big block old school?????
- Thread starter 0lddart
- Start date
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mcodecuda
Senior Member
I've seen this set up in a '64 B-body and they had to cut out the inner fender to make room for where the carbs go so I'd measure real good ang go from there.
thanson_mopar
Well-Known Member
just curious, how much are cross ram engines going for? They seem to be pretty rare, at least the intake setups are, sure look cool though.
Jim Lusk
Well-Known Member
How bad is the 300? or is it just not there?
The intake setup, if complete, is worth up to $2k (maybe more if it the short longs).
The intake setup, if complete, is worth up to $2k (maybe more if it the short longs).
demon seed
The Original Demon Seed
Make sure you get all the carb linkages cuss finding them is a ***** and bloody expensive.
Terry
Terry
the car (1961ish 300c 2 door) is in lower arkansas shape ( read you could fart on the thing and it would disintagrate from MASSIVE RUST.... the drivetrain is in good shape though....) and i was wondering if any one has any pic of one installed cause the motor is about 80 miles away from me (its in las cruces nm) but the guy is going to check the compression for me but i know that a 383 is a squeeze in these early darts so im pretty sure im grabbing the combo no matter what but i would like to put it in the dart if it is feasable i dont mind cutting a couple of holes i have a spare hood but i am not to sure about choping the crud out of my inners.....
Jim Lusk
Well-Known Member
Make sure the car is that bad as that's a $75k or so car restored.
One thing for certain, if you get it for the right money it could be sold to help fund other parts for your car.
One thing for certain, if you get it for the right money it could be sold to help fund other parts for your car.
Jim Lusk
Well-Known Member
One more thing, there are some oddball things about the 59-61 (or a little later) big blocks. The heads do not have cast-in rocker shaft pedestals and have only four rocker cover bolts. There may be some other oddities, too.
mean318
Well-Known Member
dude you might not even need to open the hood to adjust your carbs!:-D
so i have done some research and work on this motor before buying it....
three ???
1. most old shops put dots on the bottom of the block if its been rebuilt right cause this thing has 4 dots punched into it( so to me that means it is AL LEAST .040 over right??)
2. compression is f'ed its about 70psi a pop EXCEPT cyl 1 which is at 35psi
block was receantly painted i was hoping rebuilt but not looking like it so is it a pain to get rebuild parts for these
3.it is missing valley pan??? i can see the lifters under the intake(which has 2 holley 350cfm carbs and adapters???????? so is this going to be worth getting still
so can some one ball park me a price on if it is rebuildable about how much??
thanks guys
three ???
1. most old shops put dots on the bottom of the block if its been rebuilt right cause this thing has 4 dots punched into it( so to me that means it is AL LEAST .040 over right??)
2. compression is f'ed its about 70psi a pop EXCEPT cyl 1 which is at 35psi
block was receantly painted i was hoping rebuilt but not looking like it so is it a pain to get rebuild parts for these
3.it is missing valley pan??? i can see the lifters under the intake(which has 2 holley 350cfm carbs and adapters???????? so is this going to be worth getting still
so can some one ball park me a price on if it is rebuildable about how much??
thanks guys
1.No real way to know if it has been rebuilt without opening it up. I don't know of any "industry standard" way of marking a rebuilt engine. Every machine shop seems to do it different, at least around here.
2. It depends on how the compression was checked, and how long the engine was sitting. With a good, strong battery, all of the plugs out, and the throttle plates held wide open, yes those are poor numbers. Try a shot (1 or 2 squirts from an oil can) of light oil in each cylinder, crank for 30 seconds, apply more oil, repeat a few times. If compression keeps improving, you may just have stuck rings from it sitting.
413 pistons are very expensive and can be hard to find. It might be much more economical to find a 440 to build if it comes to a rebuild. That long ram should fit a 440 just fine.
3. The missing valley pan should not be a big deal, IF it is not rusty under there. A 440 valley pan should fit. A 440 is basically a 413 with a bigger bore, and a few other minor differences.
Holley carbs are not correct for that application, I am fairly sure there should be 2 carter carbs on there. The wrong carbs will greatly diminish the value of the package, possibly by as much as half or more.
Now, for my opinions.
The 413 is a really cool engine that is not seen much anymore. That being said, because you don't see them anymore 413 specific parts are expensive. You can fit a 440 anywhere a 413 will. With the cost difference in parts, building a 440 over a 413 is like getting paid to have the extra 27cid.
Of all that you are looking at, the long ram would be the most valuable part, if it were all there and all correctly date coded. With the wrong carbs, probably wrong aircleaners, and wrong linkage probably, the only "valuable" part would be the manifolds themselves. Original exhaust manifolds would be worth something too.
