First Engine Build - Advice Needed

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Jarrett21952

Jarrett21952

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I have a 383 out of a '65 Coronet. I purchased the motor from a guy in the middle of nowhere and it didn't cost much, so I'm not particularly worried about losing out or finding out its a lost cause... yet. I want to rebuild it with some power in mind, drop it into my 1971 Plymouth Valiant 4dr, and use it as a weekend cruiser. No drag strip fun, not looking to make a show car... just something loud and fun to drive. I already have plans for a complete overhaul of the car; suspension, brakes, drivetrain (including rear axle), interior, etc...

Here's my issue: I have very limited experience with engines, this will be my first build, and I need to know what I'm doing before dumping thousands of dollars into it.

Now, the engine wasn't running when I bought it... it was in pretty rough shape. I tore it apart, used a ridge reamer to get the pistons out, and took as much care as possible to keep everything identified, labeled and original locations marked. I believe that I'll have to bore the cylinders and get new pistons/internals anyways, but as far as I can tell, the block and crankshaft look good. I know I need to have them checked for cracks, warping and imbalances by a professional machine shop... but after that, I'm clueless.

That is the extent of my knowledge and experience. From this point on, I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm looking for advice on what steps I need to take, what parts to buy and when, what I'm looking for before I move to the next part, and so-forth. I've been researching online for months now and the info I'm finding is never specific to my individual needs or exactly what I'm looking for... honestly, I'm starting to get frustrated. I don't want to give up on my project, but I'm tried of feeling lost all the time.

If anyone can provide any info (preferably for this specific engine), checklists, sources to use, or step-by-step instructions for 383's, I'd REALLY appreciate it.
 
Jarrett21952 said:
I have a 383 out of a '65 Coronet. I purchased the motor from a guy in the middle of nowhere and it didn't cost much, so I'm not particularly worried about losing out or finding out its a lost cause... yet. I want to rebuild it with some power in mind, drop it into my 1971 Plymouth Valiant 4dr, and use it as a weekend cruiser. No drag strip fun, not looking to make a show car... just something loud and fun to drive. I already have plans for a complete overhaul of the car; suspension, brakes, drivetrain (including rear axle), interior, etc...

Here's my issue: I have very limited experience with engines, this will be my first build, and I need to know what I'm doing before dumping thousands of dollars into it.

Now, the engine wasn't running when I bought it... it was in pretty rough shape. I tore it apart, used a ridge reamer to get the pistons out, and took as much care as possible to keep everything identified, labeled and original locations marked. I believe that I'll have to bore the cylinders and get new pistons/internals anyways, but as far as I can tell, the block and crankshaft look good. I know I need to have them checked for cracks, warping and imbalances by a professional machine shop... but after that, I'm clueless.

That is the extent of my knowledge and experience. From this point on, I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm looking for advice on what steps I need to take, what parts to buy and when, what I'm looking for before I move to the next part, and so-forth. I've been researching online for months now and the info I'm finding is never specific to my individual needs or exactly what I'm looking for... honestly, I'm starting to get frustrated. I don't want to give up on my project, but I'm tried of feeling lost all the time.

If anyone can provide any info (preferably for this specific engine), checklists, sources to use, or step-by-step instructions for 383's, I'd REALLY appreciate it.
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First, find a GOOD, REPUTABLE machine shop and talk to them. They can give specific advice on THIS engine. What happens next will depend on what parts are salvageable. Best situation is that the crank, rods, heads, and block are usable. You can get the cam reground but IMO it's better to get a new cam kit (cam, lifters, & matching springs). Talk to the machine shop and they can guide you on what to get. As far as assembly, it's pretty straight forward but there are some things you'll need to pay attention too.

I'm sure there are online resources that can give you step by step instructions on how to assemble a V8 and people here can give you things that are maybe specific to mopars.
 
I'm old school, I prefer to look in a book rather than surf the web and get 20 different answers from 15 different people. Paper is cheep, write down WHAT YOU want, your performance goals and how much you want to spend; this will be an ongoing guide till you are done.

Get a factory service manual, look for one between 1968 to 1972, that will cover the muscle car years. It will give you all the technical specs to tear down your 383 and rebuild it; Mancini racing has books on rebuilding you big block Mopar, they are like $20.00. Read them before you ask questions on line; form the sound of what you wish to do, a stock rebuild on the 383 with a mild cam and an aftermarket dual plane intake is what you are looking for.
 
