63 Valiant disc brake swap kits?

[B-i-n-g-o]

Sorry, I started by searching the threads, but some refer to OOB dealers, and others, I still have questions! Looking at disc conversions (disc, manual dual MC, new lines throughout) for Mabel, 63 Valiant.

I saw SSBC mentioned on a 63 Dart, 14" wheels should clear (Jim K)...will that fit a 63 Valiant? Their site doesn't show it. If they would fit, do you know if they something off the shelf and identified, when it's time to maintain/replace pads, rotors, etc?

DrDiff looked to be larger (Belvedere, Fury), so nope.

Classic Industries also not showing 63 Plymouth.

And I'm not trusting my abilities or the parts I'd find, hunting down early 70s that should work.

If I'm just not looking hard enough, let me know, and thanks!

Steve

 

[Darter6]

The SSBC kit installed on a 64 Dart. Comes in both big and small pattern. They have 2 types one pictured and one that uses 67 Mustang calipers. I believe that is for 14'' wheels. The Force 10 may not clear 14'' wheels. I went 15'' big bolt pattern.

 

[4mulas]

Doctor Diff DOES sell everything you need and will utilized oem style mopar parts. So if you ever need a part and are in an obscure location you’ll be able to find what you need.
send him an EMAIL with the details of your car and what you’d like to do and he WILL get back to you ina relatively short period of time. Ie: pretty quick

 

[cudamark]

Any A-body disc brake kit should fit your '63 Valiant. I assume you have the stock 9" drum brakes with 13 X 4" wheels, so, you'll have to decide which kit to get and what wheels you want to use, as the 13's won't work. I also don't like the 9" brake spindles as those have tiny wheel bearings that just don't hold up all that well, therefor I'd recommend a spindle upgrade too.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Wheels already bumped to 14" Cragars, and I'm trying to keep 14". Relatively stock/mild 170, just comfy, reliable, safe tooling around. If I do spindle upgrade, I can keep SBP, right?

Not planning to get much deeper (like, getting new springs and shocks, yes, but keeping 7 1/4 rear), but let me know anything else it'd be a good idea to upgrade, while I'm tearing into it!

Thanks,
Steve

 

[cudamark]

Yes, you can keep the SBP if you upgrade the spindle to the '65-72 10" brake spindle or the Kelsey Hayes disc brake spindle. Some kits include a spindle and some require a particular one. It will depend on which kit you choose. Look at each one and see what is required and what parts are used. I prefer stock factory stuff myself so parts are off the shelf. Kits that use proprietary parts might be a problem down the road when it comes to getting replacement parts. Uncommon parts might not be available just anywhere, and if it's a one-off part and the company goes belly up, you may end up doing another conversion.

 

[S'cuder]

Uncommon parts might not be available just anywhere, and if it's a one-off part and the company goes belly up, you may end up doing another conversion.

Like my buddy did the first time SSBC went out of business.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Thanks, everyone! Dr. Diff does have it, just wasn't as obvious (to me at least) as the other kits. As suggested, I emailed them, and Cass got back to me quick!

About to research MC bore, as he let me know I can go either size.

Heck, yeah!!!

 

[4mulas]

Thanks, everyone! Dr. Diff does have it, just wasn't as obvious (to me at least) as the other kits. As suggested, I emailed them, and Cass got back to me quick!

About to research MC bore, as he let me know I can go either size.

Heck, yeah!!!

If you’re talking manual brakes I’ve had both and I think I like the higher firmer feel of the larger bore. Especially for a small light car that is on the tamer side. The extra clamping force of the smaller bore was ok in my B Body, but the pedal was a tad lower and kinda softer I guess. It was negligible between the two I suppose. You can‘t go wrong with either. Just order!

 

[72bluNblu]

Thanks, everyone! Dr. Diff does have it, just wasn't as obvious (to me at least) as the other kits. As suggested, I emailed them, and Cass got back to me quick!

About to research MC bore, as he let me know I can go either size.

Heck, yeah!!!

I use the 15/16" MC bore on my cars, both my Duster and my Challenger. It will have a slightly longer pedal travel than the 1-1/32" stock manual mc bore, but it will be a slightly lighter pedal effort and it gives a higher line pressure (more clamp force at the rotor). The slightly longer travel allows for better brake control and modulation IMO. If you just want to stomp on your high/hard pedal and lock the brakes, the 1-1/32" will do that.

But really, 15/16" vs 1-1/32" for the MC for manual brakes is pretty much a preference thing. There are performance differences as I pointed out, but the way most people use these cars the performance differences will be secondary to driver preference on the feel of the pedal.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Alright, about to pull the trigger! DrDiff, maintaining SBP and 14" wheels. Getting conversion, front end rebuild, and all the lines. He didn't have rear brake rebuild for small rear end, so, I'll have to run that down.

Yell if keeping SBP, 14", and small rear is a big mistake for reliability or parts availability.

I'll try to remember to take pictures and post as I'm doing it.

Thanks again for all the advice, I really appreciate it!
Steve

 

[4mulas]

Alright, about to pull the trigger! DrDiff, maintaining SBP and 14" wheels. Getting conversion, front end rebuild, and all the lines. He didn't have rear brake rebuild for small rear end, so, I'll have to run that down.

Yell if keeping SBP, 14", and small rear is a big mistake for reliability or parts availability.

I'll try to remember to take pictures and post as I'm doing it.

