5.7 HEMI Vs. 408 Stroker

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Six pak on a Hemi, fuel injected!
 
Highly reccomend you obtain the book BIG-INCH mopar small blocks by Jim Szilagyi a Chrysler engineer. www.cartechbooks.com. I have a 68 340 block and mopar crank to do 416 stroker engine. The parts list is contained in the book, after considering the cost of parts and cost of machine work, I started to consider a mopar 5.7 engine for my 74 duster. Still in hold mode looking for more info.
 
i am seriously considering an efi hemi in my duster. i dont think for one second it is worth it as far as bang for buck. the part the really pisses me off and keeps me from wanting to do it, is the electronics side of it. 1,000$ for a pre made wiring harness to be able to run a o.e.m. computer? how much does it really cost to build that harness. minimum 2,000$ for an aftermarket management system? bunch of crooks out there. to me there is no point of running a carb on one of these engines, way too much money and effort involved to really get no advantage over a carbed small or bigblock. you can build a motor and get it running for less than you can have a junkyard engine and trans sitting in your a body, but not yet running.
 
Well, let me chime in again here, as I have a modded 2009 SRT-8 Chally 6-Speed and a 68 Notchback with a very beefy 408. The Cuda will hand the Chally it's @$$ on a dragstrip, but they are 2 different animals. On the highway, dam the Chally is awesome! I think the 6.1 is the wave of the future, but after bolting on a set of Eddy's ported and milled by RyanJ, get ready to beef up your tranny and rear end. The 6.1 doesn't hit its powerband until about 3 grand. The 408 comes in much sooner, even with a large roller cam. I say go with the 408 for now and let the aftermarket catch up on few more things for the 3rd gen.
 
jacksdodges said:
Iam running a 340 stroker with a 6pk and love it. runs great and the gas milage i can live with.
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I'm planning a 408 stroker. Are you using outboard carbs for a 340 or 440? I read that you should use the 440 carbs on a stroker since they were originally spec'd for an engine with a similar displacement, but I already have a set of the 340 carbs.
 
I would say that the 340 6 pak was over carbed..with the stroker the 340 carbs should do just fine.
 
It depends on cash flow and what you want out of it! I did the 5.7L swap in my cuda. If you wanted a stock 5.7L the price isn't too bad. Figure on a stock 345hp engine install. Here are the parts you would need for the install. 5.7L stock hemi $2000, TTI headers are around $720, Motor mounts $130, oil filter block off plate for an a body $67 and a remote mount oil filter kit $55. The 5.7L has the same bell housing aria as a SB so your trans will bolt right up but you will need to change the flex plate $90 (if you have the small 5/16 bolts on your converter you will need to buy the seperate spacer kit $30 because the new flex plates are made with 7/16 holes only) and if you have a weighted converter, the converter needs to be replaced for neutral ballance or cut the weight off. The cheapest way is a carbureted setup. MSD hemi 6 $500, MSD wiring harness $200, stock coil packs, your existing 4 bbl carb and a carbureted intake around $600. The stock radiator and shroud for the newer 1970 and up aluminum water pump can be used if you change the thermostat housing from stock to an SB one that has been milled flat. You need to use a truck timing chain cover with the stock truck fan clutch and an aftermarket smaller reverse rotation fan. It will be in and running but the you havn't even hooked up the accys or done any mods for more power. I changed mine over to be different and to do something that isn't done that much even though it is getting more popular but for the extra money that was spent building and installing the 5.7L you can build the 408 into a monster. It's a matter of preference. Take a look at my pics!! It does turn out cool lookin in the end. Joe:snakeman:
 
and no power steering!!! The manual box and the headers need to go in together (after massaging the steering box with a die grinder) without the tortion bars in. Thanks!!!
 