A 65 383 should have a forged crank, good rods, small port closed chamber heads. Add a windage tray, high pressure oil pump spring, "A" body oil pan, descent pistons, at least Sealed Power Moly rings. Cam with about 268 duration and matching valve springs, double roller timing chain, 68 or newer intake and 4 barrel Carb. Big block TQ would be nice. Big blocks are nice since the intake is dry, easy to swap. 72 up heads flow better and have hardened exhaust seats if you can find a set for a reasonable price. You will probably need exhaust valves. Do not buy anything until a machinist measures everything and you decide what direction to go. Typically you can get a nice running 383 with a bore and hone with torque plates, a good valve job, balance, cam bearings, resize the rods with standard ARP rod bolts. A lot of times a forged crank just needs to be polished. You can spend as much as you want, great advice above. Find out what you have. Check your options. Be realistic with what you want. Is it in your budget? Add it all up on paper. What do you have to do to the rest of the drive train to have it survive? What brakes are on the car?
 
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OK, I'm still currently going through my first build, here's something I learned.

STEP 1: Calculate your budget!

STEP 2: Double your budget!
 
Thanks for the info guys... Two of those books I was actually looking at buying online about an hour before writing this post, the other two I'd never heard of, and definitely look like a worth while purchase.

I guess I should have specified my original concerns better. I've spoken to three local machine shops and all three have told me that they wont touch the block until I purchase the rods and pistons to go with it. I don't want to do that in case the block is bad or some other restriction changes. I was hoping that I could have the shop check for cracks, clean the block, etc, before I needed to buy any new internals. I know the camshaft is excessively worn (groove marks on the lobes), and I was thinking about going with new heads and valve assembly anyways. I don't have an intake or carburetor, so I'll need to pick those out as well. I'm not sure what needs to go with what, which is the primary concern for my confusion (i.e. what intake goes with what carb... how does valve lash/timing/components work with other parts... how do I, or even, should I, stroke the engine?). I imagine that buying the books will answer a few of these, I was just hoping to get some answers now so I can make plans for my bonus check, rather than waiting until my wife gets her "claws" into it.

As for some of the questions; Budget is changing as time goes on, so I'll do what I can, when I can. The transmission will need a rebuild/overhaul regardless... it's a 727 auto originally paired with the existing 225 slant six. I plan on building the 383 first, then modifying the drive train accordingly, based on engine dyno results. The brakes are going to get a full overhaul with the replacement of the rear axle (upgrading to 8-3/4 rear with 10" discs all around). I have a plan to switch to a Hotchkis Suspension system eventually, front brakes will be redone with that project. The rest is pretty unnecessary to worry about at the moment.

72Dart6pack: I've thought about that, even considered it seriously. But when I think about it, I feel like I wouldn't value the car as much. I really want to BUILD the car, not just slap it together and drive it. I'm a glutton for punishment it seems...
 
1st pic $300 I bought a complete 360.
2nd pic $2500 now it's a 408
3rd pic $2200 1970 AAR Cuda 6 pack.

Do the math so far. It's not cheap. But I enjoy it.

IMG_03671.jpg


20170319_152950.jpg


20160404_195801.jpg
 
72Dart6pack said:
1st pic $300 I bought a complete 360.
2nd pic $2500 now it's a 408
3rd pic $2200 1970 AAR Cuda 6 pack.

Do the math so far. It's not cheap. But I enjoy it.
Click to expand...

I'm assuming that all three pics are from a custom build? I figured about $5k-$6k for my engine build, so I probably wasn't too far off.

I have $250 invested in my 383, intake manifold has a crack in it, the carb and distributor is damaged, and it's missing a lot of parts. I have all the internals, but I will likely only be able to salvage the crank shaft and block... maybe the rods as well.

20160921_153026.jpg
 
Jarrett21952 said:
I'm assuming that all three pics are from a custom build? I figured about $5k-$6k for my engine build, so I probably wasn't too far off.

I have $250 invested in my 383, intake manifold has a crack in it, the carb and distributor is damaged, and it's missing a lot of parts. I have all the internals, but I will likely only be able to salvage the crank shaft and block... maybe the rods as well.

View attachment 1715090786
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I dunno... the heater hoses and the fan look good.
:poke:
 
First thing I would ask is why you're doing it yourself. If you're doing it because you want to do it yourself, that's good and more power to you. There's lots of help here. If you're doing it yourself to save money, you won't save much.
 