Thanks again for all the advice, I really appreciate it!
Steve

If by small rear you mean 7.25” diff? That’s fine for a 6 cylinder car, and low horsepower v-8’s. Bearings and seals are easy to find and arguably so are brake parts Being 9” drums…

 

[cudamark]

If you have to buy new wheels, I think I'd go with some 15" ones for better tire choices. I'd also keep an eye out for an 8 3/4 and pick one up when a good deal comes along. Even a slant 6 will break a 7 1/4 sooner or later.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Thanks! Keeping SBP, and right now, keeping 14". I'll keep an eye out for 8 3/4...was contemplating doing that, while on all this, but going to give the budget a break. When I get the 8 3/4, DrDiff had a disk conversion for it, and I'll bump the wheels then, if needed!

 

[S'cuder]

Yell if keeping SBP, 14", and small rear is a big mistake for reliability or parts availability.

For your intended use you should be in good shape. A couple points to consider:

Get your front/rear braking bias dialed to avoid spinning out in a hard stop. Chrysler brakes of this era were notoriously biased in excess to the rear. You'll want to address that either with an adjustable proportioning valve, which maybe Cass already explained: Adjustable Proportioning Valve

Or use smaller bore wheel cylinders. See @slantsixdan address this here:
8.25" rear worth buying? - Page 2 - Slant Six Forum

If I were you, and if I were planning to keep this car, I'd buy everything needed for a complete rear brake overhaul and put the parts on the shelf. Drums and rotors for some A-Bodies have disappeared from normal parts channels. I just received email from Rock Auto saying brake rotors about which I had requested to be alerted when available are discontinued with no plans for them to be available in the future. Buy now while decent parts are available and reasonably cheap. It's been almost 50 years since Mopar 9" drum brakes have been used on a new car. For USA sale, anyway.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Man, stoked! Ordered, but waiting on freight quote...default was enough to buy more parts! Checking back brakes while I'm there...local O'Reilly's had wheel cylinders, and can get shoes and drums next day. So, ordering a set! I think what's on it still looks good, but I'm waffling, thinking I should 'go through all the brakes'...would you replace these drums and shoes? I haven't driven it, so no idea on how they act. Springs, etc. look great, though, so whoo!

Thanks, all!

 

[4mulas]

Take the drums to a shop and or do this yourself. Measure them. There will be a minimum thickness written in the outside of the drum. If it’s a 10” the minimum do not turn past dimension will be 10.060. If yours are 9” it will be 9.060

 

[cudamark]

How long has it been since the brakes were used? I'd pry back the dust boots on the wheel cylinders to see if there are any leaks starting. How close are the rivets to the edge of the friction material? I'd also pull the parts off, check all the hardware closely, lube the self adjuster parts, and replace anything that is pitted/rusty. Measure the drum diameter and if it's within specs, I'd reuse it as is. After you get it on the road, if you find a pulsation in the rear (pull the hand brake on slightly while driving to test), you can always pull the drums back off and machine them round again or replace them.

 

[cudamark]

Take the drums to a shop and or do this yourself. Measure them. There will be a minimum thickness written in the outside of the drum. If it’s a 10” the minimum do not turn past dimension will be 10.060. If yours are 9” it will be 9.060

Not always. The original '63 drums aren't marked. Aftermarket drums usually are, and can have a minimum diameter of either 9.060" or 9.090" depending on manufacturer.

 

[4mulas]

Not always. The original '63 drums aren't marked. Aftermarket drums usually are, and can have a minimum diameter of either 9.060" or 9.090" depending on manufacturer.

Ok, they are not always marked. But the do not turn past number is almost always 60 thou .060 beyond the nominal size. The .090 over you speak of is ALSO correct as in the do not use past size. They can be run up to 90 thou beyond the nominal size from wear, just not turned past .060.

I just didn’t want to cloud the issue or subject with that detail as he just wants to know if they are any good for turning I think.

 

[cudamark]

The minimum drum diameter specs are what you can machine it to. Wear can go beyond that under normal use. Once it's machined or worn beyond the minimum, it's replacement time. If the drum isn't marked, .060 is the limit. If it is marked, use that spec.

 

[4mulas]

The minimum drum diameter specs are what you can machine it to. Wear can go beyond that under normal use. Once it's machined or worn beyond the minimum, it's replacement time. If the drum isn't marked, .060 is the limit. If it is marked, use that spec.

That’s not it.

It’s exactly what I said. First number is do not machine past. 30 thou beyond that size is acceptable for use. Ie: you could turn a drum to 10.059 and use it. Through the course of use it will wear further. It can wear to 90 thou past. Then discard. Do not use it past 10.090.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Yeah, the lack of being used in so long was more the concern (hence the pictures), and having the numbers for wear/turning tolerance I needed, if the consensus wasn't 'looks too ragged' and I see what you're saying on using and turning if they act like that needs done (I know you can't tell .060-.090 from pictures), so much appreciated! I'll measure it up, see how it looks...thanks, all!

 

[cudamark]

I can almost guarantee that if you take a drum to a machine shop, they would have no problem turning it to the max spec on the drum.....at least I haven't in the 50 years I've been doing it.

 

[B-i-n-g-o]

Driver's side not as promising...stud missing, stud broken, other studs replaced because they're RL, missing a retaining spring, adjuster backwards (DSM says star to front driver's side, which makes sense it'd be opposite passenger side), and very grungy.