75 Dart front clip to 69 Cuda

[RSie]

I have a 69 Cuda notch with rotted drivers side frame rail, torsion bar cross member, and inner fenders. I'm looking at buying a 75 Dart 4dr custom.. can anyone tell me if I can take the whole front clip (torsion bar crossmember, frame rails, inner fenders, radiator support) and swap it into the Cuda as a unit? I know the front bumper mounts will be an issue.. just wondering if everything else would work.
Thanks!

 

[Alaskan_TA]

If the 4-door is solid, why not save it?

 

[Mopar Tim]

Because he wants to save the 'Cuda.

 

[kursplat]

if the T bars are the same, and they are, then all the important hard points should be also

 

[Alaskan_TA]

If the second car is solid, save it too.

That was my point.

No one is making any of these cars anymore & there are parts available without chopping a solid car.

So I asked.

 

[Hellrats]

I'm sure it can be done. It's only a bunch of steel and if you get the torsion bars correct everything else will fall into place. But I hope it's cheap because it's going to be one bastard of a car no one else would want. Good luck getting it insured for what you'll have in it.

 

[72bluNblu]

I'm sure it can be done. It's only a bunch of steel and if you get the torsion bars correct everything else will fall into place. But I hope it's cheap because it's going to be one bastard of a car no one else would want. Good luck getting it insured for what you'll have in it.

Uh, why would it be a bastard of a car? If you swap the frame rails, cross members, inner fenders and radiator support, and kept the original ‘69 barracuda bodywork, it would look just like a ‘69 barracuda.

All of the frame rails, crossmembers etc are the same. Heck, even swapping out all of that stuff you would only lose one original partial vin stamping. Done properly it wouldn’t be a bastard of a car at all.

And for the OP, if you can do all that welding, changing the bumper mounting locations on the frame rails should be a piece of cake!

 

[RSie]

I get your point, Alaskan. If I had unlimited funds and time, I would save them both. But, a 75 Dart 4 dr. 6 cyl auto car isn't near as worth saving as a 69 Cuda notch is, and I have to make a choice. Hellrats, I spent 2K on the Cuda about 10 years ago, just started working on it.. life has a way if stealing cash and time away from a guy (supporting a kid through hockey the last 10 years, he's only got a couple years left, lol), I'm looking at spending less than 1K on the Dart. So, I'm up to 3 grand so far, and I know I'll spend a lot more, but this route of fixing the Cuda is far cheaper than buying new parts.. and I'll have a 225, trans, and rear laying around for something later (or to sell to offset what I need). I just need to know from you guys if it's worth buying the Dart... if the clip won't work there's no point in buying the car.

 

[1969383S]

The metal is very much the same. There are differences such as the mounting of pre-drilled locations for brakes etc. You are not replacing anything but common steel. As long as you keep the radiator support and stamped numbers for your VIN why not. My inner fenders are the reproduced type only because filling all the holes from years of racing and ingnition systems cost more than installing new. A 69 has a few different hole (mount) locations than a 74. If you want the later big BBJ upper A’s and brakes then it makes sense. If you want something closer to originality then find a 69 donor.

 

[RSie]

72bluNblu: No, I'm not a welding/fabricating guy. I do however, have a next door neighbor that is... he's been a welder/fabricator for 30 years, and retired now. He has all the welders, tools, etc... and he's more than willing to help me. I don't think it hurt that I told him if he does he can take the car for a weekend when it's done

 

[RSie]

Thanks 1969383S! I'm not making a show car.. I'll drive this thing every day in the summer. Can you elaborate on the 'big BBJ upper A's'?

 

[1969383S]

Thanks 1969383S! I'm not making a show car.. I'll drive this thing every day in the summer. Can you elaborate on the 'big BBJ upper A's'?

Pre 71 were small ball joint upper A’s and used a different distribution block for the brakes and spindles. Later models if equipped with disc used a combo block that mounts a bit different. I am not up on 74 and even if they came with drums on the front, so there may be other mount locations for emission stuff and such I do not pay attention to. My concern is 69. The post 71 cars were at best that I know all larger upper ball joints.

 

[1969383S]

The post 71 cars with disc front have different mount holes for the combo valve used in those years. In other words the later combo block does not mount in the factory location on a 69.

I could be totally wrong. Maybe if you have the later model brake lines it will all work out.

 

[RSie]

The post 71 cars with disc front have different mount holes for the combo valve used in those years. In other words the later combo block does not mount in the factory location on a 69.

I could be totally wrong. Maybe if you have the later model brake lines it will all work out.

Thank you!