Leadfoot said:
First thing I would ask is why you're doing it yourself. If you're doing it because you want to do it yourself, that's good and more power to you. There's lots of help here. If you're doing it yourself to save money, you won't save much.
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Agreement here... Disassemble, and count your bucks..A,low compression 440 out of a motorhome might shock you,(YouTube Roadkill 440Charger,AND Crop Duster..never had more than 8 to 1. ) Let's start there...
 
1) If your wife has claws, forget building the car, or prepare for a divorce.
2) Read, read, read before you buy anything.
3) If the 727 was original to the slant six it will not bolt to a 383. However some internals will interchange with a B-engine 727.
4) You cannot buy pistons until the machine shop tells you the condition of the bores.
5) Read, read, read.
6) A weekend cruiser doesn't need to be stroked.
7) Read, read, read.
8) How did they manage to break an intake manifold? Frozen water expansion? Check the engine internals!
 
You could disaasemble, check clearances and do an "Overhaul" This is assuming that your crank journals aren't scored, and you can hone cylinders and re ring. All it takes is cleaning the parts up and taking measurements. If there is a heavy ridge on the cylinders, that may be a sign for example, if there is no ridge, it may be good to go. But you would measure taper by measuring ring gaps, top and bottom and subtracting the two. You could measure the cam lobes for wear. As you do this, you take notes. Ideally all you would need in parts is a gasket set, and a ring set, maybe a cam. If you cam it, you may want to get a good carburetor, the sky is the limit. My point is, you can get away with not going to a machine shop if it isn't warranted or necessary based on your clean/inspect/ take measurements process. It is a 383 so it should be plenty of power for a Valiant in stock form.
 
Jarrett21952 said:
Thanks for the info guys...
I guess I should have specified my original concerns better. I've spoken to three local machine shops and all three have told me that they wont touch the block until I purchase the rods and pistons to go with it. I don't want to do that in case the block is bad or some other restriction changes. I was hoping that I could have the shop check for cracks, clean the block, etc, before I needed to buy any new internals...
Click to expand...

First find a good machine shop. If they can't bore and hone with a torque plate, find another shop. If they want you to buy parts before they check the block, crank, rods, and heads, find another shop. If they mention Chevy, find another shop. Even if you have to drive a hundred miles.

New parts to buy, pistons, rings, main bearing, rod bearings, cam, lifters, valve springs to match the cam, double roller timing chain, stainless steel exhaust valves, Fel-Pro gasket set, water pump, brass freeze plugs, high volume oil pump, high pressure oil pump spring, windage tray, "A" body oil pan. What size pistons? Don't know till they measure the bores. Go as small as you can to get the bores straight and round. What size exhaust valves? Don't know till you decide on heads. Your heads are probably fine for what you want. Any 4 barrel intake and carb will do.

I have a "throw" together 383 in my 68 Barracuda, didn't even replace the pistons. 20 years later and about 100,000 miles on it, it still runs great. It was my daily driver for years. You don't have to spend a lot of money to go fast.

As for your transmission, I doubt it is a 727 from behind a /6. You'll need a big block auto trans, and shorten the driveshaft and have it balanced. You will also need an 8 1/4 or 8 3/4 rear, unless you build it up to 500+ ft lb of torque. Then you are looking at a Dana 60.
 
Throw the ridge reamer away and never use it again. If you need to use it, the bores are shot anyway, and all you did was make it harder to get the bores correctly.

Find a machine shop. If you want to do the assembly yourself you are making a mistake. You need to have all the tools to measure everything. Plastigauge don't cut it.

Back to the bores...it's very difficult to find 10 HP in the bores or even the short block but it's damn easy to lose 40-50 HP with crap bores.
 
WTF what kind of machine shop has the customer buy pistons before measuring the bores, fluxing and cleaning the block.
the same ones that have them buy bearings before measuring the crank.
I wouldn't let those 3 shops touch a briggs and Stratton.
but then again I wouldn't let most shops do my work.
A crate motor is your best bet. trust the warranty , not the bullshit shop and self proclaimed machinist.
 