hemijoejr said:
It depends on cash flow and what you want out of it! I did the 5.7L swap in my cuda. If you wanted a stock 5.7L the price isn't too bad. Figure on a stock 345hp engine install. Here are the parts you would need for the install. 5.7L stock hemi $2000, TTI headers are around $720, Motor mounts $130, oil filter block off plate for an a body $67 and a remote mount oil filter kit $55. The 5.7L has the same bell housing aria as a SB so your trans will bolt right up but you will need to change the flex plate $90 (if you have the small 5/16 bolts on your converter you will need to buy the seperate spacer kit $30 because the new flex plates are made with 7/16 holes only) and if you have a weighted converter, the converter needs to be replaced for neutral ballance or cut the weight off. The cheapest way is a carbureted setup. MSD hemi 6 $500, MSD wiring harness $200, stock coil packs, your existing 4 bbl carb and a carbureted intake around $600. The stock radiator and shroud for the newer 1970 and up aluminum water pump can be used if you change the thermostat housing from stock to an SB one that has been milled flat. You need to use a truck timing chain cover with the stock truck fan clutch and an aftermarket smaller reverse rotation fan. It will be in and running but the you havn't even hooked up the accys or done any mods for more power. I changed mine over to be different and to do something that isn't done that much even though it is getting more popular but for the extra money that was spent building and installing the 5.7L you can build the 408 into a monster. It's a matter of preference. Take a look at my pics!! It does turn out cool lookin in the end. Joe:snakeman:
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AFTER MARKET SMALLER WATER PUMP ??
 
hemijoejr said:
and no power steering!!! The manual box and the headers need to go in together (after massaging the steering box with a die grinder) without the tortion bars in. Thanks!!!
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Is that a pic of your car racing in your avatar!?
If so,How fast did it go?
 
fstfish66 said:
AFTER MARKET SMALLER WATER PUMP ??
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The water pump is stock but the stock truck fan is too big to fit in the shroud. Permacool makes a smaller REVERSE ROTATION (I put it in all caps because it's important!!!) fan. It is available in many different sizes. I used the stock truck fan clutch with the smaller fan.
 
nemesis said:
Is that a pic of your car racing in your avatar!?
If so,How fast did it go?
Click to expand...
So far a best of 12.60 @110.8mph and an awfull 2.070 60' because my converter is way too tight. No N2O, 3600 lbs, and 345cid. I hope to have it in the high 11s next year after the torque converter change and some more tweaking.
 
hemijoejr said:
So far a best of 12.60 @110.8mph and an awfull 2.070 60' because my converter is way too tight. No N2O, 3600 lbs, and 345cid. I hope to have it in the high 11s next year after the torque converter change and some more tweaking.
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Man thats a horrible 60 ft,which is good news
so plenty of potential there!
Are you sure your car is that heavy?
I dont think it is,specially with the 5.7 hemi in it etc.
But i dunno,maybe you got a big audio system setup in it or something!
Get it to a weightbridge,you might be suprised;)

So its a standard the motor,aside from headers an exhaust
an tune?
 
nemesis said:
Man thats a horrible 60 ft,which is good news
so plenty of potential there!
Are you sure your car is that heavy?
I dont think it is,specially with the 5.7 hemi in it etc.
But i dunno,maybe you got a big audio system setup in it or something!
Get it to a weightbridge,you might be suprised;)

So its a standard the motor,aside from headers an exhaust
an tune?
Click to expand...

Well the lightest steel, street trim, small block abody I have seen is between 3300 and 3400 lbs and I'm a big boy bending the scales at 360lbs. So if you put us together that should be around 3600 t0 3700 give or take a love handle.:-D

There is practicly nothing stock about my engine. Stilll 345cid but it has a 6.1L steel crank, Eagle H beam rods, custom Ross pistons .020 over and 11-1 comp, A custom Comp cams .556 lift 230@.050 intake .560 lift 234@.050 exhaust camshaft ground on a 108 deg LSA. Cryo treated rockers, adjustable pushrods, custom made lash caps, behive springs and titanium retainers. CNC ported cylinder heads with oversize valves, Edelbrock dual quad intake with dual 500cfm carbs. I know I'm forgetting some small stuff but basicly it's a built street engine. In one of my previous posts, I just listed the stuff to get the 5.7L in the car.
 
