5.7 HEMI Vs. 408 Stroker

[USCG CHARGER]

That's cool!! I am running single spring comp behives, titanium retainers and I already had my rockers cryo treated beacuse of that reason. The stock rockers are very dainty and thin in stock form, but I really wanted a set of roller rockers!! Jesel makes them at the tune of around $4200 and alot of machining and extra parts. I will have to give Eric Hruza or Mark BurkHardt a call. Thanks for the info!!!

Eric H can hook you up... tell him I (Jason) told you about them he knows my screen name...He and I have been working on this for some time now... They are in the process of getting the cast rocker made b/c the billet pieces weigh 2x what the stockers weigh...The price should be arounf $1200 for the rockers.. Please dont ask for Mark he passed away this last summer.

 

[hemijoejr]

Eric H can hook you up... tell him I (Jason) told you about them he knows my screen name...He and I have been working on this for some time now... They are in the process of getting the cast rocker made b/c the billet pieces weigh 2x what the stockers weigh...The price should be arounf $1200 for the rockers.. Please dont ask for Mark he passed away this last summer.

Thanks for the info. The last thing I bought from them was a 3rd gen torque plate and that was 2 years ago. Mark was a nice guy to deal with!! What a shame!

 

[dartley]

Been paying attention to this topic. Can anyone recommend a good engine shop on LI for Mopars? Also, what should I expect to pay for nice street 408 build? ... decent heads, single plane manifold, steel crank, 2500 - 6000rpm powerband sort of deal.
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PS: That's Long Island, NY
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PPS: I located the following link which, if typical, indicates that it might be far more cost effective to build a 360 than a 408:

http://www.cmengines.com/Engines/RaceEngines/tabid/98/Default.aspx?gclid=CJT6xdari58CFQ975Qod3i4FTA

... What do you think?

 

[hemijoejr]

Been paying attention to this topic. Can anyone recommend a good engine shop on LI for Mopars? Also, what should I expect to pay for nice street 408 build? ... decent heads, single plane manifold, steel crank, 2500 - 6000rpm powerband sort of deal.
----
PS: That's Long Island, NY
----
PPS: I located the following link which, if typical, indicates that it might be far more cost effective to build a 360 than a 408:

http://www.cmengines.com/Engines/RaceEngines/tabid/98/Default.aspx?gclid=CJT6xdari58CFQ975Qod3i4FTA

... What do you think?

As for machine shops in Long island I don't know. As for the 408 It depends on what you have in it but from the way you were talking it should cost somewhere between $4000 to $9,000 and up depending on the internals. Just as an example, You could built a 408 with an eagle cast crank, eagle SIR rods, Hypereutectic pistons, stock heads, hydraulic cam ETC for around $3000-$4000 or you could go somewhere in between for $4000-$9000.

What are your plans for the car? Race Street? Both? That will get you closer to a price.

I don't like buying crate engines because who is to say how the machine work was done or what they used for parts. I checked the link that you posted and all of there engines are around 12-1 which is fine if you are gona race it.

 

[dartley]

Well I think I will give up on this one for now. To answer hemijoejr ... as I said, a street engine with a steel crank, and I think a nice build, after some research would probably cost about $6K. I have an old 340 steel crank engine that I was thinking about using as the base, but because it's original equip, I was advised by an appraiser not to use it for this.

I think it would be much more cost effective to just port the J heads, cam up and go with a single plane intake, on the Circa '92 crate 360/300. Thanks.

 

[hemijoejr]

Well I think I will give up on this one for now. To answer hemijoejr ... as I said, a street engine with a steel crank, and I think a nice build, after some research would probably cost about $6K. I have an old 340 steel crank engine that I was thinking about using as the base, but because it's original equip, I was advised by an appraiser not to use it for this.

I think it would be much more cost effective to just port the J heads, cam up and go with a single plane intake, on the Circa '92 crate 360/300. Thanks.

If you have the money. Send the heads to Hughes engines for a stage one port job (for the stock size 360) some roller rockers, I think that engine has a hydraulic roller cam so go with something in the 225deg @ .050 range on a 110LSA with an edelbrock air gap. AND CHECK YOUR CLEARANCES!!! Should run nice!!:toothy10:

 

[dartley]

Yes it's a hydr cam - I forget the specs, but I think it's PS 474/474 (P#312-P4452993 on JEGS), if that rings any bells. From what I hear Crane or Comp seem like the cams to go with nowaday. What needs changing to use a roller cam with the old J heads? I know there's much info here about that, but is there a Q&D ans on that?

