Back space help please!!

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All of the extra width of the 8" wheel is to the inside, compared to the 7" wheel.
So, the outside fender clearance should be identical between the 7 and 8, with more room to the inside to the spring with the seven.... assuming the same size tire.
So, if the tire on the eight fits, same size tire on the seven will also fit.
nope, you need to look at the wheel mount face. the 8" (bead seat to bead seat width, 9" overall width), 4.5 backspace wheel in 0 offset.
the 7" (bead seat to bead seat, 8" overall width) with 3.5" backspace is -1/2" offset (0 offset would be 4" BS). that will push the outside of the tire outboard 1/2" give or take.
 
All of the extra width of the 8" wheel is to the inside, compared to the 7" wheel.
So, the outside fender clearance should be identical between the 7 and 8, with more room to the inside to the spring with the seven.... assuming the same size tire.
So, if the tire on the eight fits, same size tire on the seven will also fit.

Yeah the outer edge of the wheel didn't move (front space on both is the same at 4.5") but the centerline of the wheel moves. You think that moving the center line of the wheel a 1/2" means that the tire will hang over the lip of the rim the same? The center of the tire is moving a 1/2", that tire will overhang the wheel more on the 7" than it will on the 8". It might not be a full 1/2" because of the tire being squeezed a bit more on the rim, but it will absolutely not be the same as with the 8" wheel, the tire bulge on the outside will be significantly more.

Do they even make a 7 with 3.5?

Lots of them. Probably at least as common as a 15x7 with a 4" backspace. And more common than a more useful backspace for a Mopar, like a 15x7 with a 4.25" backspace.
 
confusing but I'll take your word for it. If that's the case , they won't fit and I won't grab them. Thank you. Just trying to figure out where the other half inch disappeared to lol
I had to think about it more and edited my response. The outside edge of the wheel will be in the same location with either wheel. The tire will just fit a little differently on the new wheel, which may or may not cause a clearance issue.
 
I had to think about it more and edited my response. The outside edge of the wheel will be in the same location with either wheel. The tire will just fit a little differently on the new wheel, which may or may not cause a clearance issue.

Yeah I wouldn't make that swap unless I had at least an extra 3/8" to lose to the quarters. Especially with 255/60/15's the section width is gonna flex a lot and the tread width isn't going to change much if any between those two wheels.
 
I had to think about it more and edited my response. The outside edge of the wheel will be in the same location with either wheel. The tire will just fit a little differently on the new wheel, which may or may not cause a clearance issue.

no, it won't, because were the wheel mounts to the car is in a different spot on the wheel. one mounts at the centerline of the wheel, the other is 1/2" inboard

drawing poorly in ascii the cross section:

8" wheel, 0 offset

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WT TW
TT TT
TT TT
TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

7" wheel, negative offset

TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
TT TT
TT TT
WT TW
WWWWWWWW
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WT TW
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aligning the wheel mount face (where it attaches to the car), you see the outer sidewall of the tire is pushed out farther, even with the same "frontspace".


look at it this way. a 255 tire is 10" wide. on a 4.5" backspace, 8" wheel (0 offset), 5" of the tire is to the inside of the wheel mount face, 5" to the outside. on a 3.5" backspace, 7" wheel (-1/2" offset), 4.5" of the tire is to the inside of the wheel mount space, BUT 5.5" IS TO THE OUTSIDE

this is why looking at offset, rather than backspacing makes figuring out tire fitment so much easier from a wheelwell positioning standpoint..... a 5" wide 0 offset wheel will put the tire in the same spot as a 7" 0 offset wheel as a 10" 0 offset wheel, but the backspacing on those 3 widths are 3", 4" and 5.5" respectively.
 
dammit, the board screws up my formatting...here's a screencap in the edit mode

2025-04-15_14-55-08.jpg
 
Yeah the outer edge of the wheel didn't move (front space on both is the same at 4.5") but the centerline of the wheel moves. You think that moving the center line of the wheel a 1/2" means that the tire will hang over the lip of the rim the same? The center of the tire is moving a 1/2", that tire will overhang the wheel more on the 7" than it will on the 8". It might not be a full 1/2" because of the tire being squeezed a bit more on the rim, but it will absolutely not be the same as with the 8" wheel, the tire bulge on the outside will be significantly more.



