TrailBeast
AKA Mopars4us on Youtube
All makes sense to me, and I was thinking about that 1/8 flow restriction as well.
Steel would disperse the heat better.
a727 lines
- Thread starter grassy
- Start date
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All makes sense to me, and I was thinking about that 1/8 flow restriction as well.
Steel would disperse the heat better.
grassy
Well-Known Member
grassy
Well-Known Member
Bakerlite mentions that the pressure we are dealing with is only in the 20 to 40 pound range...which is a lot less that some of the hydraulic hoses I know of.
Canada line only goes to '74 Duster.. I have run into this before where they will not quote on a '75.
I must say I am a bit cynical of "custom made" for the car. I have installed a bunch of stuff that was custom made for my car that required a lot of tweaking or fabrication to make it fit. My luck, the lines would be too short.
I read somewhere that with the a727 with o/d, the fittings were 1/4 vs 1/8.
I am not sure of the cooling properties of a steel line running through a hot environment vs a rubber hose..
Of to the farm equipment store tomorrow morning.
Good discussion, btw.
ian.
Canada line only goes to '74 Duster.. I have run into this before where they will not quote on a '75.
I must say I am a bit cynical of "custom made" for the car. I have installed a bunch of stuff that was custom made for my car that required a lot of tweaking or fabrication to make it fit. My luck, the lines would be too short.
I read somewhere that with the a727 with o/d, the fittings were 1/4 vs 1/8.
I am not sure of the cooling properties of a steel line running through a hot environment vs a rubber hose..
Of to the farm equipment store tomorrow morning.
Good discussion, btw.
ian.
I assumed it was slipped over the hose before crimping the ends on. I didn't see the guy make them.
One was 7' long and the other was 5'. I think I could have got buy with the 7' one made to 6'.
grassy
Well-Known Member
Thanks Stan... This is a good question to ask the farm guys.. with the engine bay and trans crowed with hot tubes, this issue has been on my mind.
ian.
I got them long enough so I could run them over by the frame rail rather then along side the engine.
grassy
Well-Known Member
OK...went to the farm machinery place...wow, do they have all sorts of fittings...now I know where to go rather than the auto parts store..
Anyway, the reason buddy in my link used this heavy duty hose is because all farm places stock it... and it is only 3 bucks a foot here so maybe $ .75 American. You buy your ends and they will put them on for you for free. These lines are pretty tough. I bought a length of cable to try to get a feel of how I can bend or thread it through the car.
I crawled under the car today and I don't think straight forward is a go...I forgot about the steering mechanism ...and few places to hang holders from.. I am not sure about heading directly to the rail and turning either...where it did work was along the trans..up the firewall ...stay on the above side of the front shock (well away from the headers) then down under the rad hose and hook up.
I am not 100% sold on this so if others have done different, please chime in. Pls remember that i have a set of tti headers and an x pipe exhaust. the gizmos that I secured the gas line to the car works well for this tube as well.
Stan, is there a dealer for your stuff in Canada ?
Grassy
Anyway, the reason buddy in my link used this heavy duty hose is because all farm places stock it... and it is only 3 bucks a foot here so maybe $ .75 American. You buy your ends and they will put them on for you for free. These lines are pretty tough. I bought a length of cable to try to get a feel of how I can bend or thread it through the car.
I crawled under the car today and I don't think straight forward is a go...I forgot about the steering mechanism ...and few places to hang holders from.. I am not sure about heading directly to the rail and turning either...where it did work was along the trans..up the firewall ...stay on the above side of the front shock (well away from the headers) then down under the rad hose and hook up.
I am not 100% sold on this so if others have done different, please chime in. Pls remember that i have a set of tti headers and an x pipe exhaust. the gizmos that I secured the gas line to the car works well for this tube as well.
Stan, is there a dealer for your stuff in Canada ?
Grassy
Try a tractor supply store, lf there are any around you. I got mine at a locally owned industrial supply shop.
grassy
Well-Known Member
..that is where I was today...
grassy
Well-Known Member
Arrrrgggg. Couldn't find a neat way to get to the rad with the rubber hoses ..and they used too much real estate on the side of the trans so I bought some steel tubing...fark of a thing to bend..after awhile, I took some copper and made a template..
I am coming out of the trans..up the driver side firewall.... over to the shock mount and then under the battery box...would prefer to run it under the engine but cannot find a spot that will not rub..darn headers..
I am coming out of the trans..up the driver side firewall.... over to the shock mount and then under the battery box...would prefer to run it under the engine but cannot find a spot that will not rub..darn headers..
fishy68
Tyr Fryr's Inc.
Get a good tubing bender. Like this one
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BLUE-POINT-..._Automotive_Tools&hash=item4d12c44675&vxp=mtr
It'll make bending hard lines a breeze. I have one very similar to it and love it
grassy
Well-Known Member
I have one similar.
After the trans lines run along the side of the trans, what route do they go t get to the rad ?
Thanks
ian.
After the trans lines run along the side of the trans, what route do they go t get to the rad ?
Thanks
ian.
fishy68
Tyr Fryr's Inc.
