63 no start with key

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hacksaw

hacksaw

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got a 63 dart 3 on the tree that won't start with the key .... new starter relay ... will start if ya jump the starter and run all day .... been under the dash with a lite and dvom and every thing seems to be in order .... what am i missing here ..... ??????????????????? :coffee2:
 
ignition switch... acc-run-start are all different connectors
when you turn the key all the way to start it bypasses the ballast resistor.
during run it goes through the ballast resistor.

so when you are turning the key to run it's ok, but at start nothing. tells me the switch is probably bad.

when the ballast resistor goes, it's the opposite problem. will start then when you let the key go (for run) it cuts out.
 
moparlover said:
ignition switch... acc-run-start are all different connectors
when you turn the key all the way to start it bypasses the ballast resistor.
during run it goes through the ballast resistor.

so when you are turning the key to run it's ok, but at start nothing. tells me the switch is probably bad.

when the ballast resistor goes, it's the opposite problem. will start then when you let the key go (for run) it cuts out.
Click to expand...

got power from switch in crank mode ... just won't crank over with key ... i don't see a safety switch on the clutch .....
 
hacksaw said:
got power from switch in crank mode ... just won't crank over with key ... i don't see a safety switch on the clutch .....
Click to expand...
This early mopar don't have a safty swirch... starter relay has
went south or a bad connection to our from it, or the key switch is bad or again a bad connection. .
 
This has to be a simple problem. These early cars don't have a clutch switch, that started "clear up" in 70.

The starter signal comes from the switch, through the switch connector and through the BULKHEAD to the relay. The relay MUST be grounded


1..........Remove the 'push on' wire at the relay, make absolutely sure the gearbox is in neutral. Take a screwdriver and jumper the big battery stud on the relay to your push on terminal. If it does not crank, either the relay is not grounded, or the relay is bad

2.........Hook a test light / meter to the wire under the hood which connects to that push on terminal. Twist the key. Power? No? Yet you have power at the switch? Then it HAS to be either bad bulhead connector or loose right at the switch. "DON'T" get fooled. Check this hooked to the relay so that you cause a LOAD on the connection.

3.........Have you replaced the relay? How many "push on" terminals? Two? Then you have an "automatic" relay. GROUND the remaining "push on" terminal
 
memike said:
This early mopar don't have a safty swirch... starter relay has
went south or a bad connection to our from it, or the key switch is bad or again a bad connection. .
Click to expand...

found it ... bad ign switch .... the yellow wire from the switch to the relay is a ground ...... witch is hot when key on engine off ..... turn key to crank and it grounds this wire to kick in the relay .... tnx for the input .... ... its been a spell sence i have worked on sumtin this simple :eek:ops:
 
hacksaw said:
found it ... bad ign switch .... the yellow wire from the switch to the relay is a ground ...... witch is hot when key on engine off ..... turn key to crank and it grounds this wire to kick in the relay .... tnx for the input .... ... its been a spell sence i have worked on sumtin this simple :eek:ops:
Click to expand...

Uh.............no...........that is not how it works. The yellow is HOT in crank from the switch.

I xplained to you how this works.

Simplified diagrams from MyMopar

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1963/63DartA.jpg

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1963/63DartB.jpg

Yellow coming OUT of the key is POWER in "crank" which goes through the bulkhead connector "S" at top left of the bottom diagram. This FEEDS TO one of the two relay terminals, through the coil, and then down to the NEUTRAL safety switch on an automatic. If a stick this terminal is NOT present unless the relay has been replaced, in which that second terminal must be grounded
 

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67Dart273 said:
Uh.............no...........that is not how it works. The yellow is HOT in crank from the switch.

I xplained to you how this works.
Click to expand...

then sumtin is realy wrong here .... it is hot in the run position ..... but goz dark in the crank spot ..... if i ground the yellow wire at the switch plug it will crank. I switched the yellow wire and the heavy brown wire on the relay to see if i got them crossed but then it didn't do anything at all. ether way im thinking the switch is the problum .... guess il find out tomarow when the new one gets here ....... tnx
 
hacksaw said:
then sumtin is realy wrong here .... it is hot in the run position ..... but goz dark in the crank spot ..... if i ground the yellow wire at the switch plug it will crank. I switched the yellow wire and the heavy brown wire on the relay to see if i got them crossed but then it didn't do anything at all. ether way im thinking the switch is the problum .... guess il find out tomarow when the new one gets here ....... tnx
Click to expand...

You may have something mucked up that is throwing you. EG the relay might be burned up / fiddled with internally

So let's be clear...........

Is there only one "push on" connector on the relay? If not the second one needs to be grounded

The RELAY must be grounded. MUST.

I would ............

Disconnect the "push on" wire from the relay, and establish two things

1..........Whether the relay works. To do that, take a screwdriver (make sure it's in neutral) and jumper from the big stud to the push on terminal. It should crank. If not,

Jumper across the big stud and the big "square" looking terminal. It should crank. If it cranks this way, but not just above, then the relay is bad or not grounded. Suspect rust, LOL

2..........Now see if the yellow is doing it's job. For this a "load" is handy, something like a junk tail socket. These are handy for all kinds of testing 'n stuff, because you can wire it several ways. "Clip" a heavy 12V test lamp from the yellow wire (disconnected) out in the engine bay, and ground the lamp. Twist the key. Does the lamp light?

If not, it's GOT to be in that wire, in the bulkhead connector, in the ignition switch connector, or right in the switch itself.
 
67Dart273 said:
You may have something mucked up that is throwing you. EG the relay might be burned up / fiddled with internally

So let's be clear...........

Is there only one "push on" connector on the relay? If not the second one needs to be grounded

The RELAY must be grounded. MUST.

I would ............

Disconnect the "push on" wire from the relay, and establish two things

1..........Whether the relay works. To do that, take a screwdriver (make sure it's in neutral) and jumper from the big stud to the push on terminal. It should crank. If not,

Jumper across the big stud and the big "square" looking terminal. It should crank. If it cranks this way, but not just above, then the relay is bad or not grounded. Suspect rust, LOL

2..........Now see if the yellow is doing it's job. For this a "load" is handy, something like a junk tail socket. These are handy for all kinds of testing 'n stuff, because you can wire it several ways. "Clip" a heavy 12V test lamp from the yellow wire (disconnected) out in the engine bay, and ground the lamp. Twist the key. Does the lamp light?

If not, it's GOT to be in that wire, in the bulkhead connector, in the ignition switch connector, or right in the switch itself.
Click to expand...

relay has 2 plugs and is new .... bulkhead is ok as i can start it from inside the car at the switch .... everything is in order .... new switch will be here in the morning. Il let you know if it flyz .......
 
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