best distributor for the buck

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Guys, I went a different route for a connector to hook to the distributor side of the HEI module. I ordered the cheapest GM distributor pickup coil RockAuto listed. It's for a 1974 Camaro 350 AdvanTech 9B1. I unwrapped a turn and a half of tape from the coil and the connector and wires came off in my hand, seems the wires are just stuck in between layers of tape around the coil. How's that for chinese quality?
 
Guys, I went a different route for a connector to hook to the distributor side of the HEI module. I ordered the cheapest GM distributor pickup coil RockAuto listed. It's for a 1974 Camaro 350 AdvanTech 9B1. I unwrapped a turn and a half of tape from the coil and the connector and wires came off in my hand, seems the wires are just stuck in between layers of tape around the coil. How's that for chinese quality?

When someone orders the distributor from us to go with the HEI kit I rewire the distributor with the HEI connector on the end and eliminate any pigtail type plug completely.
Seen those pigtail connectors drop the connection from heat expansion.
 
No e core blocky coil for mine i went with the pertronics oil filled coil i listed on my schematic as it looks stock, and has the same resistance on the primary side as a stock GM E coil.

I have been told though that the GM stock E coil is fine up to i think 1998. Not sure though.
 
No e core blocky coil for mine ...

The E-core coil from a Magnum engine should work and will keep you Mopar (important to many here). It bolts on the front of the head in Magnums (recall), but could mount anywhere. At the JY, also snip off the mating connector. The silicone plug wires for a Magnum are nice since labelled "1", "2", ..., "coil" and a clean set only costs 50c/wire at my PickNPull. The Magnum distributor has male spark terminals, so the wires should plug directly to an HEI distributor.
 
This question comes up every so often. I keep adding them to my collection for the day when I need it. I like Matt's overview which provides the historical perspective.

Next question is, what's the most cost effective way to add a rev limiter?
To make it more specific, start with the factory style dizzy and GM HEI.

Seems to me a rev limiter should be part of any modern build.

Pentronix sells a hei module with an adjustable rev limiter for $70
 
I'am just gonna say,theres a reason hei modules need to be mounted on a heat sink,(piece of aluminium or such). They have built in'ballast resistors'.
 
HEI does not have built in ballast resistor. It uses the coil drive transistor in the "active mode" to limit current. Yes, it does heat the transistor. The active mode limit happens at low engine speeds. At medium speeds and above, the coil charge time is precisely controlled to limit current. The transistor is fully "on", to charge the coil right before the ignition event. The heat generated is minimal in that mode. This is an analog predictive mechanism that is self adjusting. It is more energy efficient that a ballast resistor without "dwell control", used in Mopar box. Less coil heating in HEI ignitions, when operated above low engine speeds.

On the waveform the current starts at zero and builds to about 5.4A in 3.1 ms. The current then flat tops for about 2 ms, and the ignition occurs. At higher speeds the flat top part is minimized, saving energy, and reducing heat in the transistor and coil. That is done by starting the charge 2 ms later. At lower speeds the active current limit provides extra time for when the engine speed varies quickly, like when letting out a clutch when starting out. The predictive mechanism fails to work well with varying speeds, because the 3.1 ms is small compared to the time between ignition events at low speeds.
 

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So Kit,

Whats your take on a mopar dizzy being run with an HEI module?
Better than a mopar module, or not so much?

Enquiring minds would like to know.

Remember if you are a fan of HEI firing your mopar, some people here think you may need billybob teeth and a mullet.

Matt
 
I am a Mopar guy, really never got into GM, but I am an honest engineer, I look at the facts.

You have to remember the HEI is a mid 70's design, the Mopar module a few years earlier. The HEI design is more robust. Often engineers when designing a competitive product to catch up, they improve on the design. They then went overboard, with coil in cap and large plug gap.

The Mopar VR distributor has its share of problems. The reluctor is a powdered iron part, it lacks precision. It has small radius, and small teeth. The distributor uses bushings. The rotor hat fits loosely on the reduced 5/16" shaft. The advance plate, swings an arc, and has rough movement. I can go on and on .... The greatest problem from an electrical standpoint is the variation in timing from cylinder to cylinder. This is mainly due to run out, and the reluctor picking up magnitization. I know this because I have evaluated a few distributors, captured timing trigger signals and evaluated the timings. Things can be improved, but it is a bit like polishing a turd.

Most do not know the difference. How many use a degree wheel and timing light on each cylinder to measure individual timings? How many notice a periodic waver in engine sound? That can also happen with mismatched compression, intake and exhaust flows. Most engines ping first on one cylinder, that has much to due about timing variations.

A GM distributor has a different VR sensor assembly with 8 teeth, 8 pickup poles, one coil. There is a larger change in reluctance, because all teeth come together. It also is an improvment, eliminating run out related errors.

In the motion control industry, VR sensing is for speed measurement, not typically used for position measurement. I like optical or Hall vane sensors. They are zero speed, so it is easy to do static timing measurements. If you want the best, consider crank triggered, with cam sync signal and coil on plug, as part of an engine management system.
 
Kit,

I guess my question to you wasnt clear. However as an electrical engineer, your synopsis is very insightful of the drawbacks in the chrysler distributor triggering mechanism, and the GM improvements to theirs.

What i was wanting to know was, if you had no choice but to use a mopar electronic distributer for your project, but had the choice between a GM 4 pin module, or a mopar module to fire your mopar distributor, which of the 2 modules would you use, and why?

Thanks
Matt
 
To add to what Kit explained, the cheapest way to crank-triggered distributor-less ignition is to install a 36-1 trigger-wheel and Ford EDIS spark driver. That is very common among Mega-squirters. Biggest kink is you also need a "spark computer" to adjust spark advance (based on rpm & MAP). Many use Megasquirt or Megajolt, though I hope to get a Holley Commander 950 to serve.

Ford uses a VR sensor to pickup the teeth, which I put on my 65 Dart 273, along with a custom crank wheel (not using yet), but I also made a bracket for a Mopar Hall-effect pickup (posted photos). I saw a youtube video where a guy put EDIS on a slant six engine. On those, it is harder to mount the VR sensor.

That is all for play. Most here are well-served by a distributor and electronic module, either Mopar or HEI, with HEI easier to retrofit on points engines and slightly better performing. Magnum engines still had distributors until their ~2000 end (I think), though a crank pickup (Hall-effect type). Electronic spark timing in Mopars goes way back. My 1982 Dodge Aries had an "Electronic Spark Computer", essentially the same box as the "Lean Burn" system on 1980's V-8's.

Re pickups, VR is just a coil w/ magnet. It gives a transient, spiky signal, and only while the teeth are moving. That is the pickup in 1970's Mopar distributors. In the 1980's, Mopar changed to better Hall-effect pickups which are electronic magnetic sensors. They give a clean 5V square-wave signal and the signal is there even if the teeth aren't spinning. That helps when the engine is cranking really slow (low battery). In the 1980's, they were in a distributor pickup and in the 1990's moved to a crank pickup.
 
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