Ammeter Battery overcharge

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Hey Karl, pulled ground cable at battery and tested for continuity between +ve battery post and alt case. No continuity.
Hooked up -ve cable and had continuity again from +ve to alt case.....
krazykuda said:
Try disconnecting the ground wire from the battery and try that again...

May be grounding through another curcuit that just has resistance to ground, not an open switch...
Click to expand...
 
4spdragtop said:
Hey Karl, pulled ground cable at battery and tested for continuity between +ve battery post and alt case. No continuity.
Hooked up -ve cable and had continuity again from +ve to alt case.....
Click to expand...

Then I think that you're ok and no short...
 
Ok so finally able to get back to the wiring/rewiring. Im trying to run the black and red bypass wires thru bulkhead. Im looking at the "newish" M&H under hood harness. If you look at Krazykudas wiring diagram, which is identical to my FSM, the bulkhead block "S thru Z" my wires are different colors than the ones listed in factory manual???
The plug Im talking about (S-Z) is the inner most of the 3.
In my plug, the fusible link is in socket V, while the manual has the F-link in Z??
BTW we repaired that when the alternator we tried to install fried the fusible link. Otherwise, I think the factory f-link is red.
Anyway whats to make of the mismatched wires/colors?? LIke I said its a fairly new MH harness, with only the flink as a repair and the rest all looks brand new.
If you compare my pic to the schematic Karl/Krazykuda posted you will see what I mean. Its like the tan wire and fusible link wire were switched??
I havent even got to the shitty part of removing the cluster yet:realcrazy:
Pics/drawings in a moment

Thanks all

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I went back to your beginning post. I'll assume we are still at no start.
I noticed you stated that nothing hot at switch on works. You stated hazard does work. If hot at all times ( includes hazard ) does work, do headlights work ? If yes, the ignition switch is suspect.
After the ALT' gauge there is a weld splice where the black wire branches to 3 or more connections. One is the side of the fuse box that is hot at all times. Another to headlight switch. Another to ignition switch. If that switch fails nothing beyond it will work. It's slow death could have created resistance and all of the conditions you saw during that period ( screwy charging system, poor idle, and more ).
Now about the aftermarket harness ( M-H or whoever )... A reproduction should be exactly that, Identical to OEM. ( to make it wrong is just sad ). Anything else should be called "custom" or "modified". So sure a mfgr could move the circuits around in the bulkhead connectors for whatever reason but.. only if they provided both inside and outside connectors/harnesses.
And yes the OEM fusible link was red with a yellow rubber id tag. The color of a fusible links casing helps identify it and/or its gauge, like the modern blade type fuses. Lots of sexy colors to be had today. A engineer would draw the wiring diagram with what ever wire color is feeding into that fusible link ( as if it wasn't there ), not the color of the link. In more modern drawings a symbol ( with or without the AWG notation included ) could represent a fuse or fusible link.
You also stated earlier that you had discovered the fault in this aftermarket harness and corrected it early on and you've had no electrical problems since.
I'll say this again, the bulkhead connection is not the only point of failure nor is the madelectrical bypass a cure all.
From what I've read and think I understand, I feel I would find your problem in power distribution under the dash. If not the ignition switch, in the weld splice before it. Until you park it here, that's all the help I've got.
 
Thanks Ben, I appreciate your help and understand there is only so much that can be achieved thru the net and hopefully "osmosis". It is still NO start, as I have cut ammeter red and black wires at DASH side of bulkhead. I have NOT pulled the cluster yet, thats one of the next steps. I just hope that the RED and BLACK wires I cut were the ones for the ammeter. Im on my 2nd cup of coffee and about to dig into this more.
***BUT*** looking at Schematic from PLYMOUTH FSM, it doesnt list BARRACUDA specifically, but shows VALIANT models which I was following. Comparing that schematic to another FACTORY one that I got saved to my computer shows different locations for the RED wire from Ammeter. See pics, I took one of the FSM Valiant model and one of the BARRACUDA that is a factory printout(pencil in pic)
BOTH show Red ammeter wire going to different locations in Bulkhead. Factory hardcopy shows Red ammeter wire(Circuit A1) going to "Z" hole in bulkhead.
NOW look at pic of BARRACUDA printout. It shows the Red ammeter the SAME circuit "A1", BUT it leads to "J" hole in bulkhead, located in the middle part of blukhead??
I know 67 being the 1st year of 2nd gen barracudas that there would be errors(dad n I discovered 4 years ago an updated schematic for AC as Del posted a different FSM one that he had)
Hopefully now that Ive got a decent sleep I can maybe make sense of it. LOL
It doesnt make sense that the car ran great for 4 years with no elec issues and the harness be buggered up. When I look at the 2 engine compartment M & H harness they look brand new as in UNALTERED Macgyvered etc.
See pics