IQ52 said:
1) If your wife has claws, forget building the car, or prepare for a divorce.
2) Read, read, read before you buy anything.
3) If the 727 was original to the slant six it will not bolt to a 383. However some internals will interchange with a B-engine 727.
4) You cannot buy pistons until the machine shop tells you the condition of the bores.
5) Read, read, read.
6) A weekend cruiser doesn't need to be stroked.
7) Read, read, read.
8) How did they manage to break an intake manifold? Frozen water expansion? Check the engine internals!
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1. Divorce may be inevitable regardless, she tolerates me working on the car and having my hobbies, but doesn't seem to grasp the concept of money being required to do it.
3. I have a buddy holding a 904 and another 727 for me, just in case mine won't do. Technically I own them both (for $30, not too bad). I plan on this project taking years so I know I'll have time to correct issues later on.
6. I actually just want to know what my options are, I don't necessarily plan on stroking it, was just curious if I could and what the outcome could be.
8. No freaking clue. I just saw the crack when I was disassembling the engine. The exhaust manifold on the currently running and installed /6 is cracked as well, I just assumed it was normal and would need to be replaced.


66fs said:
First find a good machine shop. If they can't bore and hone with a torque plate, find another shop. If they want you to buy parts before they check the block, crank, rods, and heads, find another shop. If they mention Chevy, find another shop. Even if you have to drive a hundred miles.

New parts to buy, pistons, rings, main bearing, rod bearings, cam, lifters, valve springs to match the cam, double roller timing chain, stainless steel exhaust valves, Fel-Pro gasket set, water pump, brass freeze plugs, high volume oil pump, high pressure oil pump spring, windage tray, "A" body oil pan. What size pistons? Don't know till they measure the bores. Go as small as you can to get the bores straight and round. What size exhaust valves? Don't know till you decide on heads. Your heads are probably fine for what you want. Any 4 barrel intake and carb will do.

I have a "throw" together 383 in my 68 Barracuda, didn't even replace the pistons. 20 years later and about 100,000 miles on it, it still runs great. It was my daily driver for years. You don't have to spend a lot of money to go fast.

As for your transmission, I doubt it is a 727 from behind a /6. You'll need a big block auto trans, and shorten the driveshaft and have it balanced. You will also need an 8 1/4 or 8 3/4 rear, unless you build it up to 500+ ft lb of torque. Then you are looking at a Dana 60.
Click to expand...

This is the type of advice I was looking for, it's the little things that I don't know. I understand the basic concept of internal combustion four stroke engines and how they work... but just like a water turbine hydro-electric generator, I have no idea how to build one. It's a learning process and I'm just getting started. Thanks for the tips, I'll try to be more specific with any questions I have later... though I may be studying books for the next couple months, so questions may not arise as often.

yellow rose said:
Throw the ridge reamer away and never use it again. If you need to use it, the bores are shot anyway, and all you did was make it harder to get the bores correctly.

Find a machine shop. If you want to do the assembly yourself you are making a mistake. You need to have all the tools to measure everything. Plastigauge don't cut it.

Back to the bores...it's very difficult to find 10 HP in the bores or even the short block but it's damn easy to lose 40-50 HP with crap bores.
Click to expand...

I was under the impression that a ridge reamer just removed ground up metal from the top 1/4" of the bores? I'm confused how it would screw up the ability to properly gauge the remaining lower part? As for the assembly, I imagine I'll have to assemble, disassemble and reassemble multiple times. I honestly have no problem with that. I'll be buying to necessary tools (dial bore gauge, micrometer, t-gauge, etc) as the project reaches those points.

I'm honestly not doing this out of arrogance or some other nonsensical reason. I want to learn these things and have a sense pride in my car. I want to be able to tear it apart and repair it myself if needed later on. I've thought of going with a crate motor on multiple occasions. I guess I just can't bring myself to do it. Feels too much like cheating or instant gratification...
 
Sounds like you have a plan, I applaud you for wanting to learn and build yourself. we have to start somewhere and 99% of the work is in machine work.
assembly is easy. If you can read and properly use tools that's the other 1 %. I built my first engine when I was 14 and it was a 383. I share bits and pieces of my 67 Fastback build which started at age 15 when I needed a body to stick the 383 and 727 in. 40 years later I still have the 67.
good luck, I hope you can find an honest machine shop.
 
You don't need to have to have a machine shop assemble your engine. Yellow Rose is trying to help you succeed. He is also right about the ridge cutter, you can easily cut off center or too deep and force yourself into having to buy larger pistons. There are a lot of things to learn, but if you are careful and very detail oriented you should be fine. You will not need dial bore gage and a lot of specialized measuring equipment unless you are doing the machining. That is why you need a good shop. You should get a tapered piston installer and use 3/8 fuel line on the rod bolts to prevent nicking the crank. Next would be a beam torque wrench big enough to torque the largest bolt in the engine. And a small one to torque the smallest bolt on the engine, usually inch pound. There is almost nothing better than firing your engine for the first time. I never get tired of it.
 
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