Lots of them. Probably at least as common as a 15x7 with a 4" backspace. And more common than a more useful backspace for a Mopar, like a 15x7 with a 4.25" backspace.
I asked what kind of wheel but he didn't answer. He was wanting auto drags. I don't see them listed in 3.5 bs
 
no, it won't, because were the wheel mounts to the car is in a different spot on the wheel. one mounts at the centerline of the wheel, the other is 1/2" inboard

drawing poorly in ascii the cross section:

8" wheel, 0 offset

TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
TT TT
TT TT
WT TW
WWWWWWWWW
W
W
W
W
W
WWWWWWWWW
WT TW
TT TT
TT TT
TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

7" wheel, negative offset

TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
TT TT
TT TT
WT TW
WWWWWWWW
W
W
W
W
W
WWWWWWWW
WT TW
TT TT
TT TT
TTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

aligning the wheel mount face (where it attaches to the car), you see the outer sidewall of the tire is pushed out farther, even with the same "frontspace".


look at it this way. a 255 tire is 10" wide. on a 4.5" backspace, 8" wheel (0 offset), 5" of the tire is to the inside of the wheel mount face, 5" to the outside. on a 3.5" backspace, 7" wheel (-1/2" offset), 4.5" of the tire is to the inside of the wheel mount space, BUT 5.5" IS TO THE OUTSIDE

this is why looking at offset, rather than backspacing makes figuring out tire fitment so much easier from a wheelwell positioning standpoint..... a 5" wide 0 offset wheel will put the tire in the same spot as a 7" 0 offset wheel as a 10" 0 offset wheel, but the backspacing on those 3 widths are 3", 4" and 5.5" respectively.
The outer surface of the wheel will be in the same location. If you subtract an inch of backspace, you move the wheel out an inch. Then remove an inch of width (going from 8" to 7") on the outside (to keep the bs at 3.5"), won't the outside surface land at the original spot?

The tire will just be centered slightly outward. If the OP is tight on space with the current combo, making the switch may cause rubbing on the outer wheel arch. He's gonna have to make that call.
 
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Yeah the outer edge of the wheel didn't move (front space on both is the same at 4.5") but the centerline of the wheel moves. You think that moving the center line of the wheel a 1/2" means that the tire will hang over the lip of the rim the same? The center of the tire is moving a 1/2", that tire will overhang the wheel more on the 7" than it will on the 8". It might not be a full 1/2" because of the tire being squeezed a bit more on the rim, but it will absolutely not be the same as with the 8" wheel, the tire bulge on the outside will be significantly more.



Lots of them. Probably at least as common as a 15x7 with a 4" backspace. And more common than a more useful backspace for a Mopar, like a 15x7 with a 4.25" backspace.
So you're saying a fixed size tire will bulge MORE (section width!) on a seven inch rim, than an eight?
I disagree.
Let's exaggerate. Which will have a greater section width ? A 255 on a six inch rim, or on a ten?
 
So you're saying a fixed size tire will bulge MORE (section width!) on a seven inch rim, than an eight?
I disagree.
Let's exaggerate. Which will have a greater section width ? A 255 on a six inch rim, or on a ten?
He may mean the bulge will be different based on the slightly different tire center location. Here's a quick visualization from an online calculator. You'll notice the outer tire bulge sticks out further even though the outer surface of the wheel in the same location and it's mounted on a narrower wheel.

1744746642274.png
 
The outer surface of the wheel will be in the same location. If you subtract an inch of backspace, you move the wheel out an inch. Then remove an inch of width (going from 8" to 7") on the outside (to keep the bs at 3.5"), won't the outside surface land at the original spot?

The tire will just be centered slightly outward. If the OP is tight on space with the current combo, making the switch may cause rubbing on the outer wheel arch. He's gonna have to make that call.


"frontspace" the same doesn't matter.


1) the tire centers side to side on the rim.
2) the rim mounts to the car based on the position of the wheel mount face.
3) offset of the wheel mount face to wheel centerline will determine clearance.

the interface between the wheel and the car moved inboard 1/2" relative to the centerline of the wheel, which will shift the entire wheel/tire assembly outboard 1/2". the tire still centers on the rim.

lets look at this at the extreme.