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So I reinstalled the dash side bulkhead connector, and the engine side middle block, so you could see both the black and red wires from under dash coming thru the bulkhead. I havent run the red wire thru the engine side connector as thats when I discovered the descrepancies with wiring. I sure as heck hope I cut the right red wire from under dash!! LOL

In the pics you will see the red wire thru bulkhead leads to the tan wire...wtf lol fml omg

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OK also notice the upper drawing bulkhead terminals key location, a V shape shown opposite 'B' and 'C'.
Lower drawing same V shape shown opposite X and Y. One or both drawings wrong ?
This could be the root of aftermarket screw ups too. Who knows what info they followed.
Some of what I stated earlier was incorrect. I just went and looked at both unmodified OEM 67 Barracuda bulkhead connections. That V key is to the inboard side or toward middle of car. Port Z is on that inboard lower corner and the fusible link is there.
Also... a heavy gauge red wire is attached to a black fusible link w/yellow tag in port Z. So engineer should have labeled A1 as a red wire ( 12R ).
 
Yep I noticed that Ben, Lord wiring/elec is tough enough for me, but then Ma throws me a knuckleball with errors. I will add that the paper FACTORY FSM I have is a repop from Year Bun. **** quality in the sense that the binding and entire manual is falling apart.

RedFish said:
OK also notice the upper drawing bulkhead terminals key location, a V shape shown opposite 'B' and 'C'.
Lower drawing same V shape shown opposite X and Y. One or both drawings wrong ?
This could be the root of aftermarket screw ups too. Who knows what info they followed.
Some of what I stated earlier was incorrect. I just went and looked at both unmodified OEM 67 Barracuda bulkhead connections. That V key is to the inboard side or toward middle of car. Port Z is on that inboard lower corner and the fusible link is there.
Also... a heavy gauge red wire is attached to a black fusible link w/yellow tag in port Z. So engineer should have labeled A1 as a red wire ( 12R ).
Click to expand...
 
Ok double checking my disconnect of red ammeter wire under dash and splice thru bulkhead shows continuity.
To verify this I used mutimeter and was able to get probe on red wire on back of ammeter underdash and the other probe on end of red wire that runs thru bulkhead
So Im assuming I cut and spliced the correct red wire?
 
Another continuity test. MY TAN wire shows continuity to 12 gauge brown wire at starter relay that leads to starter... oh my Im glad I have a sense of humor. ..its getting tested lol
 
I'm not sure what brown wire you're looking at or for. A small brown wire on starter relay comes there from the neutral safety switch on trans. This wire doesn't pass through bulkhead at all.
A wire from ignition switch to starter relay is yellow.
Once upon a time a owner found a brown wire near ballast resistor which he thought was one of the 2 ignition switched wires. It turned out to be the washer pump wire which is also brown.
 
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Ok, mine and probably your suspicions(at least some)are correct......MY OWN STUPIDITY. After searching online for other wiring diagrams, and printing them off, I figgered out that I must have got the TAN wire and FUSIBLE LINK mixed up in their holder under the hood after starting this damned escapade. I removed them, put the tan wire(where it should be) and where the FUSIBLE LINK was supposed to be I ran the thicker gauge RED wire from under dash thru the bulkhead.
Black wire from ALT is spliced and run direct to starter relay(with new 14 gauge fusible link).
NEW RED and BLACK thicker wires from under dash are now run continuous thru bulkhead. These are connected together (temporarily with yellow butt connector) to the 16 gauge fusible link.
So it looks like the under hood wiring is done, other than replacing the yellow butt connectors with good non-insulated ones(crimp n solder)
I now need to remove cluster, disconnect red and black from ammeter and crimp and solder them together as per MAD bypass.
Thanks all for looking and chiming in, the saga continues LOL

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Ok riding the progress that I had under the hood, I thought I would try to undo red and black ammeter wires from under dash without pulling cluster. Well success!! I removed drivers side bucket seat and laid under dash prepared for a shitload of frustration loaded with a side of nervousness so I didnt break any connections. With the help of 8 ft of 1/4" ratchet extensions, a swivel and extendable magnet I was able to get the wires removed and pulled down far enough that I should be able to get them cut/crimped and soldered without too much more anquish. We can hope anyway right?? LOL
I took some pics of where I was trying to reach with the socket...working on it outside with a small LED hatlight...I know someone posted in another thread about painting the underside of the dash frame white. If I ever get the chance that will definitely happen.