The second most valuable part would be the big block PB727. These are getting really hard to find. In rebuildable condition, it could even be worth more then the bare manifolds.
The 413 itself would be hard to sell unless you found someone needing one with that date code.
For me it would really depend on price, and how bad I wanted a long ram.
You can check eBag for going prices on this stuff.
2. It depends on how the compression was checked, and how long the engine was sitting. With a good, strong battery, all of the plugs out, and the throttle plates held wide open, yes those are poor numbers. Try a shot (1 or 2 squirts from an oil can) of light oil in each cylinder, crank for 30 seconds, apply more oil, repeat a few times. If compression keeps improving, you may just have stuck rings from it sitting.
413 pistons are very expensive and can be hard to find. It might be much more economical to find a 440 to build if it comes to a rebuild. That long ram should fit a 440 just fine.
3. The missing valley pan should not be a big deal, IF it is not rusty under there. A 440 valley pan should fit. A 440 is basically a 413 with a bigger bore, and a few other minor differences.
Holley carbs are not correct for that application, I am fairly sure there should be 2 carter carbs on there. The wrong carbs will greatly diminish the value of the package, possibly by as much as half or more.
Now, for my opinions.
The 413 is a really cool engine that is not seen much anymore. That being said, because you don't see them anymore 413 specific parts are expensive. You can fit a 440 anywhere a 413 will. With the cost difference in parts, building a 440 over a 413 is like getting paid to have the extra 27cid.
Of all that you are looking at, the long ram would be the most valuable part, if it were all there and all correctly date coded. With the wrong carbs, probably wrong aircleaners, and wrong linkage probably, the only "valuable" part would be the manifolds themselves. Original exhaust manifolds would be worth something too.
The second most valuable part would be the big block PB727. These are getting really hard to find. In rebuildable condition, it could even be worth more then the bare manifolds.
The 413 itself would be hard to sell unless you found someone needing one with that date code.
For me it would really depend on price, and how bad I wanted a long ram.
You can check eBag for going prices on this stuff.
Jim Lusk
Well-Known Member
What's the guy want for it?
joe440
Well-Known Member
im putting the long rams in my 68 dart, but im going with a 440 and made our own linkage. the link to my car is in my signature if you want to check out the set up. also if you do get this, http://www.jcauto.com/ is a great place for info or parts on these cross rams, its all the guy does
tophat---- i oiled it before i did the test 
so im guessing that means its shot.....) and i guessed the carbs were wrong they look like holley 350s and they have some cheap adapters on them...... and i think im going to see about just picking up the manifolds and trans from him cause the car its in is trash(lots of rust) and now i know the engine is trashed.... so fingers crossed im waiting for him to call me back......
jim lets just say a VERY good price on the whole car less than $1000
so im guessing that means its shot.....) and i guessed the carbs were wrong they look like holley 350s and they have some cheap adapters on them...... and i think im going to see about just picking up the manifolds and trans from him cause the car its in is trash(lots of rust) and now i know the engine is trashed.... so fingers crossed im waiting for him to call me back......jim lets just say a VERY good price on the whole car less than $1000
joe440
Well-Known Member
olddart, i just saw these and thought of you, if you dont want to deal with the entire car and just want intakes maybe you could shoot this guy an email and see what he wants for them. i dont know what kind are on the car your talking about, such as if the runners run all the way down together or start halfway like these. i learned on here that the half way runners make power to a higher rpm than the full length ones,http://worcester.craigslist.org/pts/1097412147.html
Jim Lusk
Well-Known Member
Olddart, if the whole car is under $1k grab the whole and sell parts. A 300-G will have a 150mph speedometer (came in 60-62 300 letter cars only) and lots of other letter-car specific parts. You could very well come out money ahead. 61s should be the long long rams.
all the 440 parts fit on the 413 ,the heads don't flow as well as the 440s. as far as the crossrams, there's sure is the wow factor when the hood pops open.
but i don't think there's enough clearence over the fenders with the long rams .
but i don't think there's enough clearence over the fenders with the long rams .
sorry i took a few days but i talked to him yesterday at like 7pm (i worked truck 8pm-5am) but he told me some dude in texas is offering 3k for this thing and told me if i want it he needs 3500 by friday:sad7::sad7:](*,)i think he is full of **** but i guess ill wait and see i really hope he is bluffing and doesnt sell it out from me
bama-a-body
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i agree with top...... but i had one in a 64 chrysler that would lay down 2 32feet long black marks when she took second gear back in my street racing days ( mid eighty's) that car ate alot of chebbys
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