Our current 8" rim (9" overall width) with 4.5" backspace (4.5" "frontspace") is 0 offset. wheel mount face aligns with the wheel center, so a 12" tire on the rim, 6" inboard, 6" outboard. when mounted on the car

4" wide rim (5" overall width) with -2" offset has .5" backspace, 4.5" "frontspace", the same as our 8" wheel. ignoring the bulge difference for the rim width, since the 12" tire centers on the RIM, not the WHEEL MOUNT FACE, you end up with 4" of the tire inboard, 8" outboard when mounted on the car.

conversely, a 11" wide rim (12" overall) with +1.5" offset (7.5" backspace) also has 4.5" "frontspace", same as our 8" wide rim. the same 12" tire on this rim is 7.5" inboard, 4.5" outboard when mounted on the car.

the concept isn't that hard, especially when you convert backspace to offset. essentially if you want to change rim width +/- a bit (say going from a 7" to and 8", or an 8" to a 10"), keep the offset the same and the tire will be in basically the same place in the wheelwell as the old wheel
 
So you're saying a fixed size tire will bulge MORE (section width!) on a seven inch rim, than an eight?
I disagree.
Let's exaggerate. Which will have a greater section width ? A 255 on a six inch rim, or on a ten?

Section width is measured at the widest point of the tire when it's mounted on the rim, so, it will not always be in the same place on the sidewall.

A 255 is listed as having an 8.5" tread width and a 10.2" section width when mounted on a 15x7.5". Now, those numbers can and will change on different width rims, but let's start there and consider your example.

On a 15x6", which is only 7" wide outside to outside, the 255 will be substantially squeezed. So, the unloaded tire height is actually going to increase because it will bow up in the middle. The tread width will decrease, because it's going to be forced to be more round. And the section will likely not be 10.2". But where is the widest part of the section width going to be? It's going to be closer to the tread, because the tread wants to resist that bending. So the widest part is going to be higher, and that is going to be a bigger issue for fender clearance unless you're running a 4x4. This is a Dart, so, the tire will absolutely be above the quarter lip and the higher you go the less clearance you have.

This tire here is on a narrower than recommended wheel, you can see the widest part of the section is pretty close the tread. This is a fairly low profile tire, so, it will look different on a 255/60/15

ssrwheeltires.jpg



On a 15x10", the 255 will be substantially stretched. That rim is actually 11" wide at the outside lip, so, the section width of 10.2" is going to be stretched out wider. But where is it going to be the widest? Right above the edge of the rim. There will be no nice round sidewall bulge, the tire will slope in from the lip of the rim back to the 8.5" tread width.

This tire is stretched onto too wide of a rim. But you can see the widest part of the section is right above the lip of the rim, it starts sloping in as soon as it's past the reinforced edge of the tire.
2870b3eb.jpg


So now imagine the lip of both wheels above is in the same place. Do you think the clearance to the quarter changed?

Most tire calculators get section width wrong, which is why the calculator I linked above says that the tire will stick out an extra 1/2". It's just using the manufacturer specs and moving them relative to the centerline of the wheel, it's not evaluating how much the tire will be squeezed or stretched, or where the widest part will be.

For the OP, the 255's are measured on a 15x7.5 and have a 10.2" section. A 15x8" isn't much of a change, the section width will be very close to 10.2". And really the 15x7" isn't that different from the measuring rim either, so the section will likely still be fairly close to 10.2" But I'd be willing to bet that measurement for section width will not be in the same location, and the narrower rim will put it higher up the sidewall, which is not beneficial for clearance on these cars.
 
Section width is measured at the widest point of the tire when it's mounted on the rim, so, it will not always be in the same place on the sidewall.

A 255 is listed as having an 8.5" tread width and a 10.2" section width when mounted on a 15x7.5". Now, those numbers can and will change on different width rims, but let's start there and consider your example.

On a 15x6", which is only 7" wide outside to outside, the 255 will be substantially squeezed. So, the unloaded tire height is actually going to increase because it will bow up in the middle. The tread width will decrease, because it's going to be forced to be more round. And the section will likely not be 10.2". But where is the widest part of the section width going to be? It's going to be closer to the tread, because the tread wants to resist that bending. So the widest part is going to be higher, and that is going to be a bigger issue for fender clearance unless you're running a 4x4. This is a Dart, so, the tire will absolutely be above the quarter lip and the higher you go the less clearance you have.

This tire here is on a narrower than recommended wheel, you can see the widest part of the section is pretty close the tread. This is a fairly low profile tire, so, it will look different on a 255/60/15

View attachment 1716393139


On a 15x10", the 255 will be substantially stretched. That rim is actually 11" wide at the outside lip, so, the section width of 10.2" is going to be stretched out wider. But where is it going to be the widest? Right above the edge of the rim. There will be no nice round sidewall bulge, the tire will slope in from the lip of the rim back to the 8.5" tread width.