The factory lines run straight forward along side the oil pan. With most headers it's close in there.
I pulled what was left of my twisted trans lines out today and decided that after 46 years, they were bent and twisted beyond salvage and they needed to be replaced. On a spur of the moment, I bought these from Van's Auto. They seem to be alright and the price was right at $45 shipped. I think I can make them work.
Anyone have any experience with these lines? I guess it's too late, they're on their way.
Anyone have any experience with these lines? I guess it's too late, they're on their way.
grassy
Well-Known Member
I solved my problem...I started out with copper tubes because they bend easily...then made a set of steel lines to fit in. I first played around with a reinforced hydraulic hose but the hose was just too bulky. Not perfect, but it looks neat and tidy. Headers certainly make your life a bit more interesting.
I used these guys , lines fit perfectly , I bought the SS lines
http://www.inlinetube.com/
http://www.inlinetube.com/
grassy
Well-Known Member
I don't think they would have fit with the headers...
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
Canada line and tube {Marcel} is the Canadian partner of Inline Tube , I just redid one of mine after a rub through problem this summer and if you can get the car a couple of feet off the ground then pre -bent lines can be wiggled , spun and fed between tti`s and the oil pan it just takes patience and a knack for 3d thinking , I run em past and out the front some then back to the trans over the header collector which will only make sense to someone under their car looking at them right now , as for years of availability and metals , Marcel is a great guy who can and will get you exactly what you need even if you don`t see it in the catalog , the Ontario guys have probably seen him at Moparfest as he is the guy who challenged me to go to Moparfest in the first place and travels with the inline tube guys in August while they do the show circuit .
Works on my setup, have the headman tightube headers , they run right along the oil pan .
And Grassy , does Marcel have a site ? I ordered from Inline , but saw no mention of Canadian distributor . Might be getting some brake lines , want the braided steel lines between the frame and caliper
Thanks
longarm
Car sold back to original owners
There's some info on AN fitting at this thread.
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=153095
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=153095
Dash sizes, or -AN sizes, are commonly believed to have originated in the military applications. On aircraft, ships,Tanks, etc., in order to create durable and reliable hydraulic, fuel and coolant plumbing. The tough, braided/reinforced hose, coupled with thread-on connections, led early racers to buy military surplus hose,hose ends and fittings in the years following WWII and the Korean war. The racing community quickly latched onto this style of plumbing, resulting in common use in today's Performance and racing markets. The term -AN (a common abbreviation for army/Navy specification) sticks with us to this day. That's why the hose/hose end assemblies we see today are referred to as -AN assemblies.
So we refer to the hoses, hose ends and fittings sizes with the term AN, or by the term -AN. It all means the same thing. For example, "I'm plumbing my fuel system wit dash 6 hose); or "I used dash 8 AN hose for my carburetor feed." When in written form, the dash symbol (-) or the word dash might be used.
-AN(ARMY/NAVY) hose sizing is based on single and double digit identification numbers, Common sizes for performance automotive applications include -3, -4, -6, -8, -10, -12, -16 and -20The larger the number, the larger the hose diameter).
-3 and -4 sizes are typically used for brake line applications, small oil lines, some fuel line applications, pressure gauges and vacuum lines.
-6 size is typically used for fuel and oil plumbing.
-8 size is typically used for fuel, coolant and oil plumbing.
-10 size is typically used for oil , fuel or heater hose plumbing
-12 size is typically used for coolant, large fuel delivery or dry-sump oil.
-16 size is typically used for coolant, dry-sump oil or large fuel delivery
-20 is typically used for coolant (radiator hose).
What do these AN dash numbers really represent? Actually, there is a logical reason for these numbers, which otherwise might seem like made up codes. The dash number refers to the hose inside diameter, in increments of 1/16 of an inch. For example, a -10 size translates to 10/16" (5/8") inside diameter. This is an easy way to understand dash sizes. Just think of terms 1/16" increments. A -6 means that the inside diameter is 6/16" (or 3/8"). A -8 is 8/16" (or 1/2") inside diameter. Just remember that the format is 1/16".
Not to make things confusing, but those 1/16" increments are "nominal' numbers that indicate the O.D. of the hose end's internal metal tube (this tube slips into the hose). In reality , most AN hose makers actually make their hoses a bit on the tight-tolerance side, to the tune of about 1/32"smaller than the theoretical nominal diameter size, which aids in hose sealing onto the hose ends tube. So a -6 hose, which theoretically should have a inside diameter of 6/16" (3/8"or 12/32'), more than likely features an inside diameter of 11/32". Nevertheless using the 1/16" theory as your guide will help you to easily visualize what the inside diameter will be.
Yes I have a 100 page book on AN hoses. You didn't think I knew this by memory did you.
So we refer to the hoses, hose ends and fittings sizes with the term AN, or by the term -AN. It all means the same thing. For example, "I'm plumbing my fuel system wit dash 6 hose); or "I used dash 8 AN hose for my carburetor feed." When in written form, the dash symbol (-) or the word dash might be used.
-AN(ARMY/NAVY) hose sizing is based on single and double digit identification numbers, Common sizes for performance automotive applications include -3, -4, -6, -8, -10, -12, -16 and -20The larger the number, the larger the hose diameter).
