charger426
Well-Known Member
Thats also a 383 aka a lot easier because its a low deck. 
440 into a /6 duster
- Thread starter 1973_440_DUSTER
- Start date
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cletus
Cooter's Apprentice
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
True, but the pictures posted by zac F71 also depicted a 383 swap and I'm curious if the severe headerThats also a 383 aka a lot easier because its a low deck.
denting was necessary because of trying to make the headers fit while installing them from the top instead
of assembling everything on the K-frame outside of the car before inserting it from the bottom as a complete
engine/trans/headers unit?
My point being that any "necessary adjustments" will be easier and less severe if the out of car assembly
method is used intitially to identify any clearance issues. Tighter tollarences can be used if trying to make
everything fit prior to installation instead of during installation because nothing has to move once bolted
together.
If the assembly is on the floor and there is an area that requires a major header pipe repositioning you can
mark and change a small section of the header instead of beating it severly.
If your not handy with a welder (I'm not) you can take the header to a local race car builder/fabricator with
simple instructions of how you need the pipe moved.
We have done 440's also and here is one with, I believe, Pro-Parts headers that do have some strategically
placed albeit smaller dents around the steering shaft like the ones zac F71 posted. I suppose the fact that he
is using RB headers on a B swap accounts for the more dramatic issue at the steering arm.
Dartn440
Well-Known Member
Yes. It was beyond simple to assemble everything outside of the car and roll under. I would recommend that to anyone. The 72 Demon project is gutted up front for body and paint, but more importantly to assemble motor and Trans and bolt to front suspension. With the HDK and TTI I only needed one tiny ding to clear steering shaft. If I did it again I wouldn't need that by running out my initial piece further before the knuckle to the rack.
zac_F71
Well-Known Member
True, but the pictures posted by zac F71 also depicted a 383 swap and I'm curious if the severe header
denting was necessary because of trying to make the headers fit while installing them from the top instead
of assembling everything on the K-frame outside of the car before inserting it from the bottom as a complete
engine/trans/headers unit?
My point being that any "necessary adjustments" will be easier and less severe if the out of car assembly
method is used intitially to identify any clearance issues. Tighter tollarences can be used if trying to make
everything fit prior to installation instead of during installation because nothing has to move once bolted
together.
If the assembly is on the floor and there is an area that requires a major header pipe repositioning you can
mark and change a small section of the header instead of beating it severly.
If your not handy with a welder (I'm not) you can take the header to a local race car builder/fabricator with
simple instructions of how you need the pipe moved.
We have done 440's also and here is one with, I believe, Pro-Parts headers that do have some strategically
placed albeit smaller dents around the steering shaft like the ones zac F71 posted. I suppose the fact that he
is using RB headers on a B swap accounts for the more dramatic issue at the steering arm.
Mine are CPPA 2" 440 headers little big for a mild 383 but the price was right and they actually fit unlike from what I've heard over on BBD.com, and the like they aren't supposed to fit visaversa the Hedmans supposed to fit and I have 2 pairs sitting here that don't..
I had my whole front suspension already built, and in the car- brakes bled and all.. didn't want to drop it all again haha so I did it the harder way as it seems..
Trans had to go in first, then hook headers around the T bar's/ trans, and then the motor drops right in - headers clear everything - they didn't clear in the 440 car they came out of - the pitman arm grease zerk made it's own groove in them, and it looked horrible so I smoothed it out with a hammer.. and made the necessary dents to clear the gear box
1973_440_DUSTER
Active Member
I planned that this isn't gonna be a bolt in plug and play project. When I first bought this car in highschool I put in a bigger diff with the bigger bolt pattern and I have the bigger bolt pattern up fronot with disc brakes. I'm thinking I'm gonna search for a 727 auto. I just wanted to get some opinions from what other a body 440s builds have to suggest. I really appreciate all your guys opinions.
1973_440_DUSTER
Active Member
A big block swap is not for the faint of heart.. if you give up easy on stuff, this may not be for you.. not trying to talk you out of it but it just not easy. This was my first time doing the swap as well
That aside - here is the short list depending on your car's options - plan on it doubling any costs/time you may have planned when the time comes to get stuff done -
Reuse the slant 6 engine harness - have to shorten/legthen a couple wires = plug and play
with a big block motor
If 3/4sp-
short tail 833 like said
driveshaft - I'm sure custom length
car trans mount/ Xmember if different from an automatic trans piece
speedo gear/cable if different from an auto or what's in the car
car bell housing, flywheel/clutch
modified Z bar or hydraulic clutch setup
If auto-
A727
same slant 6 X member/mount
custom length driveshaft
3,000rpm stall converter minimum
factory floor shift or aftermarket cable shifter
Lokar kick down cable if no manual valve body
$70 throttle cable bracket from eBay
- much easier route in my book
Schumacher/ trans-Dapt swap mounts
Schumacher torque strap, and motor mount shims
V8 radiator and WP housing to match outlet sides
B body pass side, C body driverside manifolds OR-
TTi, or Schumacher headers - TTi headers do not fit PS, they can be made to fit with pounding a few of the tubes though
2.5" minimum exhaust system
8 3/4, ford 8.8, ford 9", or 3/4 ton JY Dana 60 axle (<- If I did it over again this is what I'd do)
3/8" fuel sending unit, and front to rear line
disc brakes in front minimum
US Car Tool subframe connectors and drive shaft loop
Mini starter from newer 5.9 magnum truck
These are the minimum parts needed to make it easier to install and get it running, it will still be difficult beyond this as these car's were not designed for this.. couple pics of my car to give you an idea.. had my engine in and out over 6 times fitting and refitting everything - (383/727 71 Demon with CPPA/TTi based 2" headers)
So if I'm using the ford diffs or the JY dana 60 will the bolt pattern be the same as my 5 on 4.5 or do I put my axle shafts in the dana or ford diffs?
