get on the track and are supplying me with about 60% of a rolling chassis to assemble myself. I can get the rest of the parts for the roller, but I need help with the engine.
 
I think your way underestimating this build
 
Your gonna have to turn a 318 8000-10000 rpms to make 625-725 hp (that's a huge gap in hp) heads are gonna be in the 350-400 cfm range which is gonna be bigger than 2.02 valves. I can't see to many stock parts surviving these requirements.
 
Like i said, find me a rules/stipulations list....with an "open" class....the guy with the most money wins...so i don't get how that works. there has to be a class or rules set. Most of our ct engines have tamper proof seals that don't allow and modifications. hence sactioned racing, and making the driver the reason for winning, not the pocket book. educate me on what you can, and cant do. a "free" couple parts isn't a way to start any build...

"hey i want to build a nasty street engine...but my buddy gave me a 273 block, 3 cast pistons, and a tunnel ram with a dominator carb...so i want to use those"....not soo great a combo
 
273 said:
Your gonna have to turn a 318 8000-10000 rpms to make 625-725 hp (that's a huge gap in hp) heads are gonna be in the 350-400 cfm range which is gonna be bigger than 2.02 valves. I can't see to many stock parts surviving these requirements.
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Brodix B1BA Heads, does anyone know the exact bolt spacing for 318/340 main caps? I need to make some billet main caps. The only stock parts I'll be using are the block, timing cover, and maybe the crank. I'm looking to get the crank magnafluxed this week to see if it's any good, I'd like to get the journals welded so I can machine a radius into them.
 
The stock block and crank isn't gonna live at those rpm and hp levels. Your gonna need something better than the eddy heads to reach those power levels.
 
Ok skimed real fast through the rules

IT'S A 360 CLASS! you will get killed with anything less.

Heads can't be modified............Why do you want to put a 2.02 intake valve in a 318 head???????:evil3:
 
Johnny Pace said:
Like i said, find me a rules/stipulations list....with an "open" class....the guy with the most money wins...so i don't get how that works. there has to be a class or rules set. Most of our ct engines have tamper proof seals that don't allow and modifications. hence sactioned racing, and making the driver the reason for winning, not the pocket book. educate me on what you can, and cant do. a "free" couple parts isn't a way to start any build...

"hey i want to build a nasty street engine...but my buddy gave me a 273 block, 3 cast pistons, and a tunnel ram with a dominator carb...so i want to use those"....not soo great a combo
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The link to the rule book is here:
http://westcoastsprintcars.com/rules.html

Basically, there's a displacement restriction; within 1% of 360 c.i. There's 2 options for cylinder heads, open in which you must run a head within 1 degree of the OEM valve angle, and spec in which you must run a Brodix ASCS B1BA cylinder head which can't be ported or modified in any way. No electronics, a magneto must be used. Mechanical fuel injection is also required. I believe that sums it up. I agree. The only reason I'm starting with a factory block is because labor is free and I can do some labor to make it hopefully more rugged, and I can't afford $2000 for an R3, R4, or R5 block.
 
Cudafever said:
Ok skimed real fast through the rules

IT'S A 360 CLASS! you will get killed with anything less.

Heads can't be modified............Why do you want to put a 2.02 intake valve in a 318 head???????:evil3:
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I want to get on the track! I love racing, I've been off the track for a year and a half. Having a Mopar Sprint Car has been my goal for quite a few years now. I can always make it better and faster as I go. I'll worry about cubic inches later, having a shorter stroke and smaller bore means less rotating mass and better throttle response for the time being.

AND as I said, there's 2 options;

1) a spec head: Brodix ASCS B1BA which can't be modified

2) open: whatever you want as long as the valve angle is within 1 degree of factory.
 
Why is it you don't want to run a 360 block?????

EDIT
You will find water porting the 318 head before you get to the flow of a stock 360 head with a good valve Job.
 
The RHS head will out flow the stock 360 head!

The 318 head/ 318 block.......Don't understand the.... advantage?
 
MoparLeo said:
Good info from all. Why not go with a late model 360 ? It will have everything that you want stock.
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Because thats what he is messing with, thats why.
You go get yourself a 360 and report back.
Ether help or get out of the way.

yellow rose said:
How do you figure you NEED 15:1? I can tell you as the compression ratio goes up, the tuning window gets smaller. I will not go over 13:1 for anyone unless you have a track record with me of being able to tune compression that high.

And then, you posted a comp cam. How did you get that cam? You don't want that find and 15:1.
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Agreed, but......:violent2:
 
I'm using 318 block because its stroke and main journal size is more ideal than the 360s. And cause that's what I have. The only benefit to the 360 is the bore.
 
Christ! These freakin guys! Bash at every freakin turn. Allways gotta be a downer on what you got and what you use. So Freakin quick the internet hero he is to spend your money and chit on your head.
 
WOW!
OK original question
Is valve shrouding a concern in a 318 w/ 2.02 & 1.6 valves

YES.
With what your trying to do, yes
 
I'm Probly missing something, a stock bore x stroke 318 is not within %1 of 360...or did I misunderstand something.
 
InItSwingIt said:
I'm Probly missing something, a stock bore x stroke 318 is not within %1 of 360...or did I misunderstand something.
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Nice car and picture btw, I'm pretty sure it's okay to be undersize. Nobody is going to complain if you're "slower".
 
YES valve-shrouding will be an issue.

I can't watch this sh*t show any longer...

A 2.02 intake valve on a 3.91 (or any over-bore possible there-of, even a 4.04" for goodness sake) cylinder wall with a low-RPM cycle (1200-2200) will SUFFER from lack of velocity with that big of an intake valve on a street car. Especially a 318, god*amn.

WTF, does everyone on this site assume people still race around the street like dick's from 1977 or something?

2.02 intake valves were cool when 4.56 gears were too... at the f****** Sonic Drive-In back in '85 , dumb-dumb's.
 
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