Thanks all for following contributing, Im hoping to be running tomorrow.
Another question, I want to add an anftermarket volt gauge now, wondering where and how I do that??

Thanks again all, time for a couple beer wings and watching Canada in Hockey World Cup!

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A volt meter isn't wired like a amps meter. Switched hot and a ground is required.
The blue wire w/white tracer at ignition switch is the wire to tie a volt gauge into whether its replacing the ALT' gauge in the inst' panel or dangling under the dash.
 
Thanks Ben, much appreciated
RedFish said:
A volt meter isn't wired like a amps meter. Switched hot and a ground is required.
The blue wire w/white tracer at ignition switch is the wire to tie a volt gauge into whether its replacing the ALT' gauge in the inst' panel or dangling under the dash.
Click to expand...
 
I cry a little when people take out their ammeters.
It's like taking out your center inside rear view mirror, and relying on a digital readout to tell you how far the next car is behind you.

Not nearly as much, or enough information.
You can have a reaalllly bad short for quite a while somewhere out in the body, and have a fire long before you notice a voltage sag especially while driving.
If that situation occurs with an ammeter, you will see a big discharge and be able to take immediate shutdown action.
Happened to me on July 4th.
Was only a 10 min. delay, not a ruined day.
 
Darthomas said:
I cry a little when people take out their ammeters.
It's like taking out your center inside rear view mirror, and relying on a digital readout to tell you how far the next car is behind you. Not nearly as much, or enough information.
You can have a reaalllly bad short for quite a while somewhere out in the body, and have a fire long before you notice a voltage sag especially while driving.
If that situation occurs with an ammeter, you will see a big discharge and be able to take immediate shutdown action.
Happened to me on July 4th.
Was only a 10 min. delay, not a ruined day.
Click to expand...

My guess is you were just lucky enough to be looking at that gauge at the right moment.
Others can state a strong case for warning lamps, bells, and whistles. Gauges don't beg attention.
I've already stated why I replaced my amp gauge with a volts gauge.
As for the madelectrical bypass/mod, After one gets it done they just might find they haven't fixed a damn thing. Possibly made matters worse by moving the next point of failure to inside the cabin. That's the "mad" in madelectrical. LOL Opinions, everybody's got 1.
 
I guess you coulda chimed in when I started this thread almost a month ago if its such a bad idea??
I thought the consensus was that its an upgrade?
Right or wrong I got it out for a 4 hour rip today. So far so good.
Darthomas said:
I cry a little when people take out their ammeters.
It's like taking out your center inside rear view mirror, and relying on a digital readout to tell you how far the next car is behind you.

Not nearly as much, or enough information.
You can have a reaalllly bad short for quite a while somewhere out in the body, and have a fire long before you notice a voltage sag especially while driving.
If that situation occurs with an ammeter, you will see a big discharge and be able to take immediate shutdown action.
Happened to me on July 4th.
Was only a 10 min. delay, not a ruined day.
Click to expand...
 
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4spdragtop said:
I guess you coulda chimed in when I started this thread almost a month ago if its such a bad idea??
I thought the consensus was that its an upgrade?
Right or wrong I got it out for a 4 hour rip today. So far so good.
Click to expand...
I can't keep up with every thread.
And I trust my oil "idiot light", but. I DID see a huge discharge from a pinched wire, got everyone out of the backseat and out before anything was damaged or had a fire. The ammeter was pegged @ full discharge.
Not here to hate, but advise as someone who's lived with these cars as daily drivers for 40 years.
 
I had Ben modify my AMP gauge to a volt gauge several years ago( thanks again for the awesome work), it looks stock, and performs flawlessly, all the while keeping the stock gauge look. If you do a search here Ammeter to Voltmeter...who does it?
there are some great replacement jobs.
 
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