i think i met and talked to you at the kick off party for carlisle , you said you had a small fortune in that 5.7,,, nice car and kool looking motor,,,
 
Nice car... you need to get intouch with Stu at Inertia Motorsports though.. he built my 5.7 based stroker and it goes in the 10's @ 122 MPH and a 1.52 60' with my 06 Charger (4400 lbs).. The secret is to have the 6.1 ported heads and Intake on the 5.7 block... CAm at Crank This Performance makes an adapter or you can have Stu make ur heads large chambered... The 09 5.7 intake is basicly the same as the 6.1 intake but its plastic and 1/3 the cost...Cams are obviously key to these 3rd gen hemis as well.... my little ole 222/226 is a baby compaired to alot of these guys that have similar engines but mine is .5 sec faster....
 
hemijoejr said:
Well the lightest steel, street trim, small block abody I have seen is between 3300 and 3400 lbs and I'm a big boy bending the scales at 360lbs. So if you put us together that should be around 3600 t0 3700 give or take a love handle.:-D

There is practicly nothing stock about my engine. Stilll 345cid but it has a 6.1L steel crank, Eagle H beam rods, custom Ross pistons .020 over and 11-1 comp, A custom Comp cams .556 lift 230@.050 intake .560 lift 234@.050 exhaust camshaft ground on a 108 deg LSA. Cryo treated rockers, adjustable pushrods, custom made lash caps, behive springs and titanium retainers. CNC ported cylinder heads with oversize valves, Edelbrock dual quad intake with dual 500cfm carbs. I know I'm forgetting some small stuff but basicly it's a built street engine. In one of my previous posts, I just listed the stuff to get the 5.7L in the car.
Click to expand...

So there plenty left in it!?

Any idea of how much power your making?

Nice car ;)
 
USCG CHARGER said:
Nice car... you need to get intouch with Stu at Inertia Motorsports though.. he built my 5.7 based stroker and it goes in the 10's @ 122 MPH and a 1.52 60' with my 06 Charger (4400 lbs).. The secret is to have the 6.1 ported heads and Intake on the 5.7 block... CAm at Crank This Performance makes an adapter or you can have Stu make ur heads large chambered... The 09 5.7 intake is basicly the same as the 6.1 intake but its plastic and 1/3 the cost...Cams are obviously key to these 3rd gen hemis as well.... my little ole 222/226 is a baby compaired to alot of these guys that have similar engines but mine is .5 sec faster....
Click to expand...

I wanted to run 6.1 heads but no one makes a dual quad intake for them yet and fuel injection dosn't work with what I was going for besides ported 6.1L heads are too large to run on a stock displacement 5.7L. The cam you have won't work for me either. I didn't want a semi smooth Idol. I wanted it to be choppy and pull to 7000rpm. I built just what I wanted, a non stroked 5.7L that dosn't sound like a 5.7L and will run just under a 11.49 so I won't have to put a roll bar in the car. Thanks8)
 
Ok.. one word of advise though.. If you are wanting to spin the car to 7K you need to look into getting a new valve train...The stock rockers will flex under that amount of rpm's ... if u are running stock 6.1 springs or pac springs will walk... The good news is that Arrington is coming out with new roller rockers that allow a duel behive style spring with custom retainers....
 
USCG CHARGER said:
Ok.. one word of advise though.. If you are wanting to spin the car to 7K you need to look into getting a new valve train...The stock rockers will flex under that amount of rpm's ... if u are running stock 6.1 springs or pac springs will walk... The good news is that Arrington is coming out with new roller rockers that allow a duel behive style spring with custom retainers....
Click to expand...

That's cool!! I am running single spring comp behives, titanium retainers and I already had my rockers cryo treated beacuse of that reason. The stock rockers are very dainty and thin in stock form, but I really wanted a set of roller rockers!! Jesel makes them at the tune of around $4200 and alot of machining and extra parts. I will have to give Eric Hruza or Mark BurkHardt a call. Thanks for the info!!!
 
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