-3 and -4 sizes are typically used for brake line applications, small oil lines, some fuel line applications, pressure gauges and vacuum lines.
-6 size is typically used for fuel and oil plumbing.
-8 size is typically used for fuel, coolant and oil plumbing.
-10 size is typically used for oil , fuel or heater hose plumbing
-12 size is typically used for coolant, large fuel delivery or dry-sump oil.
-16 size is typically used for coolant, dry-sump oil or large fuel delivery
-20 is typically used for coolant (radiator hose).
What do these AN dash numbers really represent? Actually, there is a logical reason for these numbers, which otherwise might seem like made up codes. The dash number refers to the hose inside diameter, in increments of 1/16 of an inch. For example, a -10 size translates to 10/16" (5/8") inside diameter. This is an easy way to understand dash sizes. Just think of terms 1/16" increments. A -6 means that the inside diameter is 6/16" (or 3/8"). A -8 is 8/16" (or 1/2") inside diameter. Just remember that the format is 1/16".
Not to make things confusing, but those 1/16" increments are "nominal' numbers that indicate the O.D. of the hose end's internal metal tube (this tube slips into the hose). In reality , most AN hose makers actually make their hoses a bit on the tight-tolerance side, to the tune of about 1/32"smaller than the theoretical nominal diameter size, which aids in hose sealing onto the hose ends tube. So a -6 hose, which theoretically should have a inside diameter of 6/16" (3/8"or 12/32'), more than likely features an inside diameter of 11/32". Nevertheless using the 1/16" theory as your guide will help you to easily visualize what the inside diameter will be.
Yes I have a 100 page book on AN hoses. You didn't think I knew this by memory did you.
fishy68
Tyr Fryr's Inc.
That's the ones I used on mine and they cleared the Hooker headers ok. Not a lot of clearance but it's enough not to heat them up apparently cause my trans. temp gauge runs real cool unless I'm racing in which it gets up to 160
MrDuster
Well-Known Member
Ian, just did this project on my 71 Duster w/727. Like you mentioned,
$$ was getting skinny so I went with steel tubing. 5/16 at Napa, bought 2 5ft lengths which is sufficient to run to the radiator. Post above explaining all the different types of fittings, etc is awesome...I learned the hard way through several trips to get the right connections. It's rare, but my 727 was ruined by the radiator cooling lines failing and introducing water into the tranny....this was 25+ yrs ago and a radiator swap was made to get me going...along with a BIG bill. This time as I went to hook up the tranny lines after getting the tranny rebuilt I opted for an external cooler which I mounted infront of the radiator...I put plugs in the lower radiator. The front port of the tranny is the output so I put it closest to the heat (exhaust and engine) the rear one was routed furthest from the heat...I left room to get the starter out. Don't be like me and make all the rookie mistakes...such as bending a 90 and the nut is on the wrong side...flaring an end with the nut off....bending the wrong direction...yup, I made them all! But in the end I learned how to do it and had no leaks. Almost forgot, no need to tape flared fittings...got to redo that too (use yellow HD gas tape on pipe thread into tranny only). I made a 90 out of the tranny, went around the shift linkage, left room for the starter, then ran the lines along the engine above the k frame. Used a rubber hose split open and black wire ties to insulate possible rubbing points. The braided hose sure looks nice...you could run that out of the tranny then hook onto steel to save some $$. Good luck with whatever you decide...I'm going to go read that AN JIC post again!
$$ was getting skinny so I went with steel tubing. 5/16 at Napa, bought 2 5ft lengths which is sufficient to run to the radiator. Post above explaining all the different types of fittings, etc is awesome...I learned the hard way through several trips to get the right connections. It's rare, but my 727 was ruined by the radiator cooling lines failing and introducing water into the tranny....this was 25+ yrs ago and a radiator swap was made to get me going...along with a BIG bill. This time as I went to hook up the tranny lines after getting the tranny rebuilt I opted for an external cooler which I mounted infront of the radiator...I put plugs in the lower radiator. The front port of the tranny is the output so I put it closest to the heat (exhaust and engine) the rear one was routed furthest from the heat...I left room to get the starter out. Don't be like me and make all the rookie mistakes...such as bending a 90 and the nut is on the wrong side...flaring an end with the nut off....bending the wrong direction...yup, I made them all! But in the end I learned how to do it and had no leaks. Almost forgot, no need to tape flared fittings...got to redo that too (use yellow HD gas tape on pipe thread into tranny only). I made a 90 out of the tranny, went around the shift linkage, left room for the starter, then ran the lines along the engine above the k frame. Used a rubber hose split open and black wire ties to insulate possible rubbing points. The braided hose sure looks nice...you could run that out of the tranny then hook onto steel to save some $$. Good luck with whatever you decide...I'm going to go read that AN JIC post again!
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
His web site is canlinetube.ca get the number and call he is a very smart guy ,he's been a long time Buick GSS collector who we are now converting to a Mopar guy lol . tell him Chris with the bronze fastback cuda sent you he will set you up right .-Chris
Thanks for the link .
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