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
The Ford diffs should be the regular Mopar 5 x 4.5" bolt pattern unless you have a truck unit which
might be 5 x 5".
You'll have to use axles made for those particular diffs but a lot of guys have Ford ends put on their
axle tubes (no matter what diff they use) because there are economical Ford Explorer disc brake kits
that can be retrofitted later.
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
Understood.
FYI, we don't take the brakes off of the car but leave them hooked up and hang them with wires while the
K-member is taken out - no rebleeding necessary. Also, if you assemble the power unit on the K-member
prior to installing, the transmission is already installed and the torsion bars are ready to be slid in.
Very easy to jumble everything into place when it's outside of the car. If you get a chance to try it sometime
you will never do it the old way again.
Photo: Test fitting a 472" Hemi with 727 and headers already assembled together on the K-frame. Note brakes
still hooked up and hanging. Drop the body down, screw the 4 K-frame bolts and trans crossmember bolts in,
re-assemble the front suspension and you are on the ground (no, you don't want to use those drum brakes!).
68dodge
Well-Known Member
I will make this simple, get your self a Schumacher 440 swap kit, plus ask them about shims for the motor to help get the motor level once its in. Follow there directions on what needs little modifications. You may have trouble with water pump to radiator clearance or use an electric water pump and fans. Torsion bars are up to you, if you want to drive just on the street and some drag racing. I would upgrade. Now I would upgrade to disc up front. That's up to you. Drums may be a little hard to stop with. Schumacher headers fit great and do work with a 500HP motor.
zac_F71
Well-Known Member
As Old Man Mopar said - most of the ford's use 5x4.5" (explorer/94+ Mustang), A dana 60 out of a junk yard will be out of a 3/4 or 1 ton truck, so you'll have to buy the car housing ends, and new axles
They're just options, that most of the time come with a good gear ratio, and limited slip. If you already have an 8 3/4 under the car leave it they are a good axle
70Duster440
Well-Known Member
Piece of cake. Schumacher's your friend. My upgrade from a slant... (and I kept the heater)
70 Duster (was a /6) with 383 4-speed. Schumacher mounts, TTi headers and NO hammering.
You can see in the pic where the #7 tube has three new (as yet unwelded) seams to very slightly
reposition the tube for clutch cross shaft clearance.
Had this been an automatic car, even this would have been unneccesary. I don't know why TTi
doesn't just build them like this and then they could be listed to fit either transmission.
You should assemble the engine/trans/headers on the K-frame outside of the car, test fit everything
before final paint and detail then install from the bottom for a clean, sanitary, no dent job.
old man,let me say that is a fansastic engine bay clean up job.one of the nicest ive seen.great job
1973_440_DUSTER
Active Member
What do I upgrade from torsion bars to. And I do have discs up front with the 5 X 4.5 bolt pattern
1973_440_DUSTER
Active Member
So upon further digging I realized this is a 400 block not a 440. I know that they are similar in hardware and such just the 400 is a bit narrower. So will most of this information based on the 440 swap be similar to a 400 swap.
68dodge
Well-Known Member
Torsion bars depends on what you want to do with the car, drag race only use the six cylinder. They will let the front of the lift to transfer weight better to rear, but will not handle good on turns with a big block. To handle on the street you want to go with a stiffer torsion bar. Go with any torsion bar from a .890" good handling to 1.04" which is great for HD solo, road racing or circle track. Depends on how stiff you want the front end.
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
A 400 has the same low-deck external dimensions as a 383 and is a way better deal. I'm building a
470 out of one with a 440 Source stroker kit but 512 cubes is also available for the same price.
This will look like the 383 Duster pictured above and is MUCH easier to fit exhaust headers on.
gunters96lt1
Well-Known Member
I swapped a 440/727 and I thought it was pretty easy. Shumacher headers and engine mounts.
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
Thank you (mostly from Denny). This is FABO member Hooshpuppy's car and was found in Nebraska (1st pic) by
HemiMark with 21,000 original miles. It was a /6, 3-on-the-floor and has completely original paint and upholstery.
Denny at HDK supervised the conversion utilizing a reinforced stock K-member and Schumacher conversion mounts.
The stealth build 383 includes + 0.030 KB pistons, H-beam rods, Comp hyd cam, Edelbrock heads and Performer intake,
TTi headers and a complete TTi exhaust system with series 40 Flowmasters. A fresh A833 replaced the 3-speed and an
8-3/4 with new springs fortified the rear end. Custom 15x5 and 15x7 Rally Wheels mount 205/70-15 and 275/60-15 tires.
zac_F71
Well-Known Member
Bad ***!Piece of cake. Schumacher's your friend. My upgrade from a slant... (and I kept the heater)
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