This tire is stretched onto too wide of a rim. But you can see the widest part of the section is right above the lip of the rim, it starts sloping in as soon as it's past the reinforced edge of the tire.
View attachment 1716393144

So now imagine the lip of both wheels above is in the same place. Do you think the clearance to the quarter changed?

Most tire calculators get section width wrong, which is why the calculator I linked above says that the tire will stick out an extra 1/2". It's just using the manufacturer specs and moving them relative to the centerline of the wheel, it's not evaluating how much the tire will be squeezed or stretched, or where the widest part will be.

For the OP, the 255's are measured on a 15x7.5 and have a 10.2" section. A 15x8" isn't much of a change, the section width will be very close to 10.2". And really the 15x7" isn't that different from the measuring rim either, so the section will likely still be fairly close to 10.2" But I'd be willing to bet that measurement for section width will not be in the same location, and the narrower rim will put it higher up the sidewall, which is not beneficial for clearance on these cars.
Okay, fine. So put one size smaller tire on the skinnier rim, AS HE PROBABLY SHOULD!
 
Thank you everyone but This post became way more technical than I expected. I think I'm more confused than before LOL .
 
Curious as to what 15 x 7 wheel your contemplating? Is the change due to mere aesthetics? Don't like the black steelie look?
I have always liked the auto drags on A bodys and I have a set of skinnies for the fronts which I have run with a plain steel wheel in the rear. I like the steels/caps look but figured it would be cool to have a complete set of auto drags as well.
 
It's a B body Dana cut to A body specs , hence the 4.5 in bolt pattern.
OK, so I have an 8.75 with B-body backing plates and aftermarket axles.

My combination:
15x7 with a 5 inch back space and a P235/70R15.
CalTracs with 2 inch wide mono leafs.
Have run 15x8 Convo Pro with 4.75 back space and 2.5 inch wide Super Stock springs.
Did test fit a 15X7 with 4.25 back space and P255/60R15 = too close to stock outer wheel lips.


I think it's important to put the tire as close to the spring leaf as possible on these cars. The quarter panel/wheel lip is where you need clearance due to body roll. The leaf spring pretty much always remains in the same place.
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I agree with toolman. On a Dart is less room than on the open wheel house on a Duster.
A 75 or 70 series tire will give more room but may not meet what you want in the looks department.
At 3.5 backspace the .75 may mean a tight or rubbing at the outer wheel house.
Most of the factory Mopar 15x7'' have the 4.25 backspace.
Now as you may know no 2 Mopars are the same as tolerances vary side to side.
Example is 2 B body cars, 63 and a 65, swapping wheel tire found no rubbing on the 65 but rubbing on the passenger side of the 63.
Sounds like the rearend perches are not centered. I have seen that before.
 
Thank you everyone but This post became way more technical than I expected. I think I'm more confused than before LOL .

The take home should be that a 15x7" with a 3.5" backspace on an A-body 8 3/4 is pushing your luck, especially with a 255. Typically, with a large bolt pattern A-body 8 3/4 in a Dart with the stock spring locations the better bet is a 15x7 with a 4" to 4.25" backspace.

Sounds like the rearend perches are not centered. I have seen that before.

Far more likely that the quarters aren't in the same place. The body tolerances are much looser than the suspension and chassis tolerances. Not saying the perches can't be off, but, it's FAR more likely the perches are where they're supposed to be and the body is not the same. Pretty common even on the same car, when one wheel house has more room than the other.
 
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The take home should be that a 15x7" with a 3.5" backspace on an A-body 8 3/4 is pushing your luck, especially with a 255. Typically, with a large bolt pattern A-body 8 3/4 in a Dart with the stock spring locations the better bet is a 15x7 with a 4" to 4.25" backspace.



Far more likely that the quarters aren't in the same place. The body tolerances are much looser than the suspension and chassis tolerances. Not saying the perches can't be off, but, it's FAR more likely the perches are where they're supposed to be and the body is not the same. Pretty common even on the same car, when one wheel house has more room than the other.
It's a B body Dana cut to A body specs , so it could be slightly off. I passed on the wheels , keeping the steelies and dog dish caps. If it ain't broke , don't fix it lol.
 

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