 

[hemijoejr]

Yes it's a hydr cam - I forget the specs, but I think it's PS 474/474 (P#312-P4452993 on JEGS), if that rings any bells. From what I hear Crane or Comp seem like the cams to go with nowaday. What needs changing to use a roller cam with the old J heads? I know there's much info here about that, but is there a Q&D ans on that?

OK I think that block from the factory has a hydraulic roller cam. If it is then it's an easy change. If you don't have that many miles on that engine you can reuse the lifters and just replace the cam to the tune of $305.95 from summit racing COMP Cams 20-810-9 and you must purchase the correct valvesprings. If you want to change a flat tappet engine over to a hydraulic roller then you are looking at lifters (cheapest ones I saw were Hughes engines retrofits $399 and a cam at 305.95 and springs. The engine block must be checked for clearance for the link bar with the retrofit hydraulic roller and pushrod clearance, length must also be checked for both the cam change and the retrofit. It gets a little confusing and hard to explain when I'm typing it out but it is easy to explain face to face. Hope this helps!!!

 

[dartley]

It does help, thank you. But no, the engine is a flat tappet head set up. And while I am not in the mood to throw money around, I also don't want to skimp. So is there a better, easier, albeit pricier alternative to the "retrofit hydraulic roller" you suggested?

 

[hemijoejr]

It does help, thank you. But no, the engine is a flat tappet head set up. And while I am not in the mood to throw money around, I also don't want to skimp. So is there a better, easier, albeit pricier alternative to the "retrofit hydraulic roller" you suggested?

Sure!! You can just put a flat tappet back in it. I have used several Hughes engines cams. They make power! so a combination of stock bottom end with an Edelbrock air gap intake Summit Racing $259.95 , hughes stage 1 heads, with the correct springs and retainers installed ready to install $1377.40, HUG HEH2328AL cam $160, lifters $88.00, 1.50 Roller rockers $440.00 and pushrods around $130. I just picked a combination. Subject to your own judgement. Cam should be slightly lopey but not insane.:toothy10:

 

[dartley]

Sure!! You can just put a flat tappet back in it. I have used several Hughes engines cams. They make power! so a combination of stock bottom end with an Edelbrock air gap intake Summit Racing $259.95 , hughes stage 1 heads, with the correct springs and retainers installed ready to install $1377.40, HUG HEH2328AL cam $160, lifters $88.00, 1.50 Roller rockers $440.00 and pushrods around $130. I just picked a combination. Subject to your own judgement. Cam should be slightly lopey but not insane.:toothy10:

Thanks for the trouble - I really appreciate it!!!

That is not far from what I was thinking myself. Do you think this is markedly/noticeably/meaningfully better than sticking with a flat tappet, just to save a little bother?

 

[hemijoejr]

Thanks for the trouble - I really appreciate it!!!

That is not far from what I was thinking myself. Do you think this is markedly/noticeably/meaningfully better than sticking with a flat tappet, just to save a little bother?

This combo should be fine expecialy with the hughes cam. High lift for the duration. The one nice thing with the roller cam is almost a zero break in. The flat tappet hydraulic has to be broken in with a specific procedure and you realy should use a specific break oil. An oil addative should be added at every oil change too to be extra sure that you don't have a failure. The government had the oil companys take the good stuff out of engine oil because nowadays most engines run roller valve train components and don't need the extra anti friction additives. Has to do with emissions. If you think about haw many times you change the oil in your toy it dosn't add up to that much. Hope I answered your question?

 

[dartley]

This combo should be fine expecialy with the hughes cam. High lift for the duration. The one nice thing with the roller cam is almost a zero break in. The flat tappet hydraulic has to be broken in with a specific procedure and you realy should use a specific break oil. An oil addative should be added at every oil change too to be extra sure that you don't have a failure. The government had the oil companys take the good stuff out of engine oil because nowadays most engines run roller valve train components and don't need the extra anti friction additives. Has to do with emissions. If you think about haw many times you change the oil in your toy it dosn't add up to that much. Hope I answered your question?

Yes, zinc, et al ... I have been part of one or more of these threads over time, here and on Allpar. I am currently using a oil with the requisite zinc in it and the car only gets a few hundred miles of use a year. So, thought it'd be nice to go with a synth oil and not be troubled with this issue any longer, it's not a major concern either. Thanks again.