 

[RSie]

So, I think I'll get the Dart if the rails/crossmember is in good shape. I might pound it around for a while with the 6 in in for a few weeks, then pull the reworked lopey 318/727/8/3/4 rear out of the Cuda and pound it around for this fall and next spring as I need to pull those out of the Cuda anyway. So, the Dart will have a last lap.. might let the resident 16 yr. old have time at the wheel on both, depending on how much time I can get him to spend working on it, and give up the PS4 for a while

 

[72bluNblu]

Pre 71 were small ball joint upper A’s and used a different distribution block for the brakes and spindles. Later models if equipped with disc used a combo block that mounts a bit different. I am not up on 74 and even if they came with drums on the front, so there may be other mount locations for emission stuff and such I do not pay attention to. My concern is 69. The post 71 cars were at best that I know all larger upper ball joints.

Large ball joint upper control arms did not start until 1973. Starting in ‘73 both the disk and drum front cars had large ball joint UCA’s. 73+ disks were single piston, slider type caliper for A-bodies, and they also had the large 5x4.5” bolt pattern. The ‘73+ drum cars, although they had large ball joints, were still 5x4”.

‘72 and earlier cars were all small upper ball joint, the disks were 4 piston Kelsey Hayes.

 

[gdrill]

It is actually much easier than one would think. Clean up and prep are the main effort. Re-assembly is a piece of cake. Now having said that, mine is a 67 into a 69. Your 75 will have different bumper mounts etc, but nothing that cant be overcome by determination and wit.

 

[1969383S]

Large ball joint upper control arms did not start until 1973. Starting in ‘73 both the disk and drum front cars had large ball joint UCA’s. 73+ disks were single piston, slider type caliper for A-bodies, and they also had the large 5x4.5” bolt pattern. The ‘73+ drum cars, although they had large ball joints, were still 5x4”.

‘72 and earlier cars were all small upper ball joint, the disks were 4 piston Kelsey Hayes.

Sorry I am off a year! I said I am 69. I hope you are happy!

 

[72bluNblu]

Sorry I am off a year! I said I am 69. I hope you are happy!

Happy? Why would I be happy? I didn’t correct you as some personal attack.

You posted incorrect information, I corrected it. Being off by two years makes a difference, you gave the guy bad info. I hit “disagree” so other members would know the info might not be good and posted the correct information so someone doesn’t get the wrong parts. No need to take it personal, you said yourself you might be wrong.

 

[Hellrats]

Oh I see. I thought you were going to used the Dart fenders, hood and such on the Cuda. That would have made for one funky looking car! LOL Now it makes sense

 

[gliderider06]

All of that metal is reproduced now. Safetcap makes the frame rails that go over the existing. For me, I will notdo a swap like that again. Too much work to use old metal cutting it from one car to another. I understand its more costly, but it might be easier in the long run.

 

[RSie]

Thanks for the info guys! I hadn't thought of ball joints, brakes or wheel bolt pattern. gdrill has exactly what I'm thinking of doing.. thanks for posting the photos! Hellrats, once I get that far, maybe I'll bolt up the Dart fenders, hood, etc. and post a pic on here Glider, I think the rail is too far gone to trust a cap over it.

 

[72bluNblu]

All of that metal is reproduced now. Safetcap makes the frame rails that go over the existing. For me, I will notdo a swap like that again. Too much work to use old metal cutting it from one car to another. I understand its more costly, but it might be easier in the long run.

The frame rails are not reproduced, and the caps that go over the rails are a band aid fix that just covers up and traps the rust inside the caps. The original rails will keep rusting, and the caps will be sandwiched up agains the rusty rails, so they're rust out faster than the rails did in the first place.

Replacing the rails is the way to do it if they're that bad. And doing it all as a unit like gdrill did is the way to go if all of that stuff needs to be replaced.

It is actually much easier than one would think. Clean up and prep are the main effort. Re-assembly is a piece of cake. Now having said that, mine is a 67 into a 69. Your 75 will have different bumper mounts etc, but nothing that cant be overcome by determination and wit.

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Very nice work!

I dunno if I'd call it a "piece of cake", but it is easier than a lot of people think. Just lots of measuring, re-measuring, and spot welds. Lots and lots of spot welds.

 

[gliderider06]

The frame rails are not reproduced, and the caps that go over the rails are a band aid fix that just covers up and traps the rust inside the caps. The original rails will keep rusting, and the caps will be sandwiched up agains the rusty rails, so they're rust out faster than the rails did in the first place

I thought AMD was reproducing the rails. Sorry, just B and E bodies.

 

[RSie]

The Dart was a bust, frame rails were rotted out far worse than on my Cuda. Body looked good for a Wis. car, inner fenders looked good.. crawled underneath and a good foot of the drivers side rail was